Carl Byrns wrote:

On Sun, 30 Nov 2003 23:48:14 GMT, (Richard
Lewis) wrote:

Carl Byrns wrote:

Betcha a bagel he doesn't respond at all- that's his way of dealing
with anything he can't refute.

-Carl

That's fine, Carl. I'll be glad to refute you and Ed both.

No, you won't. All I said is Gunner won't reply to anything HE can't
refute. So far, I'm three for three.

Oh, now that's original. Talk about intelligent comebacks there. You
and Ed don't really surprise me.

Fact is, Gunner's quote was proven true as it is written and you and
Ed both said it wasn't.

Be a real man and simply admit that you were wrong and stop the Peewee
Herman arguments, bro.

By my count that is 25 states (those marked **) that allow open
carrying without any sort of permit to buy/carry etc etc etc as per
Gunner's quote.

Let's all look at the murder numbers now, shall we? What is that,
3,755 total murders in all those 25 open carry states? That's in
2000, of course....couldn't find this year's numbers. The total US
that year had 15,517 murders so that makes 11,762 in states that
restrict open carry as per Gunner's quote....and that makes a grand
total of right at 76% of all murders committed in restricted carry
states etc etc etc.

You're skewing your data to fit your argument: you don't provide a
body count for 26 states (OK, 25 and D.C.) that limit handgun
ownership.

I'm not skewing anything to prove anything. I have no stake in the
argument so I don't have to do anything beyond look at it at face
value.

The quote was "able to purchase, strap on a gun, walk down a street
with it with no permit of any kind required"....and I provided nothing
but the laws pertaining to "purchasing/open carrying" the firearm in
question.

I don't need to provide the numbers of murders in the other states
because providing one or the other allows *you* to simply subtract.

The numbers quoted were from http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/ and
yes, they are accurate because they are identical to at least two
others....I chose that site because they are simply formatted in an
easy to use manner.

None of the open carry states has anything resembling a major metro-
you just don't see that many turf wars in Maine.

So? Was that quoted in the original quote?

I live near a city that has a lively gang scene that generates a lot
of drive-by and walk-up deaths. That kind of criminal activity spikes
the state murder rate but if you go 20 miles in any direction away
from downtown, and the murder rate drops off to less than one a year
(usually a crime of passion).
In short, your data isn't worth smoke off ****, because criminal
activity doesn't occur at a state or even a county level- it's very
localized- block by block. Just because one are of one city has a high
crime rate, does that mean the whole state does? Of course not.

My data proves Gunner's quote and proves that you and Ed were/are
simply wasting my bandwidth with bull****.

BTW- I'm all for responsible firearm ownership. It's just that I don't
see that many responsible gun owners.

Really? I see millions of them a year. They're the ones who own the
firearms that don't end up in statistics and bull**** arguments with
idiots.

How's that foot tasting there, dude?

Sorry, I don't eat foot. How's the crow?

You tell me.

ral

-Carl