On Sat, 18 Jul 2015 20:48:47 +0100, Phil L wrote:

"Lobster" wrote in message
22...
On 17 Jul 2015, David grunted:

So - my dishwasher has various options including a fast low
temperature 35C wash. We are currently using the "daily" program which
goes to 65C and takes over two hours.

Killing germs on food items is probably more important thank killing
germs in your woolly jumper. However in the old hand wash days the
water was probably not much higher than 35-40C unless you were dead
'ard and/or wearing thick Marigolds.

So - what does the team think about low temperature washes in a
dishwasher?

Ours has three settings - 55C 'standard'; 65C 'standard' and 65C 'for
really, really dirty pans'. When I switch it on, I use the 55C every
time;
SWMBO[1] goes for the top-end 65C one. The results of both washes are
of course completely indistinguishable, but she won't have it. Nearly
drives me insane; probably the biggest single cause of marital
disharmony in our house!

[1] Of course everyone knows that no women know how to load a
dishwasher properly anyway; but that's a whole different discussion...


It's amazing what a woman can teach you, I didn't even know there was a
wrong way to put milk back in the fridge.

Oh, there definitely is! However, *her way* might not necessarily be the
right way. Since I make frequent mugs of tea (brewed in the pot btw) with
a dash of pasteurised, I'm responsible for a good 90% of the occasions
when the milk has to be retrieved and returned to the fridge in this
household.

Over the years, I've come to the conclusion that to get the longest life
out of a 4 pint bottle, it's best to be gentle with it (parking it on the
hinge end of the door pocket and avoid splashing droplets onto the
underside of its screw top) and keep its excursion time to a bare minimum
to prevent unwanted warming of milk droplets above the milk line and any
that might be attached to the underside of the screw top. These areas of
the container are subject to the most rapid warming up effect from
ambient room air.

Whilst the bulk of the milk will nicely retain its fridge chill when the
bottle is left parked on the worktop for 5 to 10 minutes[1], the same
can't be said for any milk droplets residing elsewhere in the bottle and
it only needs one of these droplets to turn sour or culture an unwanted
bacterial colony to set the rest of the contents off.

A life extending routine (for the milk, that is!), when raiding the
fridge to put a drop of milk into a mug or a cup for a brew up or a
coffee, is to ready said crockery and pour as soon as possible after
taking it out of the fridge and removing the top, keeping hold of said
top for immediate replacement after dispensing the milk followed by an
immediate and gentle return to its spot on the fridge door shelf, next to
the door hinge, not forgetting to properly close the fridge door straight
away. Oh, and, for added measure, close the fridge door in between
retrieval and dispensing the milk (don't worry about the extra door
opening/closing cycle this involves, it's surprising how swiftly the air
temperature can rise in a fridge when its door has been left ajar for a
mere ten seconds or so).

It's very rare that we find ourselves having to dump the unused contents
before the BB date (usually selected at the time of purchase to give us a
week or more before the BB date expires). In fact, we (or rather I) often
manage to get anywhere from 2 to 4 days beyond the BB date before
starting to detect any signs of sourness or other indication of 'badness'.

Since I brew in the pot and put the milk into the mug first, it's been
my habit for many years to use that opportunity to sniff and taste the
milk beforehand which provides me with an early warning system to detect
the earliest signs of the milk 'going on the turn'.

Whilst my sage advice above might seem like a lot of faffing about, the
routine of it is as slick as any of the more 'carefree' and cavalier milk
handling systems in use by others "less obsessed". I do it not because I
have to but because I *can*. :-)

[1] When I first started this policy of absolute minimum exposure to room
temperature, it was more out of curiosity as to whether this could
improve the chances of a bottle of milk actually managing to attain its BB
date without going off. TBH, I hadn't considered what now seems to be the
real issue, thinking only of the bulk temperature of the contents which,
after all would only increase by a fraction of a degree for a ten to 15
minute exposure which really should have had almost no impact on its
'keeping qualities'.

When I realised that my changed 'milk handling routine' was actually
producing results, I had to stop and think again. Only then did it occur
to me that the problem of shortened life was a consequence of the milk
droplets above the 'milk line' being more rapidly warmed up by the
relatively brief exposure to a room temperature environment (maybe 5 or
10 minutes at a time as opposed to ten seconds or so when I changed my
routine).

Once just a droplet or two of milk has begun to turn, this can act as a
trigger on the bulk of the milk despite its low storage temperature if
and when it subsequently mixes with it. This why it's preferable to store
it upright on the door pocket shelf and avoid storing the milk on its
side on a shelf. There *is* a right and a wrong way to store milk in the
fridge. If the wife suggests that storage on the door pocket shelf in an
upright orientation is the only correct way, then, for Gawd's sake don't
argue the point with her, she's right!

--
Johnny B Good