"ian field" schreef in bericht
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"john jardine" wrote in message
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"ian field" wrote in message
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Does anyone have any info on whether MPLAB has RS232 compatible
programmer
support?

Having downloaded a number of programmer schematics, I've found that a
couple (Serpic & David Tait) that are very similar to the Velleman K8048
and
wondered if this is some sort of industry standard.

If anyone is interested, the examples including Velleman K8048 schematic
are
easy to find with google.

The RS232 connector is as follows:

Pin7 (RTS); CLK/RB6/PGC
Pin4 (DTR); DATA/RB7/PGD
Pin8 (CTS); DATA/RB7/PGD
Pin3 (TXD); Pin3 & Pin9 hardwired together
Pin9 (RI); VPP/MCLR(NOT)

Each signal has a transistor buffer/level converter between the RS232
+-12V
and PIC logic levels.

TIA.


Just seen the post. No they don't. If your programmer isn't in the drop
down
box in Mplab then forget it.
There are reasonably priced programmers out there that pretend to be a
'Picstart Plus' (say) but their makers have gone to the trouble of
copying
the Mplab proprietry programming command and reply strings. Essentially
the
copiers have had to clone a Mchip product, resulting in complexity and
unavoidable minimum costs.
There's no security or future proofing in exclusively using Mchip Mplab
or
compatable proggers either. My ICD1 cost £125 and was obsoleted after 6
months when the better flash chips came out. I'm not shelling out again
for
an ICD2.
The Picstart Plus I bought cost £150. Obsolete after a year. Mchip say
they've dealt with these type of problems but I've lost faith and don't
believe 'em.
At present I'm using a Picstart Plus clone but as I write and assemble my
progs outside Mplab then I get no benefit, as I have to start up Mplab
purely to prog a PIC. May as well be using one of the cheap programmers I
used before.
Commercially, a few hundred pounds here and there on Mchip kit can be
amortised over a product run of thousands and the customer pays. From a
hobby POV I'd suggest sticking with an external progger and putting up
with
dropping in/out of Mplab to do your progging.


Did I make a big mistake aiming to learn PIC?!


Sure you did. As would be for all the micros you try to learn. Try another
and you will run into similar problems. You will also learn that even the
most different micros have a lot in common as have their manufacturers.

What you want to achieve is available by third party companies. I remember I
used a Hi-Tech
http://www.htsoft.com/
PIC-compiler that made the combination you like. So after a successful
compilation the compiler give me the choice to go to an external (Hi-Lo)
programmer (or an ICE or whatever) but also gave me the choice to return to
the editor to modify the program. It was all in its IDE. Hi-Tech and others
have this kind of programs for a lot of commonly available micros.

FAIK the PIC is the most widespread among hobbyists as they were the first
that had relatively cheap and easy to program micros. They also published
the programming algorithms instead of keeping them secret which was usual at
the time. I remember I looked for the 8751 programming algorithm but no
luck. So I used a 8031 and an EPROM. Some time later my employer buyed a
huge DATA IO Unisite which could handle almost all programmable components
of that time.

As for Microchip, I don't expect them to support external programmers from
their IDE. The ICD2 has been cloned, but I don't see it to make highway. I'm
sure the communication protocol has been hacked but I could not find it (I
did not try hard). Oshonsoft sells what you want but I consider the number
of supported types too small.
http://www.oshonsoft.com/pic.html

petrus bitbyter