On 1/14/2017 2:58 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
On 1/14/17 8:48 AM, Jack wrote:
On 1/13/2017 2:48 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Is it really that hard for posters here to delete the irrelevant text
that they are responding to? It's a very common problem from many of
the regulars here and that has long been an annoying thing in usenet.
Really guys - you can't snip everything except the relevant point you
are responding to? Sheese...

One of my main peeves, although I gave up complaining about it during
Fidonet days. When you see me not snip a long post, you can be sure
it's to get back at the poster(s) that didn't snip to begin with. It's
FAR more annoying than punctuation issues.

If they are too freaking lazy/dumb to snip, I'm happy to add to the mix.
Complaining about it never works, so might as well try to annoy them
back.


I'm not so irritated by it anymore for a couple reasons.
1. Snipping long posts was necessary when people were paying for data
downloaded and using 14k modems that took quite a while to download even
text.

It was a minor issue with 9600k modems, ended with 14K, and non existent
with 56K. The bitch is not about paying for the data, it is annoying to
page though meaningless gibberish to see a reply related to one sentence
in a message. It was bad form in Fidonet days, and bad form today, for
the same reason.

Neither of those things are a concern anymore, since newsgroups
are never going to put anyone over a data limit and nobody's of dial-up
anymore. (If you are, that's your problem!) :-)

Like I said, that has not been an issue since 14k modems, and is not the
issue today.

2. The fact that we're even debating this in a newsgroup is like
complaining about the 8-track cassette fading out and switching tracks
in the middle of the guitar solo.

Nobody but you mentioned data cost/speed issue, that was stupid even in
14k days. It is poor form and annoying to post 50 lines of text and say
"agreed" at the end. It is NOT a cost or thru-put issue. You brought
up the speed/cost issue, then argued against it. Classic Strawman.

--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

On 1/14/2017 3:20 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 14 Jan 2017 09:12:54 -0500, Jack wrote:

Since neither of you seem to have any experience with
online retailing, perhaps you're both tilting at windmills.

How would you know how much experience we have with on line retailing?

Besides, we certainly have plenty of experience with on-line retailing
from the customers point of view, and that's about all that counts. If
the customer doesn't like what you're doing, you're doing it wrong.

Well that's certainly a novel idea --- If the customer is always
right, perhaps he should go into buainess while he knows it all?
Perhaps the "customer" can change the laws of economics - - - -

All retailers live by the basic law of economics, which is no customers
no business. It is directly where the saying "the customer is always
right" comes from. If Sears or Amazon can't make me happy in a
competitive market, they will fall. Sears is about toast, as are most
local retail outlets. Online will kill off most of them, either today,
or tomorrow, but die they will.

Sears makes me unhappy charging 79 cents for a nickle item (shelf
bracket) and making me look for a half hour for a salesman. Amazon
makes me unhappy charging $26 for a $14 product (Sony earphones). I
just noticed Amazon is charging $56 for an $18 chair slide. Do it
enough and you will be toast, that's a basic law of economics in a
competitive market.

--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

On 1/14/2017 3:29 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 14 Jan 2017 09:36:10 -0500, Jack wrote:

On 1/13/2017 12:37 PM, Leon wrote:

It just seemed that Jack was comparing different prices on Amazon for
the same thing and apparently not noticing that a low price, that does
not include shipping, was more expensive than the Prime item which
included shipping.

No, that's not what I was doing, and in fact bitched about item prices
being higher when bought thru prime. If an item cost $5 plus $5
shipping and $9 with free shipping under prime, then, how much free
shipping are you getting? Someone is lying, both can't be right. I'm
absolutely certain Amazon used to do that, not sure if they still do,
but they did, and I bet they still do.

Granted again prices are all over the board on Amazon. While Prime is
expensive up front each year, $99, that gets whittled away quickly if
you need items quickly and actually pay extra for 2nd day delivery.

Prime is good for some and so much for others.

