On 10/10/2013 12:59, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 10/10/13 12:24, Fredxx wrote:
TNP doesn't understand radiation. He believes the most significant heat
transfer in a gas is through conduction.


That's because actually it is

In many cases.

Radiators dont heat your house through radiation, but about 80% by
convections which is assisted conduction.

Air is heated by the radiator by conduction - yes, but the method of
transfer to the rest of the room is through convection. Heat conduction
within air is pitiful. Convection is hardly assisted conduction, and is
regarded as a separate form of heat transfer. Have you studied O-level
physic? At last you accept that the majority of heat transfer from a
domestic radiator is through convection.


gases dont radiate much at room temperatures. The energy is the fourth
power of temperature.

I can assure you there is much thermal radiation. Have you looked up
how much a 1 sq-m of surface radiates/emits in terms of W/sq-m at normal
temperatures. A black-body approximation will do.

This is sufficiently dumbed down as to pssibly be withing your grasp

http://www.g9toengineering.com/resou...attransfer.htm

And you still get confused with conduction and convection - shees.


As I have said time and agan, heat loss from the earths SURFACE is not
except in dry desests primarily radiation. It is via convection and
advection of water vapour and thereby to clouds, and clouds do the final
radiation into space. No one disputes this, but cO2 fanatics ignore it
and hand wave it away. Because its impossibly hard to model.

The Earth is a finely balanced thermal system with numerous competing
mechanisms. However until you understand the greenhouse effect and the
significance of CO2, you won't understand why some of us are concerned.

You have no idea of the wavelength of ground temperature thermal
radiation, and the corresponding transmission of those wavelengths
through the atmosphere, otherwise you would not have made such a
schoolboy like presumption that only deserts can radiate thermal energy.

And because clouds sit high up in the atmoshere, what the compositiion
of the atmoshere underneath is, is totally irrelevant to their activity
in radiating heat away.

IPCC climate models are based on O level physics, at best. They simply
'paraemeterise' all the important detail and hand wave it away, just as
you do. But you cant do that and get an accurate preduction.

Do you really believe that? At least they understand conduction,
convection and radiation, and can apply those simple laws of physic to
their models.

Which is why they never have.

Models aren't hand waving, hand waving is what you are doing here.