On Oct 26, 6:46*pm, RicodJour wrote:
On Oct 26, 12:45*pm, harry wrote:





On Oct 26, 3:21*pm, RicodJour wrote:
On Oct 26, 2:22*am, harry wrote:

It's not possible to balance a system because heating requirements
vary around the house depending on weather conditions and other
activities.

Are you some sort of rare orchid that requires a precise temperature
+/-1 degree to live? *Regardless of weather conditions and "other
activities", heat does not stay put. *It moves about. *If your
thermostat is set at that Hot House Harry optimum, there will easily
be a five or ten degree swing in temperature in that particular room.
You understand that much, right?

Eg it you turn the TV or even the lights on it produces heat, a
thermostat will turn the room heating down.

You are a veritable font of prejudice, bias and misinformation,
wrapped in a sugarplum coating of misanthropy.

I find it difficult to address your Rule Britannia! mentality without
accidentally laying into the British, but I realize that you are an
anomaly and in no way reflect a thinking man's perspective. *For
instance, your average person would understand that no one at any
point mentioned balancing a system permanently, as that is only
possible in a closed system at a particular point in time, with a
constant heat source. *You know - imaginary, much like your logic.

Your average sane person would realize that, unlike you, they have
friends and family that can bear to be in the same room with them. *If
there are two people in a room, you have two different opinions on
what the thermostat setting should be. *Three people - four opinions.
Conduct a little test - next time you are in a room and it's two
degrees too cold for you, you great sloth, ask a 50ish woman with
perspiration on her upper lip if she'd like you to turn up the heat.
After you can see straight again, report back here on your findings.

There have also been rumors that people are warm-blooded and can
actually produce heat from food. *I suppose in your lethargic layabout
world, exercise is anathema, and even getting up and moving about
requires the greatest effort. *So it is understandable that you are
seeking that constant supremely regulated temperature of the womb so
you have one less thing to do for yourself. *Most people don't have
those issues.

Do give exercise a try. *It regulates your metabolism and helps you
deal with temperatures a couple of degrees higher or lower than what
you believe is required by all.

You really are a half wit. *I see you have cunningly moved from
denying that I am right to questioning the need for this level of
control.

Au contraire, mon ferret, I quite clearly called you non compos mentis
_and_ that you were wrong in both specifics and details.

Take for instance one of your other inane posts where you spout about
gross efficiency and buy into some claim of heating efficiency greater
than 100%. *Regardless of how _you_ look at it, it is misleading.
You're buying the amp with the volume control that goes to 11. *Google
it.

Run it by me again how a TRV works. *Someone is cold in the house and
everyone else is warm, how does the TRV call for heat in that one
radiator? *More importantly, why would you want to fire a boiler for
one radiator? *Talk about wasteful.

The thermostat can be set to the temperature needed in that room. Not
all rooms need to be a the same temperature. Hallways for example can
be set down a few degree slower.

If other heat forms cause heating (eg sun shining in the window,
electrical appliances-TV, refrigerator) the thermostat will turn the
heating down or off in that room.

Wind changes can cause a change in the temperature in one part of more
than others. Thermostats will compensate for this,

Individuals can set (say bed)room temperatures to their own
preference.

I would have thought all this was perefctly obvious to al lbut the
most dense.



You also ignore, conveniently, the costs of installation and
maintenance of a needlessly more complex system.

The system is no more complex, the thermostatic valve cost a couple of
pounds more than a manual valve.

The point of accurate temperature control is not only to do with
comfort but energy saving. If the temperature in *a heated area is
reduced by only a couple of unnecesary degrees, large savings can be
made.

You do understand that the human heating apparatus is far more
variable, and its sensing mechanism far more sensitive to perceived
temperature, than a thermostat, right? *You do know that a person's
heat output and sense of temperature varies by time of day, when food
is consumed, and the thoughts they are thinking, right? *You do know
that only an idiot looks at a thermostat to see if they are warm or
cool, right? *Oops. *Sorry.


Don't revert to drivel. You mean you go leaping for the heat control
every time you eat a hamburger?
If i want, I can buy a thermostat accurate to1/10 of a degree well
outside human perception.. As for your remark about perception, this
is a case for the use of thermostats.The temperature needs to be
controlled by objective means not subjective means

I don't dither with things. *If I am a bit cool, I put on a long
sleeve shirt. *If I'm a bit warm I roll up the sleeves. *No technology
can possibly sense where on my body I am cool/warm and adjust just
that area. *I have arms, legs and a brain and I use them to temper my
environment to suit me. *I don't see a need to lay about waiting for
it to be done for me. *That way lays obesity and sluggish thinking.
Oops, again. *Sorry.

More drivel. So y'all sit about the house in overcoats if it happens
to get cold. Is this some American cult thingI haven't heard about?
The object of the exercise is to maintain each room at the set
temperature regardless of weather and activities within the house.
The closer temperature is maintained to set temperature the better
comfort will be and the more energy saved.

Accurate temperature control can easily knock 25% off the energy
bill.

Easily knock 25% of an energy bill for someone who has an unbalanced
system and dithers with a thermostat to 'fix' it. *Sure - that I can
buy.

I have explained the "balancing" is ********.
Even supposing it was possible to "balance" a sytem for one set of
conditions, it would be wrong when these conditions changed.
Try to keep up!

You could also save 25% on your heating bill by burning some of that
excess adipose swaddling your carcass, and not sit in your recliner
with your TV remote wondering when someone will bring some food for
you to stuff into your gob.

Tch tch. Resorting to abuse again. I have never been out of work. In
my spare time I have extensively renovated/constructed several houses.
What was my work? Oh, energy efficiency/hospital engineer for forty
years.



The problem with "balancing" is that the boiler needs a constant water
flow and the heating system needs a constant pressure.

Really? *So it's pointless to use mass as a heat sink? *Pointless to
incorporate passive means to retain and distribute heat? *Remind me to
tell that to the Earth.

An irrelevent remark.
My house uses zero net energy, it is entirely solar heated. I make
extensive use of thermal mass.
I export electricity from a solar array. So the energy company pays
me three times more than I pay them.
Thermal mass can help or hinder depending on the usage of the heated
space.


There are many other heating/cooling technologies too such as optimum
start, weather prediction etc. *Equally unknown to you I imagine.

So, instead of using the actual temperature, an accurate measurement
at the thermostat location, you would prefer to use some right-50%-of-
the-time weather prediction algorithm. *Sure, makes perfect sense.

Predictive heating controls can save a further 10% off the heating
bill. They analyse the rate of rise/fall of outdoor temperature and
make descisions about boiler startup/temperature.
They also self learn the heating characteristics of the building.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Program... ID_controller
http://www.heatmiser.co.uk/support/article-145.html

If you're talking about some heat storage mechanism and electrical
heat where buying power in the off hours saves money, _then_ you
wouldn't be talking out of your fundamental orifice.

Makes perfect sense in certain circumstanses.



Humans have simple needs. *You have simple thoughts.
Buy technology and fix everything! *Yep, sure, never fails. *Sheesh.

Everything's simple to the simple-minded.
Buy technology and save money.
You have had energy (too) cheap in America for years.
Now you're gonna have to learn some new tricks if you want to afford
to keep your houses warm.

Anyway, you grow wearisome. *Feel free to blather as I ignore you
until I feel a further need to poke you with a stick.

Free free any time :-)