Cross-Slide wrote:

Say for example, you had a reference signal leaving Minneapolis, and
the peak of that wave will arrive in Chicago some time later. If there
is only One single line between these two centers, no problem...

Now add in the grid. The peak of that 60 HZ sine wave arrives at
Chicago, and the peak is also traveling from Minneapolis to Denver,
then on to Chicago.... The time is not the same for the two possible
paths.. There needs to be power moving back and forth...

With the wavelength of signal smaller than the possible distances in
the grid, you cannot have it all tied together without recirculating
power...
It is Not really "recirculating", but what IS happening is PHASE
shift.



Even if a reference signal was assigned to one point in that example,
the reference cannot arrive at various points in the grid intact
because being a grid, there are multiple paths for it to follow.
Now add in multiple sources driving the grid, and you are left with
recirculating power... There is no way to have a "master" reference
for the grid...

You can have a single frequency (with a "master" reference, and still
have as many paths as you want. You WILL have phase shifts between
points, but so what?



Anytime I have talked to electric power guys, they have never heard of
or thought about the fact that the grid cannot be in sync, without
having recirculating power..

I am one, perhaps you were not understanding their response.


They always refer to the grid has an infinite source and sink of
reactive power... it gobbles up the MVARS, or supplies them to keep
the generator perfectly in sync.
Not true, they will be in "sync" from a frequency point of view, but
not in phase.

You can open or close the wicket
gates to push more or less power to the grid. The voltage and
frequency are locked,
Frequency is "locked"ish, but the voltage is not!

You change your local voltage [To a degree] by varying exitation. You
also change the level of vars you exchange with the system.

If you are not paralleled with a system, then all you change is the
voltage, if you are connected to a very stiff part of a system, all
you really cahnge is vars.

but pushing harder against it will push more
amps... or pushing softer will push less amps...

Not entirely. YOu puch more power or less power, which means more or
less amps, but you can push more amps by vary8ing exitation and hence
the vars. So it is POSSIBLE to push more power, and fewer vars and
end up at the same amps (Within some farily small limits)

IF you are not connected to a system, opening the gate just increases
frequency (=speed ) if your load takes more power at a higher
frequency it will also generate more power. If not, then your speed
will increase until something destroys itself, or speed related losses
reduce the accelerating torque to 0, or an overspeed device kicks in
to shut the gate.

jk