On 15 Jan 2007 15:07:10 -0800, "lsmartino"
wrote:


Rod Speed ha escrito:

Michael Kennedy wrote:

Separate matter entirely to the mindlessly silly claim that
its even possible to design an appliance to break about a
year after the warranty runs out, with most appliances.

Why do you say it is impossible?

Because it is impossible ? Novel concept I realise.


Please explain how the manufacturer of a light bulb, fluorescent lamp
or CFL can provide an estimate of the lifetime of the lamp. Don´t say
"They can´t because it´s impossible". Explain exactly why it´s
impossible.

MTBF is a standard ENGINEERING concept. The fact it is not available
from many manufacturers for many products is due to the fact there is
NO ENGINEERING involved. A product is "copied" and "modified for
production".This is dictated by COST. As long as it works when it
leaves the factory, and a small sample lasts (at least a reasonable
percentage of the sample) longer than the 90 day warranty, they are
happy. As for brands and brand loyalty, who even has a clue WHO makes
90% of the consumer electronics products on the market today.
Previously quality brand names are now simply licenced and attatched
to product from unknown and unspecified offshore manufacturing
concerns. The typical North American consumer doesn't know or care who
made the product they buy, and will buy another made by the same
manufacturer, under a different name, and not have a clue. It's nice
looking, or has "gee whiz" factor, or brand cachet (they've seen it
advertized by a catchy, moronic TV ad) so they buy it.

When designing the product the engineers figure the average useage of the appliance every day and
then calculate about how long it will take before a failure.

Nice theory. The reality is that that isnt even
possible with most domestic appliances.

Domestic? What's domestic? Made in Mexico? Made in Peurto Rico? Made
in Guam? Or assembled in "north America" of imported parts?

It isnt even feasible with stuff as basic as an incandescent light bulb.
A CFL in spades. A moulded power cord or plug pack in spades.

They also do product reliability testing to see how long on average it is before a product fails.

No they dont with domestic appliances.

When did you last work for a domestic appliance or electronics
manufacturer that you can say they do not with authority?

And are you an engineer that you can claim with impunity that it is
impossible????

I'll give you IMPRACTICAL at today's price-point, with today's
de-centralized offshore "manufacturing" and the lack of engineering
involved in the manufacture. Have you SEEN a chinese electronics
"factory" MANY of the parts are built/assembled by totally unskilled
workers (including children) in "cottage industries" and then
assembled either in a central facility or by another "cottage
industry", then packaged and collected to a central facility for
trans-shipment to the buyer or "north american manufacturer".

There is NO quality control. You CAN get chinese goods of exceptional
quality - and from the same "manufacturer", on the same day, get an
"identical" product of such abysmal quality you would not believe it
came from the same PLANET, muchless the same supplier.
This is why REPUTABLE distributors of chinese electronics test and
repackage ALL of their product before retailing. North american
quality control can sort the GOOD stuff, which can be sold under a
particular brand name, from the "also-rans" that are sold off to
lesser brand companies to sell at a lower cost and/or to a less
discriminating clientelle.

They dont even do that with mass market hard drives anymore.


Depends what you call "mass market" If a company puts their name and a
2 or 3 year warranty on a hard drive, they have either calculated or
empirically tested the product so they KNOW what their warranty
exposure is.
If they are "selling on cost" with a 90 day warranty, nothing has been
either tested or calculated.(beyond the fact they are making enough
that they can break even if a few more than they guessed fail, and 50%
of those get back for warranty within the alotted time, and are
returned according to the warranty requirement (in original
shipping/packageing).

Yes they do. The quote the useful lifetime of a hardrive in MTBF hours.
Don´t answer "it´s impossible" if you are not prepared to give a real
explanation. Samsung, Seagate, WD... any decent hard drive manufactures
gives an estimate lifetime of their products. These estimates are
provided in the datasheet of each harddrive.


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