Wild_Bill wrote:
Maybe you know of a heat pump that will illuminate a house, and only
cost the owner about $20 per year to purchase.

**I don't. And YOU don't know of a lamp that can heat a house (or cool one)
either. Using lights to warm a home is insane. Pretty much like everything
else you've posted.


Production of plastics pollutes, so does gallium arsenide, and
mercury in CFLs.

**No one disputes that. Production of almost any manufactured item causes
some kind of pollution. That is why regulators ensure that the pollution
created is dealt with appropriately. Fortunately, LEDs last a VERY long time
and consume small amounts of material, so total pollution remains low.

Were you born yesterday?

**Did the manufacturing process of computer you are presently using cause
zero pollution? Are you insane?


Just because the pollution takes place somewhere else doesn't mean it
doesn't effect all.

**I am well aware of that. I am also a supporter of organisations that
attempt to minimise pollution caused by large manufacturers of many
products. Are you?

Ubuntu.

Some say that only about 1% of the water on this planet is drinkable,
although there's plenty that's contaminated with toxic chemicals and
disease.
Many people drink and bathe in poisonous, disease polluted water, but
that shouldn't concern you.

**Like I said: I contribute financially to several organisations that are
active in trying to ensure that people less fortunate than I am are not
subject to pollution from large companies. Do you?


Who is dying from silicon?

**The manufacture of glass, steel and tungsten is a very energy intensive
process. Combined with the extremely short life-span of incandescent lamps
and their monsterous inefficiency (Less than 5%) contributes to huge amounts
of CO2. CFLs and LEDs cause far less CO2 to be emitted, both in manufacture
and in operation over the life of the product. CO2 affects every human on
the planet.


Dealing with pollution means having the nasty **** made somewhere
else.. like a poor country.

**Like I said before.....


Proof? Where's the proof that the incandescent light bulb you bought
was packaged in plastic?

**Geez! You think I keep the packaging? Get real.

For how long have incandescents been packaged in paper products..
well over 100 years. Those paper packages are broken down, but old
plastics continue to pollute.

**Like I said befo Both the LEDs and the CFLs were packed in cardboard,
whilst the incandescent was packed in cardboard and plastic.


You going to burn those scrap plastics to generate more power? How
about in your town?

**WFT are you smoking?

Obviously you haven't seen any reports of huge artificial island-like
masses in the oceans, made up of discarded plastic products/waste.

**Incorrect.


The "extremely" long life of CFLs and now LEDs is a projected number.

**No. It is a REAL number, verified by many users. Myself included. NONE of
my CFLs have failed. Not one. OTOH, I've replaced many incandescents over
the same period, despite the fact that they accrue VASTLY fewer hours of
use.

As I've mentioned elsewhere, I have yet to get over 2 years of life
from those "5-7 year" CFLs I've been buying for over a decade.

**You're either:

* Lying.
* Buying cheap, crappy CFLs
* Using them in enclosed fittings.


Did you eat a lot of lead paint as a child? It was banned and lead
paint was replaced it with a new latex paint.. which contained
mercury.

**Strawman.


You don't mention how many of those first-generation LEDs you're
using, are the only lighting in a room. Maybe you're referring to
night lights, like the ones that show where walls are when you're
walking around in the dark.

**I'm referring to first generation white LEDs.

So how many of those buggers does it take
to light a room?

**Irrelevant. They have lasted extremely well.

I mean bright enough so everything can be seen.
At night, so you can see the pattern in the carpet, or read a book or
find a pencil dropped under a table.
Like I stated before.. the new LED lamps I've seen won't fit many
existing light fixtures, so get ready to spend.

**And, on the other side of the coin, modern LEDs can be manufactured into
completely new and different shapes.


One way to insure that LED lighting won't be cheaper in the future is
to ban other types of lighting.. apparently you delight in being
gullible.

**I delight in arguing with idiots like you.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au