On 6/11/2012 7:20 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 11 Jun 2012 17:25:18 -0400,
wrote:

On 6/11/2012 2:51 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 11 Jun 2012 09:58:43 -0400,
wrote:

On 6/11/2012 9:16 AM, wrote:
On Jun 11, 12:11 am, wrote:
On Jun 10, 8:11 pm, wrote:





On Jun 10, 10:11 pm, wrote:

On Jun 10, 8:09 am, wrote:

On Jun 9, 2:03 pm, wrote:

wrote:
I have a friend who runs a business. Their main breaker is on the
outside of the building right along a busy back alley. Inside the
building directly behind that main breaker is the panel with all the
individual breakers. The box looks similar to this:
http://www.solarpanelstore.com/assets/ch_dpb222r.jpg

If you look on the bottom, there is the tab that sticks out with the
hole, which is meant for a small padlock. The problem is that the
box, had a plastic tab. Why the manufacturer used a plastic tab (the
rest of the box is metal), is beyond me. It had a lock on it, but
the plastic tab broke off, and ever since people keep shutting off
the power at least once a month. That affects all kinds of
electronic equipment inside, and disrupts business. The business
owner is a woman who dont understand all the technical issues, she
just wants the box to be tamper proof. I told her I'd see what can
be done, and will install something if possible.

I suggested drilling a few holes and putting a hasp on the box, with
pop rivets and padlocking it, but I tend to wonder if there is any
sort of legal requirements. I suppose in the event of a fire, the
Fire Dept might want to shut off the power. This makes me question
what to do. I'm also not sure who to ask locally about this? Maybe
the power company?????

Anyone know anything about this?

One other thought was to drill a hole right below that slot and just
use a cable tie through the slot and the hole. Anyone can cut it
off, but it might be enough to discourage them. Right now all they
need to do is lift the cover and shut off the breaker. At least a
cable tie would require more effort by tamperers, and still be easily
cut in an emergency.

Is this covered in the USA electrical codes? I dont have the book.
(Are the codes available online?)

Having a locked breaker box, and a secured lock-out box, might discourage
a/c compressor coil thieves.

A lock certainly won't hinder the fire department. They'll rip the box off
the wall in a nonce if they feel like it.

Actually they won't, they will wait safely outside the
building and watch it burn until someone comes with
the keys or the power company comes and disconnects
the circuit to that building from the street... Which ever
comes first... Fire departments don't mess with metal
tools near live electrical equipment... Not when the
entire area and the personnel are wet from the fire fighting
operations on scene...

Evan-

It's been so much run to have you join in the party at AHR!

If nothing else you provide comic relief.

I guess you don't know any firefighters or seen any in action up
close.
They tend not to do a lot of waiting in general.

It's that whole fire thing, little fires get bigger if left
unattended.
My money is on them not waiting for a key.

That's probably why they study& practice forceable
entry ..........with a side order of "how to defeat padlocks".

http://www.larchmontfire.org/images/fdny_fe.pdf (~180 pages of
forceable entry techniques)http://www.firetowntrainingspecialis...20Padlocks.pdf

Evan, spend less time writing& more time reading, even you might get
a bit smarter.

I cannot help but wonder wether you born this stupid or is it the
result of serious effort (or injury)

@DD_BobK:

You are the pot calling the kettle black...

Biggest twit on here in a while...

Fire Departments are under no obligation to
aggressively attack a fire -- so if entry to the
building is unsafe because of an electrical
hazard, they can still put water on the flames
through the window and door openings and/or
douse closely abutting structures to prevent
spread of the flames...

Spend some time learning about arc flash
and other industrial accidents... Even a
small one can permanently disable or kill
you...

Evan-

You are the most dangerous type of contributor to AHR....
you have no idea when you;re out of your depth.

Which, based on your posting, is most of the time.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

You mean like when he told us all that it's illegal to
vent nitrogen from an HVAC system to the atmosphere
and that you must instead capture it? He still claims
that's true and I've yet to see a reference.

If pulling a meter is so dangerous, going to cause
an arc over, etc. you would think there would be
dead utility workers all over the place. They pull
them every day. Exactly what is going to be so
special about their method as opposed to a fire
fighter doing it?


If utility workers pull them under load as in the case of a meter
swapout they install jumpers on the horn bypass tabs or close the less
common internal bypass switch on the meter base.
How are they going to do that without opening the meter base? When
they swapped mine out for the smart meter they just popped the seal,
yanked the meter, and popped the new meter in. According to my UPS
record the house was without power for less than 3 seconds. And the
meter base was NOT opened, nor was power disconnected in any other
way.

They cut the seal and open the front cover on the meter base. If they
are using jumpers they just slide them on the tabs. If it has an
internal bypass they move the lever to bypass. In both cases the tabs or
lever are arranged so that you can't put the cover back on if jumpers
are installed or the lever is in bypass.

Don't know what kind of meter or meter base you use in your parts,
but that would be a total impossibility with the residential meters
used by Waterloo North Hydro and Kitchener Wilmot Hydro for the last
50 years, give or take. And they are the same as used by virtually all
former Ontario Hydro (now Hydro One) customers.

Sounds like you have what are called ring type meter bases. Our utility
(and I gather most others just by how common ringless bases are) has
required ringless meter bases for probably 30 years.

Here is a typical ringless meter base:

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=100346977&storeId=10051&l angId=-1&catalogId=10053&ci_sku=100346977&ci_kw={keyword} &kwd={keyword}&cm_mmc=shopping-_-googleads-_-pla-_-100346977&ci_gpa=pla


or

http://preview.tinyurl.com/c4y3v8j

You can clearly see there is a tab on each lug. Designs differ but they
all have the same size tab. That way the lineman just pushes on two
jumpers before pulling the meter:

"The USJL-001 jumper lead set is a convenient and safe method to prevent
a customer outage in event of meter removal/changeout. Constructed from
#6 AWG highly flexible insulated copper the working ends are also
machined of solid copper for utmost performance. The working ends are
beveled to permit easy push on installation. Simply push the meter lead
end over the bypass horn and turn the knurled handle until the lead is
tightly secured in place. Turning the knurled handle the opposite
direction will loosen the lead for easy removal."



http://www.utilitysolutionsinc.com/u...mper-Leads.cfm


http://preview.tinyurl.com/8x2mkdd