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Battery operated compressor
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Battery operated compressor
On Saturday, June 9, 2018 at 1:37:39 PM UTC-4, Markem wrote:
Saw this in a fathers day article https://goo.gl/yxKmtJ For about $300. Is 1.2 SCFM @ 90 PSI enough for decent usage? |
Battery operated compressor
On Sat, 9 Jun 2018 12:20:19 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote: On Saturday, June 9, 2018 at 1:37:39 PM UTC-4, Markem wrote: Saw this in a fathers day article https://goo.gl/yxKmtJ For about $300. Is 1.2 SCFM @ 90 PSI enough for decent usage? You need to check the tools you use to see what they are rated as needing. |
Battery operated compressor
On Sat, 09 Jun 2018 12:44:51 -0700, OFWW
wrote: On Sat, 9 Jun 2018 12:20:19 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03 wrote: On Saturday, June 9, 2018 at 1:37:39 PM UTC-4, Markem wrote: Saw this in a fathers day article https://goo.gl/yxKmtJ For about $300. Is 1.2 SCFM @ 90 PSI enough for decent usage? You need to check the tools you use to see what they are rated as needing. For nailers probably, any other air tool probably not. |
Battery operated compressor
On 6/9/2018 2:20 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Saturday, June 9, 2018 at 1:37:39 PM UTC-4, Markem wrote: Saw this in a fathers day article https://goo.gl/yxKmtJ For about $300. Is 1.2 SCFM @ 90 PSI enough for decent usage? For nail guns or filling tires it is plenty. |
Battery operated compressor
On Sat, 09 Jun 2018 14:51:01 -0500, Markem
wrote: On Sat, 09 Jun 2018 12:44:51 -0700, OFWW wrote: On Sat, 9 Jun 2018 12:20:19 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03 wrote: On Saturday, June 9, 2018 at 1:37:39 PM UTC-4, Markem wrote: Saw this in a fathers day article https://goo.gl/yxKmtJ For about $300. Is 1.2 SCFM @ 90 PSI enough for decent usage? You need to check the tools you use to see what they are rated as needing. For nailers probably, any other air tool probably not. It'll handle an airbrush - mabee a touch-up gun. Won't keep up with a big paint gun. The tank is big enough it might get afew wheels off with the impact. |
Battery operated compressor
On Sat, 09 Jun 2018 14:51:01 -0500, Markem
wrote: On Sat, 09 Jun 2018 12:44:51 -0700, OFWW wrote: On Sat, 9 Jun 2018 12:20:19 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03 wrote: On Saturday, June 9, 2018 at 1:37:39 PM UTC-4, Markem wrote: Saw this in a fathers day article https://goo.gl/yxKmtJ For about $300. Is 1.2 SCFM @ 90 PSI enough for decent usage? You need to check the tools you use to see what they are rated as needing. For nailers probably, any other air tool probably not. polisher 15 cfm @ 90psi orbital sander 4 CFM @ 90 PSI angle grinder 3 CFM @ 90 PSI small air saw for 16 gauge 4 CFM @ 90 PSI 18 gage nailer 0.5 CFM @ 90 PSI framing nailer 3 CFM @ 90 PSI 1/2" impact gun 6 CFM @ 90 PSI Just to give you some of the items. In order for specific air flow to be measured in SCFM, most experts agree that the air flow must meet the following set of rigid environmental circumstances; The air temperature must be 68 degrees Fahrenheit The relative humidity of the air must be 36% The air itself must be measured at sea level As far as I know basic cfm is what it says at the PSI it was rated as. |
Battery operated compressor
On Saturday, June 9, 2018 at 10:46:19 PM UTC-4, OFWW wrote:
On Sat, 09 Jun 2018 14:51:01 -0500, Markem wrote: On Sat, 09 Jun 2018 12:44:51 -0700, OFWW wrote: On Sat, 9 Jun 2018 12:20:19 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03 wrote: On Saturday, June 9, 2018 at 1:37:39 PM UTC-4, Markem wrote: Saw this in a fathers day article https://goo.gl/yxKmtJ For about $300. Is 1.2 SCFM @ 90 PSI enough for decent usage? You need to check the tools you use to see what they are rated as needing. For nailers probably, any other air tool probably not. polisher 15 cfm @ 90psi orbital sander 4 CFM @ 90 PSI angle grinder 3 CFM @ 90 PSI small air saw for 16 gauge 4 CFM @ 90 PSI 18 gage nailer 0.5 CFM @ 90 PSI framing nailer 3 CFM @ 90 PSI 1/2" impact gun 6 CFM @ 90 PSI Just to give you some of the items. In order for specific air flow to be measured in SCFM, most experts agree that the air flow must meet the following set of rigid environmental circumstances; The air temperature must be 68 degrees Fahrenheit The relative humidity of the air must be 36% The air itself must be measured at sea level As far as I know basic cfm is what it says at the PSI it was rated as. So that sort of takes us back to my original question. The DeWalt battery compressor is rated in SCFM (1.2 SCFM @ 90 PSI) as is my PC compressor (2.6 SCFM @ 90 PSI) Since the DW is rated at less than half my PC, where do you think the $300 1.2 SCFM unit would "fail" (i.e. not be up to the task at hand) but the $99 PC would handle with ease? Based on your list of items, are you saying that the only tool that *either* compressor will operate is the 18 gauge nailer? |