My kids have Prime, I sometimes buy through them if the item warrants
it. Mostly I just add stuff to my wish list and when it gets high enough
for free shipping, I buy it. Everything they sell doesn't qualify for
free shipping, and everything doesn't qualify for prime, so due
diligence is required. I've been screwed more than once when I paid
stupid prices for shipping that I thought was included with the free
stuff.

Another nasty habit I noticed is sometimes an online search will find
the item on Amazon at a low price. If you go off the page and do a
search directly on Amazon for the exact same item, it comes up with a
different price and you can't get back to the original price. They
obviously have a number of pricing schemes to get into your pocket.
Another reason Amazon loses trust from me. They are a shaky out fit and
if you are price conscious (cheap, like me) due diligence is a must.

You finally caught on. It's up to YOU - not Amazon, or anyone else,
what you pay. Either you do your homework and find a price you can
live with - and then live with it - or you keep looking and don't buy.

I always knew this. About time you caught on that it is up the the
retailer to make me happy and gain my trust if they want to continue
doing business with me. If a retailer gets over on me one to many
times, I will no longer go to him for my needs. I've lost a ton of
trust in Amazon over the years, I still go there, but ALWAYS look around
to other places before buying from them.

"free shipping" is a PLOY. It is not crooked. There is no such thing
as a "free lunch". Prime pricing is "shipping included" pricing. It
is "convenience" pricing and "convenience" shopping.. It does not
implement "combined shipping" and the economies that go with that.

You say that, but, $28 for a set of Sony headphones plus shipping at
Amazon vs $14 and free shipping from Walmart is not a ploy, it was a
fact. Amazon added to their "BAD SIDE" ledger on that one, and there
seem to be more and more as time goes on. If you followed the post here
on Forever wood glides, the price difference was pretty silly, $56 vs
$19 for 20 at the tool shop. Unless the tool shop charges $38 for
shipping, Amazon is out to lunch again.

The only "free shipping" that really does appear to be free is buying
stuff from China or other far east countries on Ebay where you buy
something for less than it would cost you to send an empty envelope.
In those cases, the chinese government is subsidizing the foreign
trade by ssubsidizing the shipping..

Pretty much nothing is manufactured in the US any more, so the above
applies to most everything, right?

I still can't figure out how I can buy something like an arduino
micro, fully assembled, for less than the price of the processor chip
- and have it shipped from China (for something like $3, believe it or
not - try sending a letter to China for under $3 postage from the USA
or Canada - - -)

While Chinese government subsidies may be a factor, the big factor is
labor and taxes. Trump wants to fix the tax thing by lowering business
tax from 35% to 15% which is more like China. What's he going to do
about wages? Nothing, can't be done, so it will have to be tariffs,
which means my $14 Sony headphone will cost $100 which means minimum
wage will need to go to $35/hr, which means... well, looks grim to me.
At least it's a lot easier adding zero's to a computer screen than
wheeling around paper in a wheelbarrow to buy something.

--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

On Mon, 16 Jan 2017 09:50:23 -0500, "J. Clarke"
wrote:

In article ,
says...

Jack writes:
On 1/13/2017 3:05 PM, wrote:

There is a REASON there is a difference between wholesale (warehouse)
and retail (store) pricing - and it has nothing to do with the
retailer going after your gonads.

The reason a retailer is going after my gonads is not important to me.
If an item cost 3-10 times as much at a retail store, I'm not likely
going to buy it, nor will their price gouging ways send a chill up my leg.

I hate buying machine screws at Borgs, they come in sealed package of 3
for .99. I need 4, and the price is stupid.

Most of their customers only need two screws, and are not interested
in storing 98 others ad infinitum. Can't make everyone happy
(although my local Orchard Supply Hardware will sell the two/four packs
and also will sell an entire box of 25/50/100).

Home Depot, Lowes aren't generally selling to the trade.

Hardware stores used to
sell them by the pound and they were cheap. Lowes sells threaded
inserts individually for 10x's more than I can buy them at Granger.

