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-   -   Titebond III must be a very different animal. (https://www.diybanter.com/woodworking/683371-titebond-iii-must-very-different-animal.html)

Greg Guarino[_2_] December 19th 20 09:27 PM

Titebond III must be a very different animal.
 
I bought some Titebond III recently. I didn't need it to be waterproof but I liked the idea of longer open time for a little less stressful gluing. I had used TII and TI in the past.
I used it to glue up that butcher-block-style table top. I'm "recycling" the wood which is currently finished with poly, I think. I'm going to sand off the old finish anyway so I didn't bother trying to meticulously remove the squeeze-out, especially on the bottom.
I got a pretty generous gob of glue on the (chrome) bar of a Jorgensen Cabinet Master clamp. (I had left the clamps on for just about 24 hours - yes, I know I didn't need to) In my previous experience with wood glue, stuff like that would flick right off. Not so this time. It was stuck but good; had to use a knife to pry it off bit by bit.

J. Clarke[_5_] December 19th 20 09:33 PM

Titebond III must be a very different animal.
 
On Sat, 19 Dec 2020 12:27:52 -0800 (PST), Greg Guarino
wrote:

I bought some Titebond III recently. I didn't need it to be waterproof but I liked the idea of longer open time for a little less stressful gluing. I had used TII and TI in the past.
I used it to glue up that butcher-block-style table top. I'm "recycling" the wood which is currently finished with poly, I think. I'm going to sand off the old finish anyway so I didn't bother trying to meticulously remove the squeeze-out, especially on the bottom.
I got a pretty generous gob of glue on the (chrome) bar of a Jorgensen Cabinet Master clamp. (I had left the clamps on for just about 24 hours - yes, I know I didn't need to) In my previous experience with wood glue, stuff like that would flick right off. Not so this time. It was stuck but good; had to use a knife to pry it off bit by bit.


I learned that lesson too. Wax the clamps.

dpb[_3_] December 20th 20 12:21 AM

Titebond III must be a very different animal.
 
On 12/19/2020 2:27 PM, Greg Guarino wrote:
I bought some Titebond III recently. I didn't need it to be waterproof but I liked the idea of longer open time for a little less stressful gluing. I had used TII and TI in the past.
I used it to glue up that butcher-block-style table top. I'm "recycling" the wood which is currently finished with poly, I think. I'm going to sand off the old finish anyway so I didn't bother trying to meticulously remove the squeeze-out, especially on the bottom.
I got a pretty generous gob of glue on the (chrome) bar of a Jorgensen Cabinet Master clamp. (I had left the clamps on for just about 24 hours - yes, I know I didn't need to) In my previous experience with wood glue, stuff like that would flick right off. Not so this time. It was stuck but good; had to use a knife to pry it off bit by bit.


Yes, it is different, indeed. Original Yellow is an aliphatic resin, II
is a PVA while III is a "proprietary polymer", but it is, as far as I
know, still unique. It definitely has much a higher "stick factor" to
metals and other non-wood slick surfaces.

--


Leon[_7_] December 21st 20 12:20 AM

Titebond III must be a very different animal.
 
On 12/19/2020 2:27 PM, Greg Guarino wrote:
I bought some Titebond III recently. I didn't need it to be waterproof but I liked the idea of longer open time for a little less stressful gluing. I had used TII and TI in the past.
I used it to glue up that butcher-block-style table top. I'm "recycling" the wood which is currently finished with poly, I think. I'm going to sand off the old finish anyway so I didn't bother trying to meticulously remove the squeeze-out, especially on the bottom.
I got a pretty generous gob of glue on the (chrome) bar of a Jorgensen Cabinet Master clamp. (I had left the clamps on for just about 24 hours - yes, I know I didn't need to) In my previous experience with wood glue, stuff like that would flick right off. Not so this time. It was stuck but good; had to use a knife to pry it off bit by bit.



Ah TiteBond. LOL I only use TB III and it failed the water proof test
more than a decade ago when tested by a magazine. In fact the TBI
proved to be more water proof than the TBIII. I had fun with that one
when mentioning it to Franklin.

