Frank Drackman wrote:

Sorry I should have made it more clear. I would by the MiniMax because I
think that the product is better than the Laguna. I have used both and
think that the MiniMax has less flex and cuts better.

My statements about MiniMax service are mostly about expectations. People
pay an up-charge over Grizzly, Jet, and Delta to purchase MiniMax and when
something goes wrong many times they think that MiniMax should be able to
fix their problem instantly. I don't think the Grizzly customers have the
same expectations. When MiniMax tells them that there is nothing they can
do, or that a part needs to be sent over from Europe, their expectations are
not met and they become unhappy.

Leon's story about going all the way to Austin to test a saw, with an
appointment, and going away unhappy because they didn't have a saw are
pretty typical. If you are not a member join the MiniMax group at Yahoo and
read through the message archives.


More than you probably ever wanted to know but here goes.

Knowing folks at Laguna Tools and MiniMax and owning both a Laguna
Tools Robland X31 combinatgion machine (made in Brugge Belgium)
and an LT16SEC (made in Italy by Meber) perhaps I can provide some
info to this discussion.

Laguna Tools

This company's is aimed mainly at production shops and their bread
and butter is the higher end production machines in the $20,000 to
$50,000 range. They sell mainly to people who are familiar with
powered woodworking tools, their set up, maintenance and use, not
abuse. While their markup on the lower end of their line is, shall
we say, "healthy", the profits from these units is a relatively
small part of their business. Unlike production shops, small one
and two man shops are not willing to pay an LT tech to do on site
set up, training and repairs.

Torben, LT's president,is an acomplished euro trained woodworker.
Then he discovered surfing at Laguna Beach (which is why the
company, prior to moving inland and up the road from Laguna beach,
was in Laguna Beach). He also did a lot of laminated pieces earlier
on and thus has a love for bandsawing which continues to this
day. He is repsonsible for the development of the ceramic
blade guides and the Resaw King carbide tipped bandsaw blade.
He knows bandsaws and how to use them.

He's also, let's just say, impatient when it comes to answering
what he believes to be a dumb question. He's selling tools, not
being paid to teach you how to how to set it up properly or how
to use it.

Several years ago, LT brought in a new head of marketing
because the guy guaranteed he'd at least double their sales
within two or maybe it was three years. Part of his strategy
was to dramatically increase the LT sales staff and aggressively
push LT products (if you got on their call list you WOULD get
called often, once a month or more until you bought something
from LT, and then expect a call once a week from then on).
Unfortunately, the increase in sales department staffing
did not include a corresponding increase in other LT staffing,
especially in Tech Support.

Two other strategies the new head of marketing introducedd
were
1. Opening an east coast distribution site - specifically in
New Jersey -just before a major east coast dock strike.
The east coast site also required that some of LT's west
coast tech support relocated to the east coast. You can
imagine what it took to get someone to move from Laguna
Beach, California, to New Jersey and environs.
2. replacing LT's computer system with new machines, new
software and networking the east and west coast sites
together. If you've ever gone through a "conversion"
you know that it's like trying to yank the table cloth
off a dining table, during a dinner for 12 people, and not
spilling a drop of fine wine, or even interupting the
dinner conversation. There's ALWAYS a "transition
period" during which NOTHING works - AT ALL!

BEFORE the new head of marketing's time was up he and
LT parted ways, the east coast site was closed down, the
computer system simplified and LT California was settling
down in thier new facility up the highway from their
Laguna beach facility, sans some of their tech people who'd
gone to Austin, with the former head of LT's marketing,
to set up MiniMax USA.

During this period, LT's customer support was understaffed,
with some of the most experienced people gone to a competitor.
They're still recovering.

MiniMax USA

The president of MiniMax USA is the former head of LT
marketing. He is not, to my knowledge a woodworker. His
business plan is to establish and sell MiniMax in the USA,
with plans to franchise sites in several key USA market
areas. To date, no franchises have been established.

I don't know about their current facilities, but when
I stopped in a couple of years ago to see the place and meet
the former LT staff I'd gotten to know over the phone while
they were at LT, MiniMax USA was in a small, newish,
industrial area in an "office and reception area in the front,
shop / shipping and receiving area in the back" 2500 - 3000
sf place. There was ONE combination machine set up and
a few crates in the back. Other than the receptionist out
front, there were only three guys in the back, two I knew
from LT.

Since that time, most of the MiniMax tech guys who came
from LT have returned to LT.

The MiniMax machines are well built and the sliding table
on their combi units use linear bearing sliding tables similar
to those used on Felder combis, rather than having the
tables bearings riding on two steel rods with nine sealed
bearings mounted under the table like my Robland X31.

I know a couple of former X31 owners who, having sold
their X31s when they moved, bought MiniMax combis.
Haven't heard any complaints about the MiniMax.

Either the LT or MiniMax bandsaw will probably do
what you can expect a bandsaw to do, and do it well.
As for customer support, don't expect quick fixes or
much support, neither company stocks a lot of spare
parts and the lag time to get parts can take a while,
coming from Europe and all, to say nothing of "port
security, such as it is.

If you want help with either companies "prosumer"
products find and join one of the Yahoo groups of
owners.

Just a word to the wise. In business, it's not usually
a good idea to bad mouth the competition. You can
compare your features to theirs but it's best to back
up your claims of superiority with facts.

Told you it was going to be more than you wanted to
know.

charlie b

I had to go to the Robland factory in Brugge to find
out how to set up the Robland X31, the "manuals"
SUCK! With the help of members of what is now
the Yahoo Robland X-31 group, I wrote my own
set up instructions and put it up on my woodworking
site. LT tech support often refers new owners to
those pages and I serve as an unofficial tech support.
Got a call from a guy in Maine a few weeks ago and
we worked out a solution to a problem he had. I
added what we came up with to my set up pages.

http://home.comcast.net/~charliebcz/...ructions0.html