Why Sears, Lowes, Home Depot won't give a decent price on small items is
not important to me.

Again, your lack of retailing experience shows. It costs the retailer
money to stock small items (e.g. those bags of three screws) for packaging,
shipping, stocking, tracking.

I guess enough people don't mind getting screwed,
or even know they are getting screwed.

Life must really suck for you.

You don't seem to understand sales--you seem to
be one of those back room accountants who says
"we have to charge x for this item and never
mind that the guy across the street sells it for
x/10". And after a while you decide to remove
the item because you never sell any of them.
And so it goes until the guy across the street
has put you out of business.
You would rather he sell everything below cost, and drive HIMSELF out
of business? Either way the result is the same.

"I'm only loosing a little bit on each sale - I'll make it up on
volume"

On 1/16/17 10:15 AM, Jack wrote:
On 1/14/2017 2:58 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
On 1/14/17 8:48 AM, Jack wrote:
On 1/13/2017 2:48 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Is it really that hard for posters here to delete the irrelevant text
that they are responding to? It's a very common problem from many of
the regulars here and that has long been an annoying thing in usenet.
Really guys - you can't snip everything except the relevant point you
are responding to? Sheese...

One of my main peeves, although I gave up complaining about it during
Fidonet days. When you see me not snip a long post, you can be sure
it's to get back at the poster(s) that didn't snip to begin with. It's
FAR more annoying than punctuation issues.

If they are too freaking lazy/dumb to snip, I'm happy to add to the mix.
Complaining about it never works, so might as well try to annoy them
back.


I'm not so irritated by it anymore for a couple reasons.
1. Snipping long posts was necessary when people were paying for data
downloaded and using 14k modems that took quite a while to download even
text.

It was a minor issue with 9600k modems, ended with 14K, and non existent
with 56K. The bitch is not about paying for the data, it is annoying to
page though meaningless gibberish to see a reply related to one sentence
in a message. It was bad form in Fidonet days, and bad form today, for
the same reason.

Neither of those things are a concern anymore, since newsgroups
are never going to put anyone over a data limit and nobody's of dial-up
anymore. (If you are, that's your problem!) :-)

Like I said, that has not been an issue since 14k modems, and is not the
issue today.

2. The fact that we're even debating this in a newsgroup is like
complaining about the 8-track cassette fading out and switching tracks
in the middle of the guitar solo.

Nobody but you mentioned data cost/speed issue, that was stupid even in
14k days. It is poor form and annoying to post 50 lines of text and say
"agreed" at the end. It is NOT a cost or thru-put issue. You brought
up the speed/cost issue, then argued against it. Classic Strawman.


I still do it because it gives you an opportunity to bitch about
something, which you obviously love doing. Glad I can help.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On Mon, 16 Jan 2017 11:37:55 -0500, Jack wrote:

On 1/14/2017 3:20 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 14 Jan 2017 09:12:54 -0500, Jack wrote:

Since neither of you seem to have any experience with
online retailing, perhaps you're both tilting at windmills.

How would you know how much experience we have with on line retailing?

Besides, we certainly have plenty of experience with on-line retailing
from the customers point of view, and that's about all that counts. If
the customer doesn't like what you're doing, you're doing it wrong.

Well that's certainly a novel idea --- If the customer is always
right, perhaps he should go into buainess while he knows it all?
Perhaps the "customer" can change the laws of economics - - - -

All retailers live by the basic law of economics, which is no customers
no business. It is directly where the saying "the customer is always
right" comes from. If Sears or Amazon can't make me happy in a
competitive market, they will fall. Sears is about toast, as are most
local retail outlets. Online will kill off most of them, either today,
or tomorrow, but die they will.

Sears makes me unhappy charging 79 cents for a nickle item (shelf
bracket) and making me look for a half hour for a salesman. Amazon
makes me unhappy charging $26 for a $14 product (Sony earphones). I
just noticed Amazon is charging $56 for an $18 chair slide. Do it
enough and you will be toast, that's a basic law of economics in a
competitive market.
And how do YOU determine it is a nocle item, or a $14 product?, or
an $18 chair slide? Just because someone had them on either clearance
or as a loss leader does NOT make them only worth that amount.