I have not checked lately but back then the "Spec" sheet for water
proof, that TB used, was labeled water proof but no where in the
definition were the words water proof. Water Resistant was in that
Water Proof Spec sheet...

And yes as previously mentioned a touch of wax will help with the glue
and really makes the clamps easy to slide along the rail.

[email protected] December 21st 20 02:53 AM

Titebond III must be a very different animal.
 
On Sun, 20 Dec 2020 17:20:27 -0600, Leon [email protected]
wrote:

On 12/19/2020 2:27 PM, Greg Guarino wrote:
I bought some Titebond III recently. I didn't need it to be waterproof but I liked the idea of longer open time for a little less stressful gluing. I had used TII and TI in the past.
I used it to glue up that butcher-block-style table top. I'm "recycling" the wood which is currently finished with poly, I think. I'm going to sand off the old finish anyway so I didn't bother trying to meticulously remove the squeeze-out, especially on the bottom.
I got a pretty generous gob of glue on the (chrome) bar of a Jorgensen Cabinet Master clamp. (I had left the clamps on for just about 24 hours - yes, I know I didn't need to) In my previous experience with wood glue, stuff like that would flick right off. Not so this time. It was stuck but good; had to use a knife to pry it off bit by bit.



Ah TiteBond. LOL I only use TB III and it failed the water proof test
more than a decade ago when tested by a magazine. In fact the TBI
proved to be more water proof than the TBIII. I had fun with that one
when mentioning it to Franklin.

I have not checked lately but back then the "Spec" sheet for water
proof, that TB used, was labeled water proof but no where in the
definition were the words water proof. Water Resistant was in that
Water Proof Spec sheet...

And yes as previously mentioned a touch of wax will help with the glue
and really makes the clamps easy to slide along the rail.


Cold or hot wax?

dpb[_3_] December 21st 20 03:26 PM

Titebond III must be a very different animal.
 
On 12/20/2020 5:20 PM, Leon wrote:
On 12/19/2020 2:27 PM, Greg Guarino wrote:
I bought some Titebond III recently. I didn't need it to be waterproof
but I liked the idea of longer open time for a little less stressful
gluing. I had used TII and TI in the past.
I used it to glue up that butcher-block-style table top. I'm
"recycling" the wood which is currently finished with poly, I think.
I'm going to sand off the old finish anyway so I didn't bother trying
to meticulously remove the squeeze-out, especially on the bottom.
I got a pretty generous gob of glue on the (chrome) bar of a Jorgensen
Cabinet Master clamp. (I had left the clamps on for just about 24
hours - yes, I know I didn't need to) In my previous experience with
wood glue, stuff like that would flick right off. Not so this time. It
was stuck but good; had to use a knife to pry it off bit by bit.



Ah TiteBond.¬* LOL¬* I only use TB III and it¬* failed the water proof test
more than a decade ago when tested by a magazine.¬* In fact the TBI
proved to be more water proof than the TBIII.¬* I had fun with that one
when mentioning it to Franklin.


Both TB II and TB III pass a given ANSI Standard for water resistance.
That's all it means ... as I recall the "test" the magazine did had no
relationship to those tests. Of course, those tests are very artificial
if you go look up what they consist of, but they are the recognized test
standards.

Franklin never officially claimed anything otherwise; I notice they have
somewhat modified the advertising jargon...

I use both but with so much work I do outside, the lower chalk
temperature for TIII is extremely helpful.

I've not had a glue failure in any exterior application with TIII on
anything I thought was at all a reasonable application for the
product--it does everything it should do.

--

Leon[_7_] December 21st 20 04:24 PM

Titebond III must be a very different animal.
 
