Greetings:

I'm in the process of pricing out cabinets for a new house. For a
number of reasons, I'm probably going to go with a local cabinet shop
that does especially good quality work and is very picky about the
lumber it uses.

However, as with many small shops that don't have CNC machines, their
"standard" drawer boxes are Baltic birch plywood, rabbeted / glued /
nailed. To upgrade to dovetailed solid wood (poplar or equivalent
sides, with plywood bottoms in a dado), they want an additional $15 /
box. As there would be about 160 boxes on this project, I'm looking
into whether it might make sense to have the cabinet shop omit drawer
boxes entirely from their bid, outsource the drawer boxes to one of
the companies that supply CNC'd DT'd boxes, and then just have the
local cabinet shop attach the drawer fronts and drawer slide
hardware.

What's the approximate cost these places charge for a typical box
(e.g., for a 24"W x 4"H x 20"D, in an inexpensive hardwood like
poplar, soft maple, cherry, etc.), in quantity?

Thanks!

LKB in Houston

"LKB" wrote in message
...
Greetings:

I'm in the process of pricing out cabinets for a new house. For a
number of reasons, I'm probably going to go with a local cabinet shop
that does especially good quality work and is very picky about the
lumber it uses.

However, as with many small shops that don't have CNC machines, their
"standard" drawer boxes are Baltic birch plywood, rabbeted / glued /
nailed. To upgrade to dovetailed solid wood (poplar or equivalent
sides, with plywood bottoms in a dado), they want an additional $15 /
box. As there would be about 160 boxes on this project, I'm looking
into whether it might make sense to have the cabinet shop omit drawer
boxes entirely from their bid, outsource the drawer boxes to one of
the companies that supply CNC'd DT'd boxes, and then just have the
local cabinet shop attach the drawer fronts and drawer slide
hardware.

What's the approximate cost these places charge for a typical box
(e.g., for a 24"W x 4"H x 20"D, in an inexpensive hardwood like
poplar, soft maple, cherry, etc.), in quantity?

I cannot give you prices for boxes, but to move up to 160 dovetailed solid
wood drawers from glued and nailed plywood for another $900 seems like a
bargain... Is the shop buying the dovetailed boxes or making them for the
up-charge?

John Grossbohlin wrote:
"LKB" wrote in message

.
...
Greetings:

I'm in the process of pricing out cabinets for a new house. For a
number of reasons, I'm probably going to go with a local cabinet
shop that does especially good quality work and is very picky
about the lumber it uses.

However, as with many small shops that don't have CNC machines,
their "standard" drawer boxes are Baltic birch plywood, rabbeted /
glued / nailed. To upgrade to dovetailed solid wood (poplar or
equivalent sides, with plywood bottoms in a dado), they want an
additional $15 / box. As there would be about 160 boxes on this
project, I'm looking into whether it might make sense to have the
cabinet shop omit drawer boxes entirely from their bid, outsource
the drawer boxes to one of the companies that supply CNC'd DT'd
boxes, and then just have the local cabinet shop attach the drawer
fronts and drawer slide hardware.

What's the approximate cost these places charge for a typical box
(e.g., for a 24"W x 4"H x 20"D, in an inexpensive hardwood like
poplar, soft maple, cherry, etc.), in quantity?

I cannot give you prices for boxes, but to move up to 160
dovetailed solid wood drawers from glued and nailed plywood for
another $900 seems like a bargain...

Sure a bargain compared to an extra $2400


--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

"dadiOH" wrote in message
news:ySk1j.1283$ng.300@trnddc08...
John Grossbohlin wrote:
"LKB" wrote in message

.
..
Greetings:

I'm in the process of pricing out cabinets for a new house. For a
number of reasons, I'm probably going to go with a local cabinet
shop that does especially good quality work and is very picky
about the lumber it uses.

However, as with many small shops that don't have CNC machines,
their "standard" drawer boxes are Baltic birch plywood, rabbeted /
glued / nailed. To upgrade to dovetailed solid wood (poplar or
equivalent sides, with plywood bottoms in a dado), they want an
additional $15 / box. As there would be about 160 boxes on this
project, I'm looking into whether it might make sense to have the
cabinet shop omit drawer boxes entirely from their bid, outsource
the drawer boxes to one of the companies that supply CNC'd DT'd
boxes, and then just have the local cabinet shop attach the drawer
fronts and drawer slide hardware.

