"RogerN" wrote in message
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"Harold and Susan Vordos" wrote in message
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snip---

I agree with most of what you say. But what you say applies to you too.
No amount of evidence that could be provided will sway you from your
chosen belief.

You're wrong on that one. I damned well can be swayed, but it takes more
than words that can not be proven. Evidence, Roger, **Real evidence**, not
just a bunch of words put on paper. Anyone can write a book. Show me one
shred of evidence that we are here because of a supreme being. One shred.

ONE, Roger.

Look at it like this, Roger. You believe in God. You *know* he/she/it
exists. Trouble is, so does the other guy, and he's every bit as
dedicated as you are, perhaps even more so. If there is a creator, why is
it that people can't agree on one? Seems to me, each sect creates one
that fits their criteria, so they can control others to their liking.

There are those in churches that believe in handling snakes and
drinking poison based on a single Bible verse that isn't even in the
earliest and most reliable texts. If you want to prove that there is
nothing to their belief then grab a rattler and take a good swig of what
they say is poison. They believe and act on their faith and get results.

Nonsense.

Cites, if you have them.

He then examined the evidence and guess what, he became a Christian.

____There is no evidence to examine. That's the problem. ________

You have some moral values that are from the Bible but what good is that
since you don't believe in the Bible anyway?

See what's wrong with religious people?

Are you suggesting that unless a person is religious that he/she is wasting
their time doing the right thing?

You believe in hard work but many people with more than you don't believe
in hard work. You don't want to cheat people but many that do cheat
people are more successful than you.

For starters, this isn't a competition. I am what I am, and I am not the
least bit concerned with the success, or lack thereof, of others. As for
those that cheat people being more successful than am I, how so? Money
does not make a man------nor does being underhanded. There's one thing I
do very well, Roger, and that's sleep at night. I don't have to look over
my shoulder, wondering who may be catching up to me.

So, what do you base your (Moral/Biblical) beliefs on?

Something you may not understand. It's called personal pride. I try to do
to others that which I'd like done to me. I don't steal, I don't cheat, and
I am faithful to my wife. Oh, yeah, did I mention I don't like religious
people?

I do these things so I can be proud of myself, not because I fear some force
will strike me down. I do it because it's the right thing to do. The
action of doing the right thing is my reward. Are you telling me that
were it not for God, you'd be an asshole? See what I mean? I'd rather, by
far, keep company with a common whore than a religious person. At least
she'd be honest about herself.

Mans desire to not be held accountable for his sin is as old as sin and
guilt. To be free from accountability, the God of the Bible must not
exist, hence mans desperation to believe there is no God, and therefore
come up with any kind of scientific sounding explanation of How without a
Cause.

More nonsense, Roger. More nonsense. None of that fits my description,
and I have no interest in pursuing this to that end.

Anything Science can come up with that supports our existence without a
God, the Atheists jump all over it, did we come from brown sea weed or one
of the other two theories? Or have they made up other theories now?

I'm a little troubled with anyone that finds it insulting to consider that
we may have evolved from simple life forms. Why? What's so special about
humans? Evidence supports the concept that we sprang from lesser life
forms. Why would that be so hard to accept? How is that demeaning to
you? Why are you insulted by the concept------especially when it may well
have been the vehicle of choice for man's creation-----a choice made by this
God you worship.


Like I said, since you think there's nothing to it go to a church and grab
a handful of cottonmouths, copperheads, and rattlesnakes with one hand and
a glass of poison with the other hand and show them stupid believers that
you can do anything they can. Years ago I saw video of this on TV, I
think it was Hardcopy with Maury Povich or something like that, they
showed the snake handling in the churches and the drinking poison, they
sent some of the poison to a lab to have it tested and found out it really
was poison. Must have been slight of hand, go prove them wrong. Make
sure you document everything so we can read about it and learn in case you
don't survive.

Tell you what we can do, smart ass------lets the two of us go to one of
these churches and I'll watch you drink the poison. After all, you're the
one that believes-----*I do not*. Surely, with all your faith, you'll
walk away unscathed.

****Surely.****

Of course, you're not going to take me up on the challenge, because your
faith isn't what you proclaim it to be. You don't REALLY believe that
you're not going to die if you accepted the challenge.

You can knock off the bull**** and get on with real issues. It is common
for those that deal with reptiles to take regular doses of their poisons to
build a tolerance. I have no way of knowing is that be the case with these
morons you speak of, nor was I there to witness anything you claim, nor have
I read any reports that support what you claim. It's just more of the smoke
and mirrors used by religious nuts to prove they're stupid. No need,
really----most of us already understand they are.

Show me some evidence, not showboat stuff. This conversation has degraded
to nonsense-----you have nothing to provide in support of your position
aside from your unsubstantiated claims. This conversation has worn out
its welcome.

Harold