On Jan 15, 7:17*am, "John R. Carroll"
wrote:
"Bruce In Bangkok" wrote in messagenews:mn9um4hd3snkm0eh9v55afuh8ismedvfnq@4ax .com...





rOn Thu, 15 Jan 2009 02:48:21 -0600, cavelamb
wrote:

Bruce In Bangkok wrote:
On Thu, 15 Jan 2009 00:07:35 -0600, cavelamb
wrote:

Bruce In Bangkok wrote:
On Wed, 14 Jan 2009 20:06:03 -0500, "Buerste" wrote:

"Ignoramus18994" wrote in
message
news:apqdndM8kec9GfPUnZ2dnUVZ_iydnZ2d@gigane ws.com...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...09/01/13/AR200...

My question, though, is whether those who condemn torture are prepared
to justify their stance should the failure to gain information known
the detainee result in an atrocity such as the WTC?

Perhaps a statement such as "Yes I know that the failure to obtain
information known to the detainees may result in an atomic weapon
being detonated in Times Square resulting in 257,000 fatalities and
possible another 1/4 million dying in the following 12 months due to
radioactive poisoning, and I am prepared to accept that I am solely
responsibility, both legally and morally, should an event of this
nature occur"?

You are assuming the absence of other prevention methods.
Good intelligence and investigative law enforcement are what prevent crimes
of this nature.
Every single instance, for example, of prevention in the CONUS since 9-11
has been the result of coordinated intelligence collection and good old
fashioned police work.

Homeland Security is something of a cock up. You can't give unfettered power
to an enforcement agency.
America should have followed the British model.
The effort undertaken by the States, individually but now connectedly, and
known as "Fusion Centers" is what has made the difference.
They have absolutely zero enforcement power but they collect and archive an
incredible amount of data in a searchable format.
They are an archive, for instance, of every call or report made to or by a
public agency in the areas they serve. This information is then entered,
shared and analyzed.The tools at hand to conduct such analysis are truly
amazing and get better every day. One of the advantages of this approach is
that there is little chance for "mischief", if you take my meaning.

In other words, the dots get connected. That's what works, even in the face
of initial resistance at the federal level.



Far fetched, possibly, but 9/11 was unthinkable on 8/11....

Hardly.
Not only had it been thought of, it had been a genuine concern and was
outlined in a PDB on 8-12.

Cheers,

And to you.
One final thought. A famous American once said "Give me liberty or give me
death".
What he meant wasn't that he'd trade a modicum of freedom to save his own
skin.
That's what cowards do - betray their principals out of hand.
He meant he'd rather go down fighting, to the death if it came to that,
than do so.
America is either a country of men or of laws.

JC- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

And Bush is an AWOL...that should have given us a hint of what was to
come.

TMT