On Dec 29, 10:11*pm, "RBM" wrote:
"DerbyDad03" wrote in message

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On Dec 29, 8:00 pm, "RBM" wrote:





"John Grabowski" wrote in message

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"RBM" wrote in message
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"John Grabowski" wrote in message
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"DerbyDad03" wrote in message
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On Dec 29, 4:12 pm, " wrote:
On Dec 29, 4:03 pm, DerbyDad03 wrote:

On Dec 29, 3:16 pm, "John Grabowski"
wrote:

"DerbyDad03" wrote in message

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On Dec 29, 9:57 am, "John Grabowski"
wrote:

"DerbyDad03" wrote in message

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On Dec 29, 7:21 am, "RBM" wrote:

"DerbyDad03" wrote in message

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Happy Holidays!

What does the NEC say about running a circuit from a single
breaker to
"unrelated" locations of a house?

For example, let's say I want to add a receptacle in the
1st
floor
family room. Let's say the feed to a 2nd floor bedroom runs
along the
basement ceiling right below where I want to add the
receptacle. Is
there anything in the NEC that says I can't tap into the
2nd
floor
circuit to add an outlet in a 1st floor room?

This is really just a curiosity thing, not something I have
a
need to
do. I'm just wondering if it's OK to run a circuit from one
breaker to
all sorts of different locations in a house.

Thanks!

The answer depends upon the particular circuit, where it's
going to and
doing currently, and where you want to locate it and for what
purpose.
For
example, you can't tap into a kitchen counter outlet circuit,
or a
dedicated
bathroom outlet circuit, for an outlet in a bedroom- Hide
quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

So, assuming it's not a circuit that needs to be dedicated by
code,
it's OK for it to run hither and yon throughout the house?

As another example, I have a circuit containing one duplex
receptacle
in my 1st floor living room that was dedicated for a computer
that no
longer exists. Can I tap into that run and add a duplex
receptacle in
my 2nd floor hallway?

*Yes. Although this is permissible by code I would not get too
carried
away
with spreading outlets all over the house from one existing
circuit. I
have
been in many older homes where after years of adding outlets
and
lights
there is no rhyme nor reason as to the circuiting. It gets very
confusing
and inconvenient when you need to shut off a bedroom outlet,
but
it is
connected to the bathroom lights. It is also a PITA when it
comes
to
identifying circuits and labeling the circuit breaker panel.

I was recently looking at a job and the homeowner was telling
me
about one
problem he wants corrected. His garage outlet is connected to
one
kitchen
outlet and one den outlet as a result of an addition being put
on
to the
house a few years ago. When he is using a power tool and his
wife
is
cooking the breaker blows and kills the stereo as well.- Hide
quoted
text -

- Show quoted text -

OK, so now that I know that in a generic sense it's ok to have
circuits scattered hither and yon, how about something more
specific:

Years ago I ran a circuit from the breaker box to the crawlspace
attic. Currently on this circuit a

- The crawlspace lights (2 fixtures switched in the attic)
- The bathroom exhaust fan
- 1 receptacle in the attic for a cable-TV distribution amplifier
- 1 receptacle in the upstairs hallway, typically used for
vacuuming,
etc.

I now want to add a second GFI receptacle in the 2nd floor
bathroom.
This GFI will be used for a radio mounted on a shelf. Tapping
into
the
"new" attic circuit would be a lot easier than tapping into the
original-to-the-house circuit that currently powers the bathroom
lights, the existing GFI outlet and 3 receptacles in the bedroom
next
door. In addition, the use of curling irons and blow dryers makes
me
shy away from adding anymore receptacles to the existing bathroom
circuit.

Would it be OK to use the attic circuit for the 2nd GFI in the
bathroom?

I'm open to other suggestions for wiring the new GFI except for a
dedicated circuit since I am out of space in the breaker box.

* I don't recall any usage distinction for bathroom receptacles.
Therefore
as far as I know your additional bathroom GFI receptacle would
need
to be on
a 20 amp circuit that is dedicated to bathroom use.- Hide quoted
text -

- Show quoted text -

Yeah, I didn't mean to imply that the NEC would care what I was
using
the receptacle for, but I was hoping that regardless of its use, it
wouldn't need to be dedicated. That's going to be a problem.

I don't want to turn a simple Christmas gift for my daughters into
a
major electrical upgrade. I'm not about to add a subpanel just so
they
can listen to their CDs while they put their makeup on.

Maybe I'll put the receptacle in the hallway and drill a hole
through
the wall for the cord. Kidding!- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

have you considered half width breakers? sounds like your main is
full.

quick easy fix, baths should be 20 amps- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I've used half width breakers in the past, but they always seemed to
fail. I was even told by an electrician that they don't last as long,
but this was many years ago. I eventually replaced them with full
widths, never expecting to fill up the box.

It's a Crouse-Hinds panel. Any suggestions on a decent half width
breaker?

* The Crouse-Hinds panel should be able to take a BR type breaker.
Siemens (And Murray) and Cutler-Hammer both make this in a twin style.
Read the label in the panel to see if it is approved for two breakers
on
one buss. If the half width breakers that you used in the past had the
hook on the side then I am quite familiar with their failure rate. The
BR twins will be much better.
The ones with the external hooks on them were real garbage, but all of
the new ones Murray (Crouse-Hinds) makes are fine. They do make a few
models though, and not all will fit every panel

*Roy there are several condo/townhouse housing developments built by the
same builder in NJ. They all have that hook type breaker and I am amazed
at the failure rate. Good for my business though. What is really
surprising is that the panels are approved for other types of breakers
yet
they chose to install this type which was hard to find in stock when
Crouse-Hinds was in business. I surmised that they got a fantastic deal
as it was around the time when Crouse-Hinds and Challenger were getting
bought out.

These days, it seems all the condo's in Westchester all use QO panels, but
twenty years ago, it seemed like they bought whatever company was in their
death throws, FPE, Zinsco, etc. Those external hook breakers look to me
like
they'd get very little contact with the buss, kinda like Murray's version
of
Stab-lok

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- Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

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Thanks guys! Yep, I recall a hook, so we must be talking about the
same crappy breakers. I'll look into the BR twins.

Damn...now I might have even more wiring to do. There's a few more
circuits that I have always wanted to split but the Central Air I had
installed a few years back used up the last open spots.

Murray also makes quad half sized breakers. Its a one piece breaker with 4
poles, and comes in a variety of combinations including two sets of double
pole with amperage of your choice- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Wow! With enough quad breakers I could put every receptacle on it's
own circuit!