On 24/09/2016 19:12, trader_4 wrote:
On Saturday, September 24, 2016 at 1:35:26 PM UTC-4, Bob F wrote:
On 9/24/2016 9:04 AM, trader_4 wrote:


And in another recent incident, the shooting outside the convenience
store in Louisiana, the police apparently first used a taser and for
whatever reason, it wasn't effective. They wound up wrestling with
the perp on the ground and then shooting him. The perp had a gun in
his pocket. Taser's aren't perfect, they rely on a dart with a wire
sticking in the perp. Faced with an imminent deadly threat, they are
not the solution.

"The perp had a gun in his pocket."
Louisiana is an open carry state. There was nothing wrong with having a
gun in his pocket. It seems like in many cases, as soon as a gun is
seen, the "perp" is dead, even in open carry states.

Sigh. Another poor confused lib. "Open carry" is just that, carrying
a firearm where it can be seen. It is not carrying it in your pocket
which is "concealed carry". But it doesn't end there. The perp in
Louisiana, Alton Sterling, had a long rap sheet with dozens of serious
convictions, including FELONIES. A felon is not legally permitted to carry
firearms period. And finally, even if you are licensed to carry, you
have to be one dumb AH or have a death wish, to resist arrest,
struggle with police, when you have that gun on you. Actions have
consequences, you know.




The second amendment only applies to whites?


Typical confused lib who know nothing about guns, gun laws
or the constitution.




What people either forget or choose to ignore is that the streets are
not a testing lab. The officer has a split second to react to the
threat (real or perceived) and there normally is no time to try Plan B.

Problem is, they don't seem to have a plan A.

Clearly they did in all the incidents under discussion here. All started
with the police properly engaging the perp, trying to get them to comply
to commands, to cooperate. It didn't start with a fatal shooting, it
only ended there after a long period of bad actions on the part of the
perp. The perp created the toxic, volatile, dangerous situation.




Exactly. That's why it's so difficult to convict a cop in one of
these shootings. If I was on the jury, even if the cop made a mistake,
I'd have a tough time finding them guilty when they have a split second
to make a decision in a volatile, toxic, dangerous situation that they
did not create. The perp created it.

The "perp" seems to often be innocent of any crime. They are just a
black man in the wrong spot when the cops show up, often looking for
someone else.


Really? Michael Brown? Eric Garner? Alton Sterling? All had committed
crimes. The two in the latest incident? One apparently was holding a
gun, refused to drop it. The other had PCP in his car and was likely on
PCP at the time.








I'm not a LE officer but those I know who are even think that the
incidence of this action is out of control.

No doubt there are cases such as that. However, until all the facts are
in and everything has been thoroughly analyzed the ones that you know -
if they are speaking of either the Charlotte or Tulsa incident - should
pour themselves a large cup of STFU and wait until the investigation is
completed. It what they would want if they were in those officer's
shoes. Either that or they are just idiots - Hey! It happens even in
the best of departments.g


How many unarmed blacks have to get shot before you realize the cops are
creating part of the problem. Maybe they need to just slow down a little
and not just run in without evaluating the situation.


Clearly with all the factual errors you've just made here, you're
the one that should re-valuate.



Take that 12 year old in the park with an airsoft gun. The cops got a
report of a child with a "gun" ( The caller to the police said he
thought it was a toy), and they drive up to within a few feet of the
boy, and kill him within seconds. They could have stopped a safe
distance away, and tried to figure out what was really going on, perhaps
safely behind their car, while reinforcements were called, but chose
what I consider a really stupid approach to the situation.

Even this you have wrong in a very major way. The radio message to the
responding officers did not say it was a "child", only that it was
somebody pointing a gun at people.

I agree that this is an example where the police should have handled
it differently, mainly by not driving right up to the suspect.




BTW, could the Tulsa quick charging wind up being nothing more than an
effort to placate the BLM crowd? Like Baltimore? Will the charges
stand? Will there be a conviction? Stay tuned.

Typically, there will be no conviction. There rarely is.

The guy in Tulsa walked to his broken down car with his hands up, placed
his hands on the top of his car, then was tased and shot. The cops
claimed he reached into the car, but the car windows were closed, so
that was clearly not possible. Closed windows, with blood running down
the window onto the door after the shooting.

Given your track record with the "facts" from the other cases, here
you go again. It's not clear exactly what happened in these new
cases.



The cops claim he had a gun, but that is not illegal - It's an open
carry state. Do they shoot every white man they think has a gun?


Does every person, regardless of race, refuse to drop the gun
when confronted by police, who tell them to do so, with their
own weapons drawn? THAT and similar stupid behavior is the problem,
not the color of anyone's skin.


The "perp"s crime seems to be having his car break down while black.

They claim he was on PCP, but the experts I've seen make it pretty clear
his actions were not those of a person high on PCP. He looked pretty
slow and careful to me.


Typical, now you're an arm chair expert in detection of PCP.
No need to wait for the lab work. His actions of irrational behavior
and defying police fit the profile of PCP that I've seen and heard.


That seems to be the safest route these days. Charge knowing you have
no case, then let the jury acquit a year or two later, when things have
cooled down. What leads one to suspect that could be the case in Tulsa
is how quick the charges were brought. It's hard to imagine they did
a full, fair investigation of all the evidence in that short period of
time.


Or maybe the prosecutor could see that this really looks like a bad
shoot. That seems pretty clear to me.

But no, the guy was black, so he must be a "bad dude" high on PCP ready
to kill all the cops in sight, so must be murdered immediately.

Who said that?

The cop in the helicopter. It's on the audio from the helicopter footage.