What's the approximate cost these places charge for a typical box
(e.g., for a 24"W x 4"H x 20"D, in an inexpensive hardwood like
poplar, soft maple, cherry, etc.), in quantity?

I cannot give you prices for boxes, but to move up to 160
dovetailed solid wood drawers from glued and nailed plywood for
another $900 seems like a bargain...

Sure a bargain compared to an extra $2400

Guess I shouldn't do math in my head after getting up at 5 and still
hunting for deer for 6 hours. ;~) Best I can figure is I based that on 60
units!

John Grossbohlin took a can of maroon spray paint on November 22, 2007 04:19
pm and wrote the following:


"dadiOH" wrote in message
news:ySk1j.1283$ng.300@trnddc08...
John Grossbohlin wrote:
"LKB" wrote in message

.
..
Greetings:

I'm in the process of pricing out cabinets for a new house. For a
number of reasons, I'm probably going to go with a local cabinet
shop that does especially good quality work and is very picky
about the lumber it uses.

However, as with many small shops that don't have CNC machines,
their "standard" drawer boxes are Baltic birch plywood, rabbeted /
glued / nailed. To upgrade to dovetailed solid wood (poplar or
equivalent sides, with plywood bottoms in a dado), they want an
additional $15 / box. As there would be about 160 boxes on this
project, I'm looking into whether it might make sense to have the
cabinet shop omit drawer boxes entirely from their bid, outsource
the drawer boxes to one of the companies that supply CNC'd DT'd
boxes, and then just have the local cabinet shop attach the drawer
fronts and drawer slide hardware.

What's the approximate cost these places charge for a typical box
(e.g., for a 24"W x 4"H x 20"D, in an inexpensive hardwood like
poplar, soft maple, cherry, etc.), in quantity?

I cannot give you prices for boxes, but to move up to 160
dovetailed solid wood drawers from glued and nailed plywood for
another $900 seems like a bargain...

Sure a bargain compared to an extra $2400

Guess I shouldn't do math in my head after getting up at 5 and still
hunting for deer for 6 hours. ;~) Best I can figure is I based that on 60
units!

Just admit, you found a place, pay $15 for 60 drawers, get the next 100
free.
;-)
--
Lits Slut #9
Life would be so much easier if we could just look at the source code.

"FrozenNorth" wrote in message
...
John Grossbohlin took a can of maroon spray paint on November 22, 2007
04:19
pm and wrote the following:


"dadiOH" wrote in message
news:ySk1j.1283$ng.300@trnddc08...
John Grossbohlin wrote:
"LKB" wrote in message

.
..
Greetings:

I'm in the process of pricing out cabinets for a new house. For a
number of reasons, I'm probably going to go with a local cabinet
shop that does especially good quality work and is very picky
about the lumber it uses.

However, as with many small shops that don't have CNC machines,
their "standard" drawer boxes are Baltic birch plywood, rabbeted /
glued / nailed. To upgrade to dovetailed solid wood (poplar or
equivalent sides, with plywood bottoms in a dado), they want an
additional $15 / box. As there would be about 160 boxes on this
project, I'm looking into whether it might make sense to have the
cabinet shop omit drawer boxes entirely from their bid, outsource
the drawer boxes to one of the companies that supply CNC'd DT'd
boxes, and then just have the local cabinet shop attach the drawer
fronts and drawer slide hardware.

What's the approximate cost these places charge for a typical box
(e.g., for a 24"W x 4"H x 20"D, in an inexpensive hardwood like
poplar, soft maple, cherry, etc.), in quantity?

I cannot give you prices for boxes, but to move up to 160
dovetailed solid wood drawers from glued and nailed plywood for
another $900 seems like a bargain...

Sure a bargain compared to an extra $2400

Guess I shouldn't do math in my head after getting up at 5 and still
hunting for deer for 6 hours. ;~) Best I can figure is I based that on 60
units!