On 12/20/2020 7:53 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 20 Dec 2020 17:20:27 -0600, Leon [email protected]
wrote:

On 12/19/2020 2:27 PM, Greg Guarino wrote:
I bought some Titebond III recently. I didn't need it to be waterproof but I liked the idea of longer open time for a little less stressful gluing. I had used TII and TI in the past.
I used it to glue up that butcher-block-style table top. I'm "recycling" the wood which is currently finished with poly, I think. I'm going to sand off the old finish anyway so I didn't bother trying to meticulously remove the squeeze-out, especially on the bottom.
I got a pretty generous gob of glue on the (chrome) bar of a Jorgensen Cabinet Master clamp. (I had left the clamps on for just about 24 hours - yes, I know I didn't need to) In my previous experience with wood glue, stuff like that would flick right off. Not so this time. It was stuck but good; had to use a knife to pry it off bit by bit.



Ah TiteBond. LOL I only use TB III and it failed the water proof test
more than a decade ago when tested by a magazine. In fact the TBI
proved to be more water proof than the TBIII. I had fun with that one
when mentioning it to Franklin.

I have not checked lately but back then the "Spec" sheet for water
proof, that TB used, was labeled water proof but no where in the
definition were the words water proof. Water Resistant was in that
Water Proof Spec sheet...

And yes as previously mentioned a touch of wax will help with the glue
and really makes the clamps easy to slide along the rail.


Cold or hot wax?



I keep BriWax on hand for screw lube and simple finishing on stuff that
will not see any wear and tear. I used that, it is very soft in normal
room temperature.

Leon[_7_] December 21st 20 04:38 PM

Titebond III must be a very different animal.
 
On 12/21/2020 8:26 AM, dpb wrote:
On 12/20/2020 5:20 PM, Leon wrote:
On 12/19/2020 2:27 PM, Greg Guarino wrote:
I bought some Titebond III recently. I didn't need it to be
waterproof but I liked the idea of longer open time for a little less
stressful gluing. I had used TII and TI in the past.
I used it to glue up that butcher-block-style table top. I'm
"recycling" the wood which is currently finished with poly, I think.
I'm going to sand off the old finish anyway so I didn't bother trying
to meticulously remove the squeeze-out, especially on the bottom.
I got a pretty generous gob of glue on the (chrome) bar of a
Jorgensen Cabinet Master clamp. (I had left the clamps on for just
about 24 hours - yes, I know I didn't need to) In my previous
experience with wood glue, stuff like that would flick right off. Not
so this time. It was stuck but good; had to use a knife to pry it off
bit by bit.



Ah TiteBond.¬* LOL¬* I only use TB III and it¬* failed the water proof
test more than a decade ago when tested by a magazine.¬* In fact the
TBI proved to be more water proof than the TBIII.¬* I had fun with that
one when mentioning it to Franklin.


Both TB II and TB III pass a given ANSI Standard for water resistance.
That's all it means ... as I recall the "test" the magazine did had no
relationship to those tests.¬* Of course, those tests are very artificial
if you go look up what they consist of, but they are the recognized test
standards.


Yes, the "Glue Club" standard. But even in the early days the Water
Proof Standard specification, was only defined as Water Resistant. Its
like they pull you in with the Water Proof feature but in the fine print
say ,not really.

And YES the magazine test was not close to the testing standards. The
magazine test was testing the glue like the average consumer would
expect a glue labeled Water Proof to perform.




Franklin never officially claimed anything otherwise; I notice they have
somewhat modified the advertising jargon...


Well, water proof on the bottle pretty much means water proof, which it
was not according to the Water Proof testing standard Spec.

And even today the bottles says Water Proof.

I guess like Clinton, it depends on what the definition of is, is. Or
in this case, Water Proof. LOL



I use both but with so much work I do outside, the lower chalk
temperature for TIII is extremely helpful.


Yes, and still I pretty much only TB III also. I prefer the color that
it dries at. Tan vs. yellow. And the open time is easier to work with.



I've not had a glue failure in any exterior application with TIII on
anything I thought was at all a reasonable application for the
product--it does everything it should do.

--

I will not argue that. I have not had it fail either. Although some
maple flat grain cutting boards that I made a few years back have split
along the glue lines. Not come apart but split on the ends. I suspect
the daily washing and air drying has caused an issue.

Leon[_7_] December 21st 20 04:40 PM

Titebond III must be a very different animal.
 
