"Hoyt Weathers" wrote in message
...
RichardS wrote:

snip, snip

Have you ever tried turning the board over, mark it, and then cut
it?
Or am I missing something?

Presumably sawdust covers the line if it is on top since the saw cuts
on
the
pull stroke.


That's not really the problem, though it wouldn't help. Have lungs, can
blow dust away... :-)

The problem it seems to me is that if I'm cutting at an oblique angle
then
the saw teeth under the board will be ahead of he ones above the board,
which seems intrinsically more difficult to follow the cut line.

Oblique angle to what? Which cut direction - towards you or away from you?

I get the sinking feeling that you are cutting AWAY from you for some
unstated
reason. Is this what you are doing? If so, why? Everyone I know cuts
toward
themselves. Cutting a board is not rocket science.


see below for how I arrive at this state of affairs....

Assume you hold the saw at about 45 degrees or less to the board to be
cut. Also
assume there is a cut line on the top side of the board. Also assume you
pull the
saw towards you as you adhere to the cut line and make the rip cut. If all
of those
assumptions are TRUE, then the saw teeth UNDER the board could NOT be
ahead of the
ones ABOVE the board. No way!


The word *ahead* could have two or more meanings I suppose. One would be
related to
position. Another could be related to time. I assume time is not a factor
in this.

Why not just play around with it on some crappie scrap? No harm done for
sure.


don't worry - I always play around on crappie scrap when using techniques
new to me. Also, when I first got this saw I started off by attempting to
use it in exactly the same way as I would a push saw - ie cutting towards
me, saw angled at about 45 degrees, teeth (obviously) pointing downwards.
What I did not experience was any ease whatsoever in starting off the rip
cut, nor in continuing it once started. The teeth would dig in, and there
was huge resistance in cutting, this is why I began to wonder if my normal
western technique could be completely wrong for a Japanese pullsaw when
ripping.

In an attempt to describe what I mean I'll revert back to a western-style
push saw for a moment:

Starting off a rip cut I would position the saw such that the teeth point
downwards, the end of the board is in front of me, the angle of the saw
teeth to the face of the board is at an acute angle, 45 degrees or so, I am
cutting towards me. Sorry if this is stating the obvious but I really want
to get back to first principles here so that there can be absolutely no
misunderstanding. The cut is made on the push stroke.

Now, considering the action of the individual teeth, they have a chiselling
action, cutting out kerf-width bits of the fibre, and the fibres are cut in
such a way that each tooth engages with the topmost edge of the fibre, if
you can see what I mean.

reverting to the japanese saw:

When I use the (rip tooth profile) pullsaw cutting in the same way above
this does not seem to be the cutting action.

True, each tooth still chisels out it's piece of wood, but instead of
starting on the surface of the board when it's cutting it is always digging
into the end grain.

If I was to take a chisel and try to remove a bit of stock along the grain
it is easy to start from the surface of the board and chop out that piece.
If I was to start from the end grain and try and chop towards the surface of
the board it would not be easy and the wood would probably tear out. Stupid
example, perhaps, but illustrates the point.

No matter how lightly I hold the saw aganst the board it digs in.

So, I'm unfamiliar with use of this tool and start trying other techniques
for it's use.

The first thing I try is to turn everything around. Start off with the
board in front of me, facing the board end. Hold saw at 45 degree angle to
board face, with handle pointing downards and teeth down (sorry, being
explicit here again), cutting away from me. Sails through the board like
butter. However, this is obviously impractical for cutting a long rip in a
board. Flip the saw around so that cutting away still, but now handle above
the board and teeth pointing upwards. Also sails through, but obviously you
cannot see the cutting line.

So, sorry if this sounds like a really stupid question/thread, I'm just
puzzled, that's all! If the answer is "use just like you would a western
rip saw" then fine, I'll go away and practice until I get the technique.
IMHO good woodworking is 90% technique, and I like to use correct technique
and refine it until perfect results.



--
Richard Sampson

email me at
richard at olifant d-ot co do-t uk