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On Mon, 24 Apr 2017 02:58:49 +0100, The Natural
Philosopher
wrote:
On 23/04/17 21:47, Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article ,
Bod writes:
From what I've read and heard, most Labour voters ARE
like
sheep.
I
hear it all of the time "I vote labour because all my
family
have
always
voted for Labour".
I think there's been a lot of truth in that, but a lot
of
people
who had always voted Labour for decades have abandoned
the
party
in last couple of years for two different reasons,
Brexit,
and
the
party's recent move towards the far left (popular with
Labour
members, but less so with the bulk of voters they need
to
attract).
Both Conservative and Labour voters were split on
Brexit -
it
wasn't a hard left/right issue. Now the Conservatives
have
come
out heavily for Brexit, they've pulled in lots of Labour
Brexiters,
and I think they'll pull in all 5M UKIP voters (UKIP
will
be
dead
in 8 weeks). Conservatives will lose some Remainers to
Lib/Dems,
but
that will be small compared with their gains from Labour
and
UKIP.
I think the most significant thing historically will be
the
number
of traditional left wing voters who've moved well to the
right
just
to ensure Brexit goes through. They'll probably move
back
a
few
years after Brexit, but for now, they regard Brexit as
more
important
than left/right politics.
Labour hasn't been a party of the working class - the
white
working
class for two decades or more. Not since Thatcher really.
Its the party of the nouveau rich middle class, you know
'me
grandad
were a milkman but I am a sound engineer at the beeb, and
own
me
own
house' sort.
Working class are way right of Labour.
You mean way left.
Nope, **** all of the working class is into the
sort of Trotskyite **** that Corbyn and co are.
That's why so many of them kept putting Maggie in.
Every working class person I know does not vote Tory (right
wing).
Then you need to get out more.
Why would a poor person not want handouts?
Even the Torys do handouts.
They continually reduce them as much as they can get away with.
Bull****. And they jacked up the minimum wage much more than
Labour
did.
It's on a very slow rise, barely over inflation.
That's a lie with the most recent change.
That's what I thought until I looked it up. It's hardly gone up at
all.
That's bull****. Its gone up a lot more than Labour did.
And it's spread over several years.
It always is.
It's negligible.
Bull****.
State how much you think it's risen. It's only a quid or two.
Still a lot more than Labour did.
Labour are stupid.
All politicians are stupid.
Just enough to appease the chav masses.
They don't vote tory anyway.
Ok, the ones who are slightly better off than that, vote Tory, but
still
care for their chav relations.
Hardly any of the chav masses bother to vote at all.
Cite.
Look at the voting stats where the chav masses 'live'
They are evenly scattered,
Like hell they are.
I've looked on the internet, they are everywhere.
But not EVENLY SCATTERED.
Prove otherwise.
Look at the census data.
therefore there are no such stats.
Even sillier than you usually manage.
Or maybe the Tories want the chavs to start voting for them too?
Corse they do, but it doesn't matter what
they want, it isnt going to happen.
Giving them more money will help.
Nope, they don't bother to vote.
They will vote for whoever gives them the most benefits.
They don't bother to vote.
Prove it.
Look at the percentage who bother to vote.
I mean the other alternative in Scotland is SNP,
Yep, its only the toffs that vote tory in scotland
and there are only enough of those to get a
couple of torys elected.
A lot of Scots are ****ed off with the SNP,
But those don't vote tory, you watch.
Nobody else to vote for.
They wont vote, you watch.
hopefully they won't all vote SNP next time.
They are in fact much more likely to do that next
time because most of them are actually stupid
enough to want to stay in the EU and SNP wants
that and the torys have noticed that the majority
of voters who bothered to vote voted to leave
and decided to do what they voted for.
Actually most of the remoaners are in London, not Scotland.
Irrelevant to the fact that most in scotland don't want to leave the EU.
Scots aren't that bright. They can't even talk properly.
And didn't even manage to invent pants, or underware.
and we all know she ****ed things up royally.