If the replacement cost to the retailer is more than a nickel he can't
sell them for a nickel. Depending on the volume he buys at a time, his
price may vary from $0.05 to $0.17 each - then the shipping costs getr
devided by yhe number bought, and added to that cost - so if shipping
is $10.00 for a minimum order of 100, and the same for up to 500, his
shipping cost per unit ranges from 2 cents to 10 cents each for
shipping. If he buys 1000 at a time, it's only 1 cent each --

The more he buys, the more his warehousing costs and carrying costs
(including opportunity costs) are per unit, which can easily offset
the ammortized shipping savings.

By the time that nickel part is sold, if he has an average turnover
cycle of 90 days, his total cost will be somewhere between $0.08 and
$0.20 cents per unit - and that's not counting retail costs (keeping
the lights on, paying the cashier, cleaning staff, heat and AC, etc -
nor is it accounting for the "five finger discount" shrinkage due to
the "customer" who figures it's fair play becaude he's being "ripped
off" for $0.20 for a nickel item.

In many cases, with parts such as those shelf brackets, the "five
finger discount" can exceed 30%..

You really need to have some experience on the reseller side, or an
education in basic business accounting, to understand that YOUR
understanding is WAY off.

So how do the online retailers sell for the price they sell for??
I'll give you an example.

Say ou can buy a brake rotor for your 1004 Taurus, for anywhere from
$9 to $30 on a given day from Rock Auto, pluis $7 shipping.

That same part is $39 shop price at Napa, with a $54 MSRP, or as a
mechanic your shop price from the Ford Dealer is $57 with a MSRP of,
say, $85.

Just pulling numbers out of a hat here, based on past experience.

How does Rock Auto sell for such low prices???

They buy the dead stock off the shelves of bankrupt resellers, and
overstock from large warehousing companies who are optimizing their
shelf space and minimizing their "opportunity cost" by freeing up cash
to buy higher profit and higher turnover parts. They buy the stock
for pennies on the dollar.
So just because Rock Auto can sell you a Centric brand rotor for $9
does NOT mean that ba Centric brand rotor is only worth $9. Nor does
the fact they can sell you a motorcraft rotor for $27 mean the
Motorcraft rotor is only worth $27, or that it is worth 3 times as
much as a Centric branded rotor.

The actual wholesale value of both may be close to $20, and the "fair
retail" may be closer to $55. Your NAPA store may well be paying $35
each quantity 10, and $40 for a single order shipped to their store
for a NAPA branded rotor that came off the Centric asswembly line.

On Mon, 16 Jan 2017 12:06:58 -0500, Jack wrote:

On 1/14/2017 3:29 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 14 Jan 2017 09:36:10 -0500, Jack wrote:

On 1/13/2017 12:37 PM, Leon wrote:

It just seemed that Jack was comparing different prices on Amazon for
the same thing and apparently not noticing that a low price, that does
not include shipping, was more expensive than the Prime item which
included shipping.

No, that's not what I was doing, and in fact bitched about item prices
being higher when bought thru prime. If an item cost $5 plus $5
shipping and $9 with free shipping under prime, then, how much free
shipping are you getting? Someone is lying, both can't be right. I'm
absolutely certain Amazon used to do that, not sure if they still do,
but they did, and I bet they still do.

Granted again prices are all over the board on Amazon. While Prime is
expensive up front each year, $99, that gets whittled away quickly if
you need items quickly and actually pay extra for 2nd day delivery.

Prime is good for some and so much for others.

My kids have Prime, I sometimes buy through them if the item warrants
it. Mostly I just add stuff to my wish list and when it gets high enough
for free shipping, I buy it. Everything they sell doesn't qualify for
free shipping, and everything doesn't qualify for prime, so due
diligence is required. I've been screwed more than once when I paid
stupid prices for shipping that I thought was included with the free
stuff.