Just admit, you found a place, pay $15 for 60 drawers, get the next 100
free.
;-)

It's a secret supplier... ;~)

For 160 units I might buy myself a router and template. Even if I can do
fine handcut dovetails relatively quickly that is a LOT of dovetailing --
I'd starve at $15 per unit doing them with my L-N saw and Marple's chisels.
;~)

On Nov 22, 9:00 am, LKB wrote:
Greetings:

I'm looking
into whether it might make sense to have the cabinet shop omit drawer
boxes entirely from their bid, outsource the drawer boxes to one of
the companies that supply CNC'd DT'd boxes, and then just have the
local cabinet shop attach the drawer fronts and drawer slide
hardware.

What's the approximate cost these places charge for a typical box
(e.g., for a 24"W x 4"H x 20"D, in an inexpensive hardwood like
poplar, soft maple, cherry, etc.), in quantity?

Thanks!

LKB in Houston

Since I don't live in the Houston area I couldn't comment on what it
would cost to have someone do the drawers. But I also don't think the
$15.00 is all that high. Look at it this way. The cost of poplar at
$2.00 bf will cost him about $5.00 of that $15.00. If it takes someone
in the shop 2 hours to cut and assemble the drawer he would have to be
paying them $5.00 an hour. To do the same job in 1 hour he would have
to be paying them $10.00 an hours. Do you see where his profit is in
the job. Now I know there is a trade off he is getting in the plywood
costs compared to the poplar costs. And, with his standard drawer
there is labor to put them together. He is clearly not trying to get
rich on these drawers.

If you get a good price for the drawers at a CNC shop who is
responsible for getting the drawers installed in the cabinets? If you
have to transport the cabinets to the CNC shop to have them installed
where is the cost savings. And even if you have to transport the 60
drawers to the original cabinet guy there will be costs. Do you see
where this is going?

And in the end. Both places will be pointing fingers at the other guy
if something doesn't work out.

Good Luck

Roy

"ROYNEU" wrote in message

And in the end. Both places will be pointing fingers at the other guy
if something doesn't work out.

Good point. When you get right down to it, using two people for the one job
is asking for problems. The first guy certainly wouldn't be getting rich on
this and his pricing seems fair. It's only a recipe for disaster trying to
part it out.

A couple of thoughts...

I made 28 drawers for our kitchen and dovetailed all four courners on each
one. I would not do it again for $15 each. Way too much work, even using a
template.

Also, even if the shop has a cnc the shear materials handling to do
dovetails is worth the extra $15 imoho. If they are good quality, that is a
great price.

Skip
www.ShopFileR.com



"LKB" wrote in message
...
Greetings:

I'm in the process of pricing out cabinets for a new house. For a
number of reasons, I'm probably going to go with a local cabinet shop
that does especially good quality work and is very picky about the
lumber it uses.

However, as with many small shops that don't have CNC machines, their
"standard" drawer boxes are Baltic birch plywood, rabbeted / glued /
nailed. To upgrade to dovetailed solid wood (poplar or equivalent
sides, with plywood bottoms in a dado), they want an additional $15 /
box. As there would be about 160 boxes on this project, I'm looking
into whether it might make sense to have the cabinet shop omit drawer
boxes entirely from their bid, outsource the drawer boxes to one of
the companies that supply CNC'd DT'd boxes, and then just have the
local cabinet shop attach the drawer fronts and drawer slide
hardware.

What's the approximate cost these places charge for a typical box
(e.g., for a 24"W x 4"H x 20"D, in an inexpensive hardwood like
poplar, soft maple, cherry, etc.), in quantity?

Thanks!

LKB in Houston

Skip Williams wrote:
A couple of thoughts...

I made 28 drawers for our kitchen and dovetailed all four courners
on
each one. I would not do it again for $15 each. Way too much work,
even using a template.

Also, even if the shop has a cnc the shear materials handling to do
dovetails is worth the extra $15 imoho. If they are good quality,
that is a great price.

Skip
www.ShopFileR.com

Thinking about it I'm not sure a CNC would really be the most
efficient way to do that kind of volume anyway.

I hadn't really thought about using an Incra jig for that kind of
volume but perhaps it makes sense. Do the setup, do test cuts, tune
if needed, then stack and clamp the pieces in bundles of manageable
size and it will pretty much be zip, zip, zip.