Battery operated compressor
On Sun, 10 Jun 2018 16:11:56 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote: On Saturday, June 9, 2018 at 10:46:19 PM UTC-4, OFWW wrote: On Sat, 09 Jun 2018 14:51:01 -0500, Markem wrote: On Sat, 09 Jun 2018 12:44:51 -0700, OFWW wrote: On Sat, 9 Jun 2018 12:20:19 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03 wrote: On Saturday, June 9, 2018 at 1:37:39 PM UTC-4, Markem wrote: Saw this in a fathers day article https://goo.gl/yxKmtJ For about $300. Is 1.2 SCFM @ 90 PSI enough for decent usage? You need to check the tools you use to see what they are rated as needing. For nailers probably, any other air tool probably not. polisher 15 cfm @ 90psi orbital sander 4 CFM @ 90 PSI angle grinder 3 CFM @ 90 PSI small air saw for 16 gauge 4 CFM @ 90 PSI 18 gage nailer 0.5 CFM @ 90 PSI framing nailer 3 CFM @ 90 PSI 1/2" impact gun 6 CFM @ 90 PSI Just to give you some of the items. In order for specific air flow to be measured in SCFM, most experts agree that the air flow must meet the following set of rigid environmental circumstances; The air temperature must be 68 degrees Fahrenheit The relative humidity of the air must be 36% The air itself must be measured at sea level As far as I know basic cfm is what it says at the PSI it was rated as. So that sort of takes us back to my original question. The DeWalt battery compressor is rated in SCFM (1.2 SCFM @ 90 PSI) as is my PC compressor (2.6 SCFM @ 90 PSI) Since the DW is rated at less than half my PC, where do you think the $300 1.2 SCFM unit would "fail" (i.e. not be up to the task at hand) but the $99 PC would handle with ease? Based on your list of items, are you saying that the only tool that *either* compressor will operate is the 18 gauge nailer? It REALLY depends on the size of the tank and how much you use it (duty cycle). Either one will likely remove one wheel nut, the $99 one might remove or install one wheel - and be ready for the second one by the time you check torque, let down the jack, and jack up the next wheel with a CP type impact - not likely with an IR style (more of an air hog). The $99 one may handle a small tough-up paint gun - the battery one almost definitely will not. The air saw might cut a one foot cut on the $99 - and about 5 inches or so at a go with the battery powered one. |
Battery operated compressor
On 6/10/2018 6:11 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Saturday, June 9, 2018 at 10:46:19 PM UTC-4, OFWW wrote: On Sat, 09 Jun 2018 14:51:01 -0500, Markem wrote: On Sat, 09 Jun 2018 12:44:51 -0700, OFWW wrote: On Sat, 9 Jun 2018 12:20:19 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03 wrote: On Saturday, June 9, 2018 at 1:37:39 PM UTC-4, Markem wrote: Saw this in a fathers day article https://goo.gl/yxKmtJ For about $300. Is 1.2 SCFM @ 90 PSI enough for decent usage? You need to check the tools you use to see what they are rated as needing. For nailers probably, any other air tool probably not. polisher 15 cfm @ 90psi orbital sander 4 CFM @ 90 PSI angle grinder 3 CFM @ 90 PSI small air saw for 16 gauge 4 CFM @ 90 PSI 18 gage nailer 0.5 CFM @ 90 PSI framing nailer 3 CFM @ 90 PSI 1/2" impact gun 6 CFM @ 90 PSI Just to give you some of the items. In order for specific air flow to be measured in SCFM, most experts agree that the air flow must meet the following set of rigid environmental circumstances; The air temperature must be 68 degrees Fahrenheit The relative humidity of the air must be 36% The air itself must be measured at sea level As far as I know basic cfm is what it says at the PSI it was rated as. So that sort of takes us back to my original question. The DeWalt battery compressor is rated in SCFM (1.2 SCFM @ 90 PSI) as is my PC compressor (2.6 SCFM @ 90 PSI) Since the DW is rated at less than half my PC, where do you think the $300 1.2 SCFM unit would "fail" (i.e. not be up to the task at hand) but the $99 PC would handle with ease? I should not fail, it will just have to cycle on twice as much. Based on your list of items, are you saying that the only tool that *either* compressor will operate is the 18 gauge nailer? It depend on how much you need to use it. A nailer uses very little air is very short blasts. Air tools that use continuous air will drain it much more quickly, more than likely faster than it can recharge. |