Another nasty habit I noticed is sometimes an online search will find
the item on Amazon at a low price. If you go off the page and do a
search directly on Amazon for the exact same item, it comes up with a
different price and you can't get back to the original price. They
obviously have a number of pricing schemes to get into your pocket.
Another reason Amazon loses trust from me. They are a shaky out fit and
if you are price conscious (cheap, like me) due diligence is a must.

You finally caught on. It's up to YOU - not Amazon, or anyone else,
what you pay. Either you do your homework and find a price you can
live with - and then live with it - or you keep looking and don't buy.

I always knew this. About time you caught on that it is up the the
retailer to make me happy and gain my trust if they want to continue
doing business with me. If a retailer gets over on me one to many
times, I will no longer go to him for my needs. I've lost a ton of
trust in Amazon over the years, I still go there, but ALWAYS look around
to other places before buying from them.

"free shipping" is a PLOY. It is not crooked. There is no such thing
as a "free lunch". Prime pricing is "shipping included" pricing. It
is "convenience" pricing and "convenience" shopping.. It does not
implement "combined shipping" and the economies that go with that.

You say that, but, $28 for a set of Sony headphones plus shipping at
Amazon vs $14 and free shipping from Walmart is not a ploy, it was a
fact. Amazon added to their "BAD SIDE" ledger on that one, and there
seem to be more and more as time goes on. If you followed the post here
on Forever wood glides, the price difference was pretty silly, $56 vs
$19 for 20 at the tool shop. Unless the tool shop charges $38 for
shipping, Amazon is out to lunch again.

The only "free shipping" that really does appear to be free is buying
stuff from China or other far east countries on Ebay where you buy
something for less than it would cost you to send an empty envelope.
In those cases, the chinese government is subsidizing the foreign
trade by ssubsidizing the shipping..

Pretty much nothing is manufactured in the US any more, so the above
applies to most everything, right?

I still can't figure out how I can buy something like an arduino
micro, fully assembled, for less than the price of the processor chip
- and have it shipped from China (for something like $3, believe it or
not - try sending a letter to China for under $3 postage from the USA
or Canada - - -)

While Chinese government subsidies may be a factor, the big factor is
labor and taxes. Trump wants to fix the tax thing by lowering business
tax from 35% to 15% which is more like China. What's he going to do
about wages? Nothing, can't be done, so it will have to be tariffs,
which means my $14 Sony headphone will cost $100 which means minimum
wage will need to go to $35/hr, which means... well, looks grim to me.
At least it's a lot easier adding zero's to a computer screen than
wheeling around paper in a wheelbarrow to buy something.
Please see my last posting.\ And as far as Walmart pricing, you
should really try being a supplier to Walmart sometime - you'll find
out what being SCREWED really feals like!!!

On 2017-01-09, notbob wrote:

You see a lotta Dan Electro's in use, these days. The "lipstick"
pick-up is held in high esteem by many of today's hipsters. The
guitar, itself, is still essentially junk.

I stand by what I sed, above.

I jes played a Danelectro/Silvertone, a guitar I gave my friend new
high-end strings to re-string it with. He re-strung it, I played it.
The strings were worth more than the guitar!

I also read that wiki link of "Danelectro" guitar players. provided.
Note that most of the players listed owned Sivertone/Danelectro gear
early in their career, much like myself (cheap!). After they started
making some $$$$, they rarely touched one, again. (Except fer the
"hipsters" that think that "lipstick" pup is all that)

My buddy keeps his cuz it has "sentimental value". That's the only
value it has. Again, it's basically junk!

nb

On 1/16/2017 10:37 AM, Jack wrote:
On 1/14/2017 3:20 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 14 Jan 2017 09:12:54 -0500, Jack wrote:

Since neither of you seem to have any experience with
online retailing, perhaps you're both tilting at windmills.

