On Tue, 02 May 2017 21:27:01 +0100, Rod Speed wrote:



"James Wilkinson Sword" wrote in message
news
On Mon, 24 Apr 2017 20:06:35 +0100, Rod Speed
wrote:



"James Wilkinson Sword" wrote in message
news On Mon, 24 Apr 2017 17:27:56 +0100, bert wrote:

In article , Andrew Gabriel
writes
In article ,
The Natural Philosopher writes:
On 23/04/17 21:47, Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article ,
Bod writes:
From what I've read and heard, most Labour voters ARE like sheep.
I
hear it all of the time "I vote labour because all my family have
always
voted for Labour".

I think there's been a lot of truth in that, but a lot of people
who had always voted Labour for decades have abandoned the party
in last couple of years for two different reasons, Brexit, and the
party's recent move towards the far left (popular with Labour
members, but less so with the bulk of voters they need to attract).

Both Conservative and Labour voters were split on Brexit - it
wasn't a hard left/right issue. Now the Conservatives have come
out heavily for Brexit, they've pulled in lots of Labour Brexiters,
and I think they'll pull in all 5M UKIP voters (UKIP will be dead
in 8 weeks). Conservatives will lose some Remainers to Lib/Dems, but
that will be small compared with their gains from Labour and UKIP.

I think the most significant thing historically will be the number
of traditional left wing voters who've moved well to the right just
to ensure Brexit goes through. They'll probably move back a few
years after Brexit, but for now, they regard Brexit as more
important
than left/right politics.

Labour hasn't been a party of the working class - the white working
class for two decades or more. Not since Thatcher really.
Its the party of the nouveau rich middle class, you know 'me grandad
were a milkman but I am a sound engineer at the beeb, and own me own
house' sort.

Working class are way right of Labour.

I see where you're coming from, but I tend to think of it slightly
differently. Prior to Thatcher, there was a large working class in
the UK. The 1980's saw phenominal growth and improvement in living
standards, and enabled a large number of working class to move into
the middle class, with the middle class outnumbering the working
class by 1990.

However, in spite of this, there wasn't a significant political
party for the middle class. They ended up voting for whichever left
or right party was nearer the centre, and they had become large
enough to carry the swing vote. It wasn't until Labour realised this
that they got back into power, and then served their longest term
ever.

For now, voting is pretty much all about Brexit, and might even
remain so for one more general election after Brexit. Even if
Labour moved back more towards centre, I don't think it will help
them at the moment, although it may do after Brexit.

You should also include the demise of the heavy industrial base of the
unions, coal mining, steel making, car manufacturing etc. The only
unions left with any power are in the public sector.

Unions do nobody any good, ever.

They do arseholes like Scargill a lot of good.

That's not what I meant.

You did say nobody.

Don't be so pedantic.

--
Two blondes are racing down a bumpy back road in a pretty beat up car down to a bank they're going to rob.
"Drive slower" pleads the one in the passenger seat, "I don't want all the nitro in the boot to explode."
"Relax," the driver replies, "even if it did, I've got a spare box under the seat . . . "