But you lot vote SNP anyway if you do bother to vote.
SNP are communist arseholes, hopefully most of us have realised this
now.
Even if they have, they will vote for them anyway, you watch.
Why would anyone vote for an arsehole?
Because they like the alternatives even less.
There is no other possible explanation for why
scotland has returned almost no one except the SNP.
Scots are so stupid as to vote for anyone who claims to make Scotland more
important than the UK. Patriotic idiots....
They did get a lot more out of the english that way.
But never did work out how to stop
the english stealing their oil and gas.
As for them wanting a SECOND independance referendum, that's
ridiculous and has ****ed half of us off.
All irrelevant now Britain is leaving the EU.
Not if Scotland separates and rejoins it.
I meant that May wont be having a second referendum now.
If Scotland gets independance, we might try to rejoin.
No may about it, sure to do that, and will succeed in joining too.
Since I'm English by blood, I may just leave.
I don't they care what you do.
And I thought you loved me.
Just another of your pathetic little drug crazed psychotic fantasys.
And working class people arent necessarily poor people anyway.
That's what it means.
Nope, it JUST means they do that sort of work.
And that sort of work doesn't pay much.
Irrelevant to what is working class.
And quite a bit of working class work
pays very well indeed, particularly in
the oil and gas industry and mining etc.
I'd call them middle class.
More fool you. A drill rigger isnt middle class.
They make far more money than a dustman.
And are still working class anyway.
Money is what decides your class.
Wrong.
Nobody agrees:
Another lie.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_class
Doesn't say anything like your ****.
Middle class people do not have to run their own business.
Yes, clearly anglican ministers, doctors employed by the
NHS, managers working for a salary etc are all middle class.
Correct.
So money doesn't decide your class.
Those people you listed have a medium amount of money.
Not those that end up with **** all because their ****ed up
their investments. They are still middle class with **** all money.
And a chav that wins the lotto doesn't become middle class,
they are still chavs with lots of money, for a while.
Adam certainly isnt.
Then he isn't working class.
Corse an electrician is working class.
There's an electrician three doors down from me. Hardly working
class.
He runs his own business and owns three properties.
Adam doesn't do that.
Thought he was in charge of underlings?
Foremen are still working class. And in the past
most of the working class had apprentices and
that's the only underlings he has.
Depends what he gets paid.
Nope, there have always been some of the working
class that get much better paid than the dregs of the
working class. Its what they do that determine whether
they are middle class or working class or a toff.
If they get more money, they become snobbier.
Nope. They stay chavs.
Money corrupts.
Hasn't corrupted me.
They want handouts.
Corse you never ever do that yourself, eh ?
I take whatever's available, I'm a scrounger at heart.
And yet you don't vote Labour.
Because I don't want any money I earn to go to someone else.
It does anyway.
Moreso with Labour.
Nope, they don't get any more tax out of you than the torys do.
Tories are making cutbacks to the NHS etc. Labour increase that
spending.
Irrelevant to whether labour got more money out of you or not.
It's very relevant. If they spend more they need more taxes to fund
it.
Nope, they just run up the deficit. And since you are a
tax avoider, they don't get more money out of you anyway.
Labour run up the defecit then the tories have to try to fix it.
And they cant fix it by getting more money out of you.
They fix it by stopping wasting money on things like te NHS and child
benefits.
Not possible, they'd be out of a job if
they were stupid enough to do that.
They've just stopped child benefits for more than two kids.
And so they should. Completely stupid to be taxing everyone,
pumping that money thru the system and then straight back to
the same people the money was collected from in the first place.
There shouldn't be any child benefits for anyone
except those whose kids would starve without it.
And it shouldn't be possible to spend the benefits
on grog and cigarettes and gambling etc, just on
what those kids eat and clothes for them to wear etc.
The only reason the Tories don't cut taxes is they're trying to get
rid
of the debt the Labour government put us in.
Mindlessly simplistic.
But true.
Nope.
Prove it.
No need, its obvious.