Battery operated compressor
On Sun, 10 Jun 2018 16:11:56 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote: On Saturday, June 9, 2018 at 10:46:19 PM UTC-4, OFWW wrote: On Sat, 09 Jun 2018 14:51:01 -0500, Markem wrote: On Sat, 09 Jun 2018 12:44:51 -0700, OFWW wrote: On Sat, 9 Jun 2018 12:20:19 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03 wrote: On Saturday, June 9, 2018 at 1:37:39 PM UTC-4, Markem wrote: Saw this in a fathers day article https://goo.gl/yxKmtJ For about $300. Is 1.2 SCFM @ 90 PSI enough for decent usage? You need to check the tools you use to see what they are rated as needing. For nailers probably, any other air tool probably not. polisher 15 cfm @ 90psi orbital sander 4 CFM @ 90 PSI angle grinder 3 CFM @ 90 PSI small air saw for 16 gauge 4 CFM @ 90 PSI 18 gage nailer 0.5 CFM @ 90 PSI framing nailer 3 CFM @ 90 PSI 1/2" impact gun 6 CFM @ 90 PSI Just to give you some of the items. In order for specific air flow to be measured in SCFM, most experts agree that the air flow must meet the following set of rigid environmental circumstances; The air temperature must be 68 degrees Fahrenheit The relative humidity of the air must be 36% The air itself must be measured at sea level As far as I know basic cfm is what it says at the PSI it was rated as. So that sort of takes us back to my original question. The DeWalt battery compressor is rated in SCFM (1.2 SCFM @ 90 PSI) as is my PC compressor (2.6 SCFM @ 90 PSI) Since the DW is rated at less than half my PC, where do you think the $300 1.2 SCFM unit would "fail" (i.e. not be up to the task at hand) but the $99 PC would handle with ease? Based on your list of items, are you saying that the only tool that *either* compressor will operate is the 18 gauge nailer? At home the pancake on similar to your will do about 7 framing nails and will not drive any more all the way home until it fills back up. Finishing nails and staples seem to go enough longer that I have to change positions anyhow and the compressor can catch up. If these pressure switches would have and adjustable differential I could tweak it so that I could drive a few more nail, but the differential is fixed and to buy a good one costs over half of a cheap compressor. It is a source of irritation to be but if you spend a grand on a good system you can't drag the sucker around. :) You might want to consider battery operated nailers, staplers, etc. they won't require the waiting cycles. Use the compressor to blow off the work bench and fill tires etc. If you go battery operated tool just be sure to get one compatible with the tools you already have. |
Battery operated compressor
OFWW wrote in
: At home the pancake on similar to your will do about 7 framing nails and will not drive any more all the way home until it fills back up. Finishing nails and staples seem to go enough longer that I have to change positions anyhow and the compressor can catch up. If these pressure switches would have and adjustable differential I could tweak it so that I could drive a few more nail, but the differential is fixed and to buy a good one costs over half of a cheap compressor. It is a source of irritation to be but if you spend a grand on a good system you can't drag the sucker around. :) You might want to consider battery operated nailers, staplers, etc. they won't require the waiting cycles. Use the compressor to blow off the work bench and fill tires etc. If you go battery operated tool just be sure to get one compatible with the tools you already have. If you need just a little more time between cycles, an air tank is pretty cheap and with a regulator on it you can charge it to 120+ PSI and regulate it down to what your gun needs. They're also pretty useful for when you've got a tire away from the compressor and need something portable. I use my tank for that kind of thing more than I ever did for a reserve. If you're just doing tires, there's battery powered inflators that use standardish power tool batteries. They're probably like those little 12V car pumps--good enough to turn the parenthesis squiggly line parenthesis light off but not really good for filling a flat tire. Puckdropper -- http://www.puckdroppersplace.us/rec.woodworking A mini archive of some of rec.woodworking's best and worst! |
Battery operated compressor
