On Tue, 06 Mar 2012 22:07:34 +0000, John Rumm wrote:

snipped


Thats a separate issue to what needs to be taught to them tho.

I would say they are related. Being comfortable with technology, and
know the basic functions of office software is important. As is decent
mouse and keyboard skills. However repeating that over and over only
gets board kids, not better trained ones. (note there is actually a fair
amount of interesting stuff in the ICT syllabus - alas much of it does
not get taught or gets taught in a veru formulaic way because the
teachers don't have deep enough skills either to really understand what
they are doing, and develop the concepts and explore a little.

True very true - the constantly changing OFSTED criteria discourage (or at
least penalises) the more adventurous teachers if 'experimentation' goes
wrong


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If you are in a state school, and ICT is on the national curriculum,
then that is what you get...

I dont believe that thats compulsory for all say hair dressers etc in

ICT is compulsory at the moment if you follow the NC. As I alluded to,
some categories of school have more freedom to interpret manoeuvre
within the constrains of the NC.


+1

the sense that they must all fully grasp what say Word style sheets
are about, let alone some of the more sophiisticated feaures of Excel.

(although schools are finding their ways around that now)

things like the Pi just make it cheaper and at least make it possible for just about any parent to also "buy what
they use at school" should schools choose to adopt them.

Sure, but its less clear that something like the Pi
makes more sense than a netbook or a laptop.

However, I expect it being mainly taken up by the self selecting group that are already into such things.

And it remains to be seen how many kids do, either by
demanding their parents do that or driven by the parents.

But then you can also make a case for teaching quite a bit of DIY in schools too when so many chose to do stuff
like that after they have finished school too.

and in fact, some schools do. There is a local one here that
teaches building, plumbing, wiring skills etc, and even has outdoor
"pens" so that the trainees can get a feel f what it is like to
work in real world conditions for some of these tasks.

Sure, I didnt mean to imply that none do, I really just meant
that it may make more sense for most schools do to that
instead of using the Pi in schools, just because thats more
likely to be more use to more of the kids than the Pi would be.

Depends on the kids obviously. If it fires the enthusiasm for learning some "real" computer science then its
worthwhile

I'm not sure that it is if you are proposing all kids should be forced
to use it in school, even the ones that plan to be hair dressers etc.

I was not proposing that anyone should be "forced" to use any specific
bit of kit. I personally would like to see some of the basics of
software development taught alongside the office apps skills etc. I
suspect however that you would find it easier to generate enthusiasm for
a (say) a small robot being driven round an obstetrical course by a on
board Pi, than one would for something popping up on the screen of a PC.


now the mind boggles :-) lol

"def?? from wikiyuk
Obstetrics (from the Latin obstare, "to stand by") is the medical specialty
dealing with the care of all women's reproductive tracts and their children
during pregnancy (prenatal period)"

We actually have this, well, pic driven 'mars/moon lander" type robots on
the engineering diploma course avoiding obstacles - predictably the
students love it

Snipped

And then you have the other entire can of worms, whats best taught
in primary, secondardy, trade schools and university level education.

We don't really have much in the way of trade schools as such here (I
take it you refer to ones that major on vocational training rather than
academia?) which is a shame. Some of the better comprehensive schools do
now have streams that lean this way however.

We have a stream of pupils some of whom attend colleges doing different
level btec courses, run btec courses in house and the engineering diploma
these number about 100 out of a yeargroup of 400 students - its a right
b*gger to schedule i know !! Unfortunately the present education dept well
michael gove is now against this type of education despite much support fro
large manufacturing companies. Education here is a political footbal. In
the 22 years I have been in it we have changed course about 5 times - it
takes an average of 5 years to get changes through (due to the nature of
students growing up) so the system is in effect constant flux




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