"LKB" wrote in message
...
Greetings:

I'm in the process of pricing out cabinets for a new house. For a
number of reasons, I'm probably going to go with a local cabinet
shop
that does especially good quality work and is very picky about the
lumber it uses.

However, as with many small shops that don't have CNC machines,
their
"standard" drawer boxes are Baltic birch plywood, rabbeted / glued
/
nailed. To upgrade to dovetailed solid wood (poplar or equivalent
sides, with plywood bottoms in a dado), they want an additional $15
/
box. As there would be about 160 boxes on this project, I'm
looking
into whether it might make sense to have the cabinet shop omit
drawer
boxes entirely from their bid, outsource the drawer boxes to one of
the companies that supply CNC'd DT'd boxes, and then just have the
local cabinet shop attach the drawer fronts and drawer slide
hardware.

What's the approximate cost these places charge for a typical box
(e.g., for a 24"W x 4"H x 20"D, in an inexpensive hardwood like
poplar, soft maple, cherry, etc.), in quantity?

Thanks!

LKB in Houston

--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

"Skip Williams" wrote...

Also, even if the shop has a cnc the shear materials handling to do
dovetails is worth the extra $15 imoho. If they are good quality, that is a
great price.

I agree that a 15 dollar upcharge is a very good price.

$2400 seems like a lot of money, but should be considered in the context of the project. I mean, we're talking 160 drawers here - that's 40 four drawer cab bases; I've never seen or even heard of a kitchen with that many drawers. How many square feet is this kitchen, anyway? With a project as large as this kitchen would seem to have to be to have 160 drawers in it, it seems a bit off to be crying over 2400 bucks.



--
Timothy Juvenal
www.tjwoodworking.com

"LKB" wrote in message:
| Greetings:
snip
I'm looking
| into whether it might make sense to have the cabinet shop omit drawer
| boxes entirely from their bid, outsource the drawer boxes to one of
| the companies that supply CNC'd DT'd boxes, and then just have the
| local cabinet shop attach the drawer fronts and drawer slide
| hardware.

I would not be willing to install someone else's boxes in this case.
nuff said,

woodstuff

woodstuff wrote:

I would not be willing to install someone else's boxes in this case.
nuff said,

Not even if you charged for your time and took no responsibility for the
boxes? Why not?

Chris

All posters please take note he said an "additional" $15 per box.

In all the woodwoorking magazines you can find box makers
advertsiements or do a google search. Western Dovetail is one of the
biggies that comes to mind. On a buy that size they will typically
give their typical wholesale price. If the biggest guys won't do it
the smaller gusy will. I'm sure your cabinet shop is just buying the
boxes like that and I doubt he is making a killing, just passing along
the cost.

You'll be amazed how much of a flat rate some ofd these guys charge.
Sometimes it is just a square foot charge regardless of the depth
(within, reason). You'll also have a shipping charge, so if you can
find someone in drive distance, you can save a lot.

Honestly, I doubt you'll get much value out of buying these direct and
managing all the logistics to get them to your cabinet guy, etc.

If you know the cost of the typical boxea from your cabinet maker
maybe get a good price for dovetail boxes from one of the vendors and
use it as a bargining chip to have they guy give you a better price,
if it's possible. I doubt he is making much and he probably gets a
better price than you can.

BW

On Nov 22, 9:00 am, LKB wrote:
Greetings:

I'm in the process of pricing out cabinets for a new house. For a
number of reasons, I'm probably going to go with a local cabinet shop
that does especially good quality work and is very picky about the
lumber it uses.

However, as with many small shops that don't have CNC machines, their
"standard" drawer boxes are Baltic birch plywood, rabbeted / glued /
nailed. To upgrade to dovetailed solid wood (poplar or equivalent
sides, with plywood bottoms in a dado), they want an additional $15 /
box. As there would be about 160 boxes on this project, I'm looking
into whether it might make sense to have the cabinet shop omit drawer
boxes entirely from their bid, outsource the drawer boxes to one of
the companies that supply CNC'd DT'd boxes, and then just have the
local cabinet shop attach the drawer fronts and drawer slide
hardware.

What's the approximate cost these places charge for a typical box
(e.g., for a 24"W x 4"H x 20"D, in an inexpensive hardwood like
poplar, soft maple, cherry, etc.), in quantity?

Thanks!

LKB in Houston