DIYbanter - View Single Post - Basement wet bar: wiring and circuit questions

Don Y[_3_]

On 10/5/2015 6:18 AM, wrote:
On Monday, October 5, 2015 at 2:18:39 AM UTC-4, Don Y wrote:

Will this *be* greywater?
No garbage disposal unit planned. And I'm not preparing food, but possible
some dope might rinse their plate in this sink on Thanksgiving instead of
bringing it upstairs. More conservative answer is yes, it's greywater.
Does that change approach?

My question pertained to whether or not you were going to route it into
the sanitary sewer. "Greywater" can usually be disposed of on your
property (e.g., irrigation). But, it must *truly* be greywater (in
the code's definition of same)

Hmmm... I'm not sure of that. Are you using it for food preparation?
Well, probably not. I will have no stove or cooktop in the basement. I
would use it just to wash something instead of hauling it upstairs to the
kitchen.

My question was semi rhetorical. If you're not preparing food,
then it's less likely "like a kitchen". I.e., it could be more
like a *bathroom* or a "laundry room" (see my point?). So,
the invariant issues are GFCI's and proximity to water.

Imagine having a sink near your washing machine (we had one growing up).
Imagine a counter there to fold clothes. It's not really similar to a
kitchen -- except that it has a counter and a sink (but so does a
bathroom!).
True. It'll have a counter with cabinets beneath and maybe above too.

1. Will one 20amp circuit for these countertop outlets suffice? or do I
need more?

See above. I don't think it owuld be treated as a kitchen/food prep
area. As such, you might be able to share the circuit in ways that are
not allowed in a kitchen.

First question you should ask is what do you *envision* your needs there
to be? Will you have an electric frying pan roasting up cocktail weenies
to serve to your buddies congregating there? Will you be using a portable
electric grinder to trim ceramic bowls that you're throwing on a wheel and
firing? etc.
No... I've no exhaust fan either. I, personally, would not be preparing
food in the basement.

OK, so it's not used *like* a kitchen. But, how do you *want* to use
it (forget the Code issues)? E.g., if you want to have a wet saw
draining into the sink, you probably want power for the wet saw nearby
(silly example). If you want to make popcorn, you'll want to be
able to set the popcorn popper on the counter (and have power
available). The size of your counter will determine how much stuff
you can set on it and where (in relation to the sink). Having just
12" on either side of the sink will pretty much screw you wrt outlets
(which need to be 12" from water).

One way of looking at this is to consider the consequences of something
*else* on that circuit tripping the breaker. I.e., now your pump is
inoperative. What are the consequences? Would you want a battery backed
pump?
My concern with this is that the code mentions a "sump pump" must be on a
dedicated circuit. To me, sump pump is for a whole house dewatering system
in the basement. Does this (under sink pump) qualify as a sump pump by the
NEC?

Dunno. My sister had a similar arrangement. Basement was below the sewer
line. Yet, they installed a toilet, shower, etc. Let everything drain
downward -- then a sump pushed it back up overhead. Never a danger of the
sump filling from rain/runoff as they were on the high side of a hill.
But, if the water was running in shower, toilet, sink, etc. the pump had to
be reliable -- no way to "inhibit" the flow of water *into* the sink if
the pump failed!

[BTW, a dedicated circuit means exactly that! I.e., you can't even use a
duplex *receptacle* on the load end!]