On Sun, 08 Jul 2012 12:16:45 -0400, Peter wrote:

On 7/7/2012 9:18 PM, Onlooker wrote:
I hope this isn't too far OT. It is about hydraulics and I think
that's of interest here.

But it's about male urine hydraulics. And I need some advice before
I try to talk to the doctor again. I've learned one needs to be
informed when talking to a doctor.

Until 2 months ago, I could pee normally, one single stream going just
where I pointed it, except once every 6 months or so, the sides of the
opening were stuck together for a minute or so, but that was so rare
it was no problem.

But recently, I had blood in my urine and the urologist sent a scope
up my urethra to look inside my bladder, then on another day something
else to do a bladder biopsy (negative), and 10 days after that, a
laser to zap a bladder stone, almost as big as a golf ball. .

Between the 2nd and last procedure I had 3 different catheters, and
after the last procedure, abother thicker, stiffer one with a bigger
channel inside, to allow any remaining little particles from the
stone to come out. Everything is fine now, no more blood, except now
I almost always pee in 2 or 3 streams going in all directions and it
makes a mess if I'm standing up.

In response to this problem, the doctor thought I need a smaller
prostate, either with a stronger drug or a laser-sapping (this time
the prostate itself, not the bladder stone (which is gone).

But the prostate is several inches from the opening, at the end.
Wouldn't any turbulence caused by a narrow opening due to a enlarged
prostate(*) even itself out before the exit point, even if we
understated the distance as 3 or 2 inches), and doesn't that mean the
obstruction is quite close to the opening?????

And not where the prostate is. After all, I was peeing normally
until the day before the 2nd procedure, and even though the outside
catheter surface is smooth, I can't help thinking it messed something
up near the exit point, maybe when one of the four were coming out.

*(which is probably no more enlarged than it was 14 days earlier,
before the 2nd procuedure) )


Background. The tube leading to the opening is called the urethra,
but the tube ends (or starts) where the prostate is, and from there up
to the bladder, there is no tube just a space made by the lobes of the
prostate. At least this is approximately right, and it's why it's
possible to zap the prostate with a laser without cutting through the
urethra, or needing to sew it back up.



I don't mind posted replies, in fact they are better because other
people reply to them,, but if anyone wants to email, remove the extra
r's after onlooker. There should be only one.


I think your instincts are good. To me, it sounds more like a "nozzle"
problem much closer to the outside world and not at all like a
restricted flow problem originating more proximally in the prostatic
urethra. Maybe there's a small tag of skin or scar tissue (possibly
produced from stone fragment or instrument trauma) either very close to
the outside world or even at the meatus that is producing the spray. If
your prostate were enlarged and constricting the urethra, it would
restrict urine flow, which would likely reduce flow turbulence. In
fact, I wonder if having prostatic surgery would exacerbate your
symptoms by increasing turbulance. As someone else has mentioned, there
are potentially unpleasant and undesirable side effects that can happen
with prostate surgery and personally, I'd rather live with a spray
problem than have prostatic surgery on account of that particular
symptom alone. If you can't get a logical, clear explanation from your
urologist how restricted urine flow from an enlarged prostate causes
your symptom, time to get a second opinion.


Any reduced flow means reduced pressure. Reduced pressure means its
more likely that any stuck parts of the nozzle will stay partially
stuck while peeing leading to the spray. Reduced pressure also simply
changes how the stream exits the nozzle which can also produce spray.
Put a nozzle on a garden hose and notice how the spray pattern changes
as you slowly open the faucet and change the effective pressure at the
nozzle.

If it was me I would not have more procedures done if the only problem
was the spray. The spray might be "fixable" by manually manipulating
the nozzle to break up any "stuck" parts before starting the flow.
It's relatively uncommon but there are potential side effects from the
roto-rooter procedure such as incontinence and partial impotence.