I am never sure of why tools like this are made, especially at that price point. If you were working in an area that didn't have electricity, say framing a house in a new or remote location, that wouldn't be your tool. If you are doing a trim out job, a rapid succession of nails down a side of door trim with your 16 or 15ga. gun would deplete it. Worse on long runs of base, chair rail, crown, etc.
And that compressor has pretty low specs as far as recovery would go. I have bought lowered powered compressors (lured by my aching back that is tired of hoisting them over the tailgate) in the past and have literally given them away. If I shoot a line of brads or trim mails quickly into trim those tiny tanks deplete so fast that I always seem to have the last few flush, then protruding from the trim. Countersinking trim gun nails (made to bend when they strike something hard)always makes a mess. So it seems useless to most professionals I know, and too expensive for the average homeowner to get any real use out of it. You can buy a nice hot dog for $100 that stow nicely, and has a lot of nailing power. I just bought this one about a month ago when it was on sale, and it has proven to be a nice little unit. https://goo.gl/YpMkQf The high pressure of the unit keeps the tank full, and it recovers nicely. I use it for siding installs, trim work, repairs, light framing, etc. With the battery in it, the DeWalt only weighs a few pounds less than this unit, and has nowhere near the utility value. My only gripe with the Lowe's unit is that it is loud, as are all the oiless compressors. Not as loud as a couple of others I have owned, but still loud to me. Robert |
Battery operated compressor
On Tue, 12 Jun 2018 15:35:25 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote: I am never sure of why tools like this are made, especially at that price point. It was in an article about what to buy dad for fathers day, like many other tools that are sold as the bee's knees and must haves that dad definitely needs. |
Battery operated compressor
On Tue, 12 Jun 2018 22:22:09 GMT, Puckdropper
wrote: OFWW wrote in : At home the pancake on similar to your will do about 7 framing nails and will not drive any more all the way home until it fills back up. Finishing nails and staples seem to go enough longer that I have to change positions anyhow and the compressor can catch up. If these pressure switches would have and adjustable differential I could tweak it so that I could drive a few more nail, but the differential is fixed and to buy a good one costs over half of a cheap compressor. It is a source of irritation to be but if you spend a grand on a good system you can't drag the sucker around. :) You might want to consider battery operated nailers, staplers, etc. they won't require the waiting cycles. Use the compressor to blow off the work bench and fill tires etc. If you go battery operated tool just be sure to get one compatible with the tools you already have. If you need just a little more time between cycles, an air tank is pretty cheap and with a regulator on it you can charge it to 120+ PSI and regulate it down to what your gun needs. They're also pretty useful for when you've got a tire away from the compressor and need something portable. I use my tank for that kind of thing more than I ever did for a reserve. If you're just doing tires, there's battery powered inflators that use standardish power tool batteries. They're probably like those little 12V car pumps--good enough to turn the parenthesis squiggly line parenthesis light off but not really good for filling a flat tire. Puckdropper I generally try what you suggest, but when set too high the high pressure switch is borderline tripping. It also does not increase the air volume much because of the sizing of the pressure regulator (rated in cfm volume) if you leave it in line. I prefer a differential of 20to 25 psi and these switches seem to be close to 40 making it difficult for the compressor to keep a more consistent flow. Yeah as to filling a totally flat tire, takes forever. Not too bad on bikes. |
Battery operated compressor
