On Wednesday, October 2, 2013 2:52:39 AM UTC-4, Ashton Crusher wrote:
On Mon, 30 Sep 2013 10:11:25 -0700 (PDT), "

wrote:



On Monday, September 30, 2013 12:54:00 PM UTC-4, Oren wrote:

On Mon, 30 Sep 2013 09:10:33 -0700 (PDT), "







What's really bizarre is how *he* keeps bringing up the

diagrams in the IEEE guide that show plug-in protectors

being used effectively. Fig 8 shows that TV1, with a surge

protector, is not damaged. It shows that TV2 without one

is damaged.



That's been posted a couple times. It refers to "diagrams". So is

this just a pictorial representation of some guys opinion of how these

surge protectors would hopefully work?


Proving once again that despite making several posts now, you won't
even look at the diagram in the IEEE guide
that's being discussed. Both Bud and I have given the link, the
page references, many times now.

It's not a diagram of "some guy's opinion". It's a diagram in an IEEE
(Institute of Electrical and Electronic Engineeers) guide on
surge protection written by a panel of experts on surge protection.

"Background and Acknowledgments
The IEEE Surge Protection Devices Committee (SPDC) has been writing
Standards for lightning and surge protection for more than 30 years. The current
versions of the IEEE C62 Family of Standards represent the state of the art in
these areas.
This application guide was written to make the information developed by the
SPDC more accessible to electricians, architects, technicians, and electrical
engineers who were not protection specialists.
Many people aided in this process. François Martzloff and Don Worden provided
much of the initial inspiration. Chrys Chrysanthou, Ernie Gallo, Phil Jones, Chuck
Richardson, François Martzloff, and Steven Whisenant lent their expertise and
guidance at the beginning of this project. Duke Energy and Steven Whisenant
provided the resources for drawing the figures, and George Melchior of Panamax
created the cover art. Many other people within the IEEE SPDC actively
supported the project. We thank Yvette Ho Sang and Jennifer Longman, of the
IEEE Standards Information Network, for their creativity in finding a niche for
this work and managing it through the editorial process."



I would have expected

something more along the lines of photos and measurements showing the

surge that was sent on the wire to the TV's and the quality of the

electric power coming out of the "protection" as well as whether the

TV actually survived the surge or not.



It's a guide for electricians, homeowners, businesses, etc on
surge protection. It's based on these experts decades of experience
which includes studying the surges that typically reach appliances,
etc. A lot of the studies, tests, experiments that form the basis
of knowledge would be available in other technical papers
at IEEE and similar, if you want that level of detail.




Nothing I've seen presented by those of you who seem to be in love

with surge protectors seems to be documentation of damage to actual

stuff inside houses without surge protection compared to the lack of

damage from the same surge to houses with surge protection.

This isn't some new field. Surge protection has been of vital
importance to power companies, utilities, businesses with major
installations of electronic equipment for a very long time.
Every major installation
of electronic equipment that relies on incoming AC power, incoming
communication lines uses surge protection. A prime example
would be a telephone company central office. They have tiered
surge protection starting at where the lines enter the building.
They have additional surge protection on the line cards in the
switch, where the phone lines terminate. Do you think these folks
spend a lot of money on it because it's not needed? That they would
do that if 6 ft of ordinary wire is all that's needed to stop a surge,
as your computer club guy claimed? That the IEEE just makes up stuff
just for the hell of it?

In my own house about 15 years ago, there was a lightning storm
one day while I was away. I had most everything electronic of
importance plugged into surge protectors. One thing I did
not have plugged in to one was a Tivo. The modem on it stopped working
that day. Can I prove with 100% certainty that it was blown by
a surge? No, but it's about 99.9% certain that it was.