On 12/21/2020 9:38 AM, Leon wrote:
On 12/21/2020 8:26 AM, dpb wrote:
On 12/20/2020 5:20 PM, Leon wrote:
On 12/19/2020 2:27 PM, Greg Guarino wrote:
I bought some Titebond III recently. I didn't need it to be
waterproof but I liked the idea of longer open time for a little
less stressful gluing. I had used TII and TI in the past.
I used it to glue up that butcher-block-style table top. I'm
"recycling" the wood which is currently finished with poly, I think.
I'm going to sand off the old finish anyway so I didn't bother
trying to meticulously remove the squeeze-out, especially on the
bottom.
I got a pretty generous gob of glue on the (chrome) bar of a
Jorgensen Cabinet Master clamp. (I had left the clamps on for just
about 24 hours - yes, I know I didn't need to) In my previous
experience with wood glue, stuff like that would flick right off.
Not so this time. It was stuck but good; had to use a knife to pry
it off bit by bit.



Ah TiteBond.¬* LOL¬* I only use TB III and it¬* failed the water proof
test more than a decade ago when tested by a magazine.¬* In fact the
TBI proved to be more water proof than the TBIII.¬* I had fun with
that one when mentioning it to Franklin.


Both TB II and TB III pass a given ANSI Standard for water resistance.
That's all it means ... as I recall the "test" the magazine did had no
relationship to those tests.¬* Of course, those tests are very
artificial if you go look up what they consist of, but they are the
recognized test standards.


Yes, the "Glue Club" standard.¬* But even in the early days the Water
Proof Standard specification, was only defined as Water Resistant.¬* Its
like they pull you in with the Water Proof feature but in the fine print
say ,not really.

And YES the magazine test was not close to the testing standards.¬* The
magazine test was testing the glue like the average consumer would
expect a glue labeled Water Proof to perform.




Franklin never officially claimed anything otherwise; I notice they
have somewhat modified the advertising jargon...


Well, water proof on the bottle pretty much means water proof, which it
was not according to the Water Proof testing standard Spec.

And even today the bottles says Water Proof.

I guess like Clinton, it depends on what the definition of is, is.¬* Or
in this case, Water Proof.¬* LOL



I use both but with so much work I do outside, the lower chalk
temperature for TIII is extremely helpful.


Yes, and still I pretty much only TB III also.¬* I prefer the color that
it dries at.¬* Tan vs. yellow.¬*¬* And the open time is easier to work with.



I've not had a glue failure in any exterior application with TIII on
anything I thought was at all a reasonable application for the
product--it does everything it should do.

--

I will not argue that.¬* I have not had it fail either.¬* Although some
maple flat grain cutting boards that I made a few years back have split
along the glue lines.¬* Not come apart but split on the ends.¬* I suspect
the daily washing and air drying has caused an issue.



A tad more mumbo jumbo from Franklins web site..


Features & Benefits
Passes ANSI/HPVA Type I water-resistance
Waterproof formula that cleans up with water

dpb[_3_] December 21st 20 05:52 PM

Titebond III must be a very different animal.
 
On 12/21/2020 9:40 AM, Leon wrote:
....

A tad more mumbo jumbo from Franklins web site..


Features & Benefits
Passes ANSI/HPVA Type I water-resistance
Waterproof formula that cleans up with water


Yes. To add even more confusion part is that the Type I ANSI test is
more stringent than Type II test -- and the TB II and TB III didn't have
anything to do with the ANSI test type but were just product sequence
numbers, but it just so happens TBII passes ANSI II--

"TITEBOND II PREMIUM WOOD GLUE
Titebond II Premium Wood Glue is the only leading brand, one-part wood
glue that passes the ANSI Type II water-resistance specification."

"TITEBOND III ULTIMATE WOOD GLUE
Titebond III Ultimate Wood Glue is the first one-part, water cleanup
wood glue ever offered that is proven waterproof. The waterproof formula
passes the ANSI/HPVA Type I water-resistance specification..."

I see they now also call TBII "Premium" and TBIII "Ultimate".

--


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