On Tue, 12 Jun 2018 15:35:25 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote: I am never sure of why tools like this are made, especially at that price point. If you were working in an area that didn't have electricity, say framing a house in a new or remote location, that wouldn't be your tool. If you are doing a trim out job, a rapid succession of nails down a side of door trim with your 16 or 15ga. gun would deplete it. Worse on long runs of base, chair rail, crown, etc. And that compressor has pretty low specs as far as recovery would go. I have bought lowered powered compressors (lured by my aching back that is tired of hoisting them over the tailgate) in the past and have literally given them away. If I shoot a line of brads or trim mails quickly into trim those tiny tanks deplete so fast that I always seem to have the last few flush, then protruding from the trim. Countersinking trim gun nails (made to bend when they strike something hard)always makes a mess. So it seems useless to most professionals I know, and too expensive for the average homeowner to get any real use out of it. You can buy a nice hot dog for $100 that stow nicely, and has a lot of nailing power. I just bought this one about a month ago when it was on sale, and it has proven to be a nice little unit. https://goo.gl/YpMkQf The high pressure of the unit keeps the tank full, and it recovers nicely. I use it for siding installs, trim work, repairs, light framing, etc. With the battery in it, the DeWalt only weighs a few pounds less than this unit, and has nowhere near the utility value. My only gripe with the Lowe's unit is that it is loud, as are all the oiless compressors. Not as loud as a couple of others I have owned, but still loud to me. Robert That one is rated 2.8 dCFM which great for that size of compressor. It should run off a bunch of finishing nails plus some of the other stuff like you suggested. I am literally ROTFLOL! I jumped to HF they have an 8 gal rated at 4scfm @ 90 PSI. About the same price but you lose so much in portability. I saw a 3 Cu Ft one there for 57 or so bucks, checked the chart sheet for capability. .5SCFM @90 1 SCFM at 40 psi. Now here is the part that had me laughing. The had a picture sheet of capabilities. The row on the bottom 2/3rds showed framing nailers, impact guns, cutting tools, etc in big pictures, and a small section said clearly not for use with these items. Pity the impulse buyer whose eyes are larger than his brain. |
Battery operated compressor
On Tue, 12 Jun 2018 15:35:25 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote: I am never sure of why tools like this are made, especially at that price point. If you were working in an area that didn't have electricity, say framing a house in a new or remote location, that wouldn't be your tool. If you are doing a trim out job, a rapid succession of nails down a side of door trim with your 16 or 15ga. gun would deplete it. Worse on long runs of base, chair rail, crown, etc. And that compressor has pretty low specs as far as recovery would go. I have bought lowered powered compressors (lured by my aching back that is tired of hoisting them over the tailgate) in the past and have literally given them away. If I shoot a line of brads or trim mails quickly into trim those tiny tanks deplete so fast that I always seem to have the last few flush, then protruding from the trim. Countersinking trim gun nails (made to bend when they strike something hard)always makes a mess. So it seems useless to most professionals I know, and too expensive for the average homeowner to get any real use out of it. You can buy a nice hot dog for $100 that stow nicely, and has a lot of nailing power. I just bought this one about a month ago when it was on sale, and it has proven to be a nice little unit. https://goo.gl/YpMkQf The high pressure of the unit keeps the tank full, and it recovers nicely. I use it for siding installs, trim work, repairs, light framing, etc. With the battery in it, the DeWalt only weighs a few pounds less than this unit, and has nowhere near the utility value. My only gripe with the Lowe's unit is that it is loud, as are all the oiless compressors. Not as loud as a couple of others I have owned, but still loud to me. Robert That's what long hoses are for - - - - - - |
Battery operated compressor
Clare Snyder wrote in
: That's what long hoses are for - - - - - - Those things can get to weigh almost as much as the compressor! Puckdropper -- http://www.puckdroppersplace.us/rec.woodworking A mini archive of some of rec.woodworking's best and worst! |
Battery operated compressor
On Tue, 12 Jun 2018 22:39:49 -0500, -MIKE-
