On Monday, November 25, 2013 6:33:07 PM UTC-5, Danny D'Amico wrote:
On Mon, 25 Nov 2013 14:15:05 -0800, wrote:



They are *not* both valid. You have it wrong.



Well, this entire discussion is about how the power supply works, so,

it is germane to the discussion how the power company completes the

circuit.


I didn't see anyone here saying it wasn't germane, only
that you're wrong.



I don't have any more arguments, and, we *do* have at least one

reference which supports my statement.


So, now one reference to a light-weight, novice level tutorial on power
distribution is the authoritative source? Why don't you look at
all the other sources that say he's wrong? As I already pointed out,
you can start with looking at what the author of that reference
himself said immediately preceeding:

" "There are four wires coming out of every power plant: the three phases plus a neutral or ground common to all three."


If the power company is using the earth, why would there be a 4th wire?
And clearly the author doesn't understand the difference between a
neutral, which is a current carrying conductor, and a ground. Neither did
you until we explained it to you with regard to split-phase service
to a house. But you don't have a clue to how it works on the primary
side. I've told you at least 6 times now, that with a balanced load,
which is what the world looks like to a power plant, there is no
need for any return circuit path other than the 3 phase wires coming out.
Good grief.




That doesn't mean I'm correct. What it means is we need more references

(either way), instead of our statements (since we all sincerely believe

what we're stating).


If you spent half the time looking that you do arguing, you'd
have found plenty of references by now that say you're wrong.
I'm starting to understand John's annoyance. You came in here
not knowing a ground from a neutral. Now you're here acting like
your opinion is worth as much as anyone else's. I believe John is
an electrician. I'm an EE, Bud is too. All of us are telling you
that you're wrong.




Googling for:

"how does electricity get back to the power company -solar"



This is on the first page (which was referenced already):

http://science.howstuffworks.com/env...rgy/power3.htm

It agrees with what I said (on page 4).



Here it says the same thing (that the earth is the return path):

http://www.science.smith.edu/~jcarde...ecPwr_HSW.html



And he

http://www.electricityforum.com/elec...-it-works.html



But those are all repeats. How about this Physics forum?

http://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=429670



Good grief, that's a repeat of the same thing too. Right at
the top it references "How stuff works". All those references
use the exact same words, go back to the one same place, the
same "How stuff works" guy.





Now, that does not prove that the earth is the return path

for the electricity back to the power company, but, it is clearly

a half dozen (or so) references which say what I've always thought

was the case.



Are you that stupid that you think 6 places that use the
same incorrect source somehow makes it right?




That means that the idea isn't so far fetched as it may appear.

Admittedly, most of these references were cut out of the same

mold (probably due to my search terms?), so I welcome someone

who can find a reference that says the earth is *not* the return

path for the HVAC typical power generated in the USA.

Maybe you should do that yourself. You might learn something.