On Jul 24, 6:43*pm, Anagram wrote:
ransley wrote :

True high effeciency will cost you, its called a condensing unit. Why
18", I think you will be out of luck. AO Smith is a good brand with
many different units up to maybe 85 EF. I have NG tankless and I have
yet to hear anybody here complain that actualy has one or knew a dam
about what they were talking about, complaining without knowing facts
from actual use seems to be a way people justify their present 50%
efficent tanks.

18" is what will fit where my present water heater is. *We could make a
little more room by moving some pipes, but not much.

I still might get a tankless. *But we're leaning the other way right now.

Here are some of the concerns we have about tankless:

1. *We're concerned that it might not always give us as much hot water as
we want. *If washing machine and dishwasher are running, and someone is
taking a shower, it could be stretched to its limit, and, if someone else
turns on a hot water faucet, the shower might suddenly get cold bullets or
whatever. *If we connected two tankless together, it could be a problem for
our NG supply, and two cost more than one.

2. *The supply of cold water to our house might not always be high enough
pressure. *We get the vague impression that our water pressure varies,
possibly depending on usage by neighbors. *It's probably not a problem, but
it's one more minor worry.

3. *We're thinking of putting in new insulated hot water pipes, running
through our access-only attic, to all of our hot water faucets etc. *A tank
water heater would keep those pipes partly warm, so we wouldn't have to
wait as long for hot water after turning a faucet on.

4. *The tankless we want requires an electric outlet, for its ignition. *It
looks like we would have to do some wiring, because we don't see any
electric outlet in the utility closet, but just conduit going to our
furnace from the wall.

5. *If it turns out to have problems, the problems are most likely to be in
our pipes or whatever, and not the fault of the manufacturer. *Therefore,
such problems would not be covered by the warranty. *A lot of people regret
getting a tankless for that very reason, and feel stuck with it, because it
would cost them too much to replace it with a tank, having already spent
their budget on the tankless.

6. *When such problems happen, the plumber often can't figure them out, and
spends too much time on them, then starting thinking of that customer as a
problem customer.

7. *If energy prices keep going up, I want to consier other options, such
as solar etc., and/or maybe get a geothermal heat pump for heating and air
conditioning, and get hot water from that same system. *If I spend a lot on
a tankless now, that reduces my budget for that.

And you will possibly need 1" gas line if the run is long. Shop Energy
Factor or EF in your tank decision. EF is what it costs to heat the
water, many cheap tanks are still 55-60 EF so only 55-60 cents of
every dollar heats water, there are tanks, Condensing near 85 EF. I
own one its a commercial $2200 AO Smith Cyclone, But there is a
tankless of
93 EF !! A regular BW might be 60 EF or less