wrote: On 6/12/18 5:35 PM, wrote: I am never sure of why tools like this are made, especially at that price point. If you were working in an area that didn't have electricity, say framing a house in a new or remote location, that wouldn't be your tool. If you are doing a trim out job, a rapid succession of nails down a side of door trim with your 16 or 15ga. gun would deplete it. Worse on long runs of base, chair rail, crown, etc. And that compressor has pretty low specs as far as recovery would go. I have bought lowered powered compressors (lured by my aching back that is tired of hoisting them over the tailgate) in the past and have literally given them away. If I shoot a line of brads or trim mails quickly into trim those tiny tanks deplete so fast that I always seem to have the last few flush, then protruding from the trim. Countersinking trim gun nails (made to bend when they strike something hard)always makes a mess. So it seems useless to most professionals I know, and too expensive for the average homeowner to get any real use out of it. You can buy a nice hot dog for $100 that stow nicely, and has a lot of nailing power. I just bought this one about a month ago when it was on sale, and it has proven to be a nice little unit. https://goo.gl/YpMkQf The high pressure of the unit keeps the tank full, and it recovers nicely. I use it for siding installs, trim work, repairs, light framing, etc. With the battery in it, the DeWalt only weighs a few pounds less than this unit, and has nowhere near the utility value. My only gripe with the Lowe's unit is that it is loud, as are all the oiless compressors. Not as loud as a couple of others I have owned, but still loud to me. Robert The battery operated framing nailers are coming along rather nicely. I have a Ridgid battery operated trim nailer and it's pretty cool. Not fast, but hella convenient. My buddy has the DeWalt battery framer and it sure beats lugging the hose around. Again, not quite as fast, but for anyone who'd be satisfied with the inefficiency of the battery compressor, the battery framer would rock their world. We framed up a set of stairs with platforms on a deck with it and it didn't really slow us down at all. A heck of a lot faster (and easier) than the Armstrong - - - - - |
Battery operated compressor
On Tuesday, June 12, 2018 at 8:49:19 PM UTC-5, Clare Snyder wrote:
My only gripe with the Lowe's unit is that it is loud, as are all the oiless compressors. Not as loud as a couple of others I have owned, but still loud to me. That's what long hoses are for - - - - - - Hah! No kidding. If I can, the compressor always winds up as far away as possible from me. Around that piercing, loud drone all day long is not only headache inducing, but annoying as hell. I have had a few compressors that are haunted. My phone will ring, I answer it, and I am in the middle of my "thank you for calling my company" spiel or trying to find out where material is and the compressor's sensor recognizes that, and starts the motor. Or, I can be talking to one of the guys, get to a detailed part of the discussion, and once again the machine kicks in. Uncanny... Robert |
Battery operated compressor
|
Battery operated compressor
On 6/13/18 12:11 AM, wrote:
On Tuesday, June 12, 2018 at 8:49:19 PM UTC-5, Clare Snyder wrote: My only gripe with the Lowe's unit is that it is loud, as are all the oiless compressors. Not as loud as a couple of others I have owned, but still loud to me. That's what long hoses are for - - - - - - Hah! No kidding. If I can, the compressor always winds up as far away as possible from me. Around that piercing, loud drone all day long is not only headache inducing, but annoying as hell. I have had a few compressors that are haunted. My phone will ring, I answer it, and I am in the middle of my "thank you for calling my company" spiel or trying to find out where material is and the compressor's sensor recognizes that, and starts the motor. Or, I can be talking to one of the guys, get to a detailed part of the discussion, and once again the machine kicks in. Uncanny... Robert I did a deck rehab job with a friend who's air hoses all had leaks. Pretty simple fixes but he never fixed them. The guns would shoot about 3 trim nails before the compressor kicked back on. In fact, it would still kick on about every minute even if you weren't using any guns on it. It was about as annoying as it gets. Add to that the fact that the client was one of these guys who had to ask questions about what we were doing, every little step of the way. "Why are you doing it that way?" "Why wouldn't you just do it like...?" "Are you sure that's going to be strong enough?" Every time he'd come out to ask questions, that stupid compressor would kick on right as I was starting the answer. -- -MIKE- "Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life" --Elvin Jones (1927-2004) -- www.mikedrums.com |
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