On 10/5/2011 12:11 PM, Hell Toupee wrote:
On 10/4/2011 7:24 PM, George wrote:
On 10/4/2011 11:31 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

"George" wrote


Likely you know you can't just cherry pick specific sections of any
legal documents. Legal writings are intentionally crafted by lawyers
to be obtuse and confusing To insure their existence. One of the fatal
errors any lay person can make is to look at a specific paragraph and
think they know the answer.


Cherry pick? The entire legal document is at the ling for you to
peruse.
Seems petty straightforward ,even for a legal document.

Surely you aren't claiming that finding one document is the be all and
end all? But wouldn't life be nice if things were so simple? No
lawyers would ever be needed. You could just cherry pick what applied
to you and go with it. Instead of the common scenario of little things
like what/which governing body has authority and what trumps what, or
which version governs or which rule supersedes which.

I am working on a project now that has dragged out since last winter
for those very reasons.

Dude. Just admit you were wrong and move on.

But I have no reason to disbelieve my friend who told me about the
issues one of his families businesses is having. I called him and he
said his sister manages their Cstores (a bunch and 20 dispenser class
stores) and would ask her for details.


Here's what the September 2011 issue of Consumer Reports has to say:

"New Federal Reserve rules that go into effect on Oct. 1 limit fees on
debit-card transactions to 21 cents plus 0.05 percent of the value of
the purchase. Fees for credit-card payments, which average about 2
percent, were not changed, though merchants can set a $10 minimum on
credit-card purchases. Retailers can offer price discounts for cash
payment."

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/m...view/index.htm


Here's an article from The Merchant Council also making the point that
merchants can offer cash discounts, and some cards even permit
surcharges for card use:

http://www.merchantcouncil.org/merch...e-customer.php


Passing Credit Card Processing Charges to Customers
Yes! You can pass credit card processing fees to customers, but you must
do it properly.

As credit card processing gets more expensive, a burning merchant
account question on the mind of many business owners is, "can I pass
credit card processing fees on to my customers, and if so, how?" In
short, the answer is yes; you can charge customers a fee for paying with
a credit card, but the issue is far more complex than that.

For merchants, the ability to accept credit cards comes with many
benefits with the only real downside being the cost of doing so. It's
possible to eliminate this cost by passing it to customers, but
originators like VISA, MasterCard, American Express and Discover don't
want merchants to charge customers a fee to pay with a credit card. The
reason is pretty obvious. A fee would deter people from using their
credit card which would ultimately cause originators to lose money.

Here's what the originators have to say about passing credit card
processing fees to customers.

VISA states that "you may not impose any surcharges on VISA
transactions. You may, however, offer a discount for cash or another
form of payment (e.g., proprietary card or gift certificate) provided
that the offer is clearly disclosed to customers and the cash price is
presented as a discount from the standard price charged for all other
forms of payment"1

MasterCard states that "A Merchant must not directly or indirectly
require any Cardholder to pay a surcharge or any part of any Merchant
discount or any contemporaneous finance charge in connection with a
Transaction. A Merchant may provide a discount to its customers for cash
payments."2

Discover states that "You may assess a surcharge on a Card Sale
conducted using a Credit Card provided that (i) the amount of the
surcharge may not exceed the Merchant Fee payable by you to us for the
Card Sale, and (ii) you assess surcharges on card sales conducted using
other credit cards accepted by you."3

American Express states that "You must not accept the Card for costs or
fees over the normal price of your goods or services (plus applicable
taxes) or Charges that Cardmembers have not specifically approved."4

Every originator except for Discover forbids surcharging credit card
sales, however, as MasterCard so clearly states, "A Merchant may provide
a discount to its customers for cash payments." This statement holds the
secret to passing credit card processing fees on to customers. The trick
isn't charging customers more for using a credit card; it's charging
them less for using cash.

In order to charge customers for credit card processing fees you must
create a dual pricing model. To accomplish this, raise all prices to
offset processing fees and then offer a discount on cash purchases
that's equal to the price increase.

The catch is that the cash price must be presented as a discount to the
true price. This means that price tags, signage and advertisements must
display the higher (credit card) price first and then display the lower
(cash discount) price as a discount. For example, many gas stations
offer a cash discount but they post the higher (credit card) price on
their roadside signage.

Passing credit card processing fees to customers may seem like a great
business idea at first but it's possible that it could hurt business.
Consider this; if customers fail to look past the higher (credit card)
price to notice the lower (cash discount) price they may assume that
your business has higher prices than your competitors.

Perhaps the biggest issue to consider before charging customers to pay
with a credit card is that some customers want or even need to pay with
their card. If paying with a card means a higher cost at your business,
these customers will likely go elsewhere. This is especially true in
tough economic times when consumers are more likely to spend on credit.

It is possible to pass credit card processing fees to customers by
offering a discounted cash price, but doing so may cost more in lost
sales than the processing fees that you're avoiding.

Note: Charging a convenience fee is a direct way of charging customers
for using a credit but it's far more complicated than offering a cash
discount. The subject of convenience fees is beyond the scope of this
particular article. You can read more about this topic by reading the
article about convenience fees.

1 - Source: "Card Acceptance and Chargeback Management Guidelines for
VISA Merchants", Section "VISA Rules", "No Surcharging"
2 - Source: "MasterCard Rules" page 124, "Charges to Cardholders"
3 - Source: "Discover Operating Manual", page 24, "Surcharges"
4 - Source: "American Express Operating Procedures for US Merchants"
section 1.7, "Prohibited Use of the Card"