How would you know how much experience we have with on line retailing?

Besides, we certainly have plenty of experience with on-line retailing
from the customers point of view, and that's about all that counts. If
the customer doesn't like what you're doing, you're doing it wrong.

Well that's certainly a novel idea --- If the customer is always
right, perhaps he should go into buainess while he knows it all?
Perhaps the "customer" can change the laws of economics - - - -

All retailers live by the basic law of economics, which is no customers
no business. It is directly where the saying "the customer is always
right" comes from.


If Sears or Amazon can't make me happy in a
competitive market, they will fall.

I seriously doubt that your feelings of happiness will affect Sears or
Amazon. It will be what the people are looking for that determines
failure or not.

Some of the most hated corporations are doing OK. You can enter most
any TV content provider, Comcast and most any cellular service.


Sears is about toast, as are most
local retail outlets. Online will kill off most of them, either today,
or tomorrow, but die they will.

Some will fail but there is always going to be a great demand for
getting the product in your hands right now.



Sears makes me unhappy charging 79 cents for a nickle item (shelf
bracket) and making me look for a half hour for a salesman. Amazon
makes me unhappy charging $26 for a $14 product (Sony earphones). I
just noticed Amazon is charging $56 for an $18 chair slide. Do it
enough and you will be toast, that's a basic law of economics in a
competitive market.


This is nothing new and has been going on for decades.

On 1/16/2017 11:31 AM, wrote:
On Mon, 16 Jan 2017 09:50:23 -0500, "J. Clarke"
wrote:

In article ,
says...

Jack writes:
On 1/13/2017 3:05 PM, wrote:

There is a REASON there is a difference between wholesale (warehouse)
and retail (store) pricing - and it has nothing to do with the
retailer going after your gonads.

The reason a retailer is going after my gonads is not important to me.
If an item cost 3-10 times as much at a retail store, I'm not likely
going to buy it, nor will their price gouging ways send a chill up my leg.

I hate buying machine screws at Borgs, they come in sealed package of 3
for .99. I need 4, and the price is stupid.

Most of their customers only need two screws, and are not interested
in storing 98 others ad infinitum. Can't make everyone happy
(although my local Orchard Supply Hardware will sell the two/four packs
and also will sell an entire box of 25/50/100).

Home Depot, Lowes aren't generally selling to the trade.

Hardware stores used to
sell them by the pound and they were cheap. Lowes sells threaded
inserts individually for 10x's more than I can buy them at Granger.

Why Sears, Lowes, Home Depot won't give a decent price on small items is
not important to me.

Again, your lack of retailing experience shows. It costs the retailer
money to stock small items (e.g. those bags of three screws) for packaging,
shipping, stocking, tracking.

I guess enough people don't mind getting screwed,
or even know they are getting screwed.

Life must really suck for you.

You don't seem to understand sales--you seem to
be one of those back room accountants who says
"we have to charge x for this item and never
mind that the guy across the street sells it for
x/10". And after a while you decide to remove
the item because you never sell any of them.
And so it goes until the guy across the street
has put you out of business.
You would rather he sell everything below cost, and drive HIMSELF out
of business? Either way the result is the same.

"I'm only loosing a little bit on each sale - I'll make it up on
volume"


Any retailer that has a fixed percentage of mark up on his entire
inventory is an idiot. Every item must be considered when it come to
mark up. You must consider turn over, cost of handling and floor space
used. If an item is not selling, you mark it down, and if you have to
mark it down too much you don't replace it, unless it is a relative
inexpensive item and is a loss leader.

On 1/16/2017 10:06 AM, Brewster wrote:
On 1/15/17 11:28 AM, Leon wrote:
On 1/15/2017 11:23 AM, J. Clarke wrote:
Snip


Also, I noticed a lot of stuff you buy at the Borgs have unique model
numbers for stuff, and looking up those numbers turn up nothing. I
would imagine this tactic would put a crimp in price matching if the
store didn't want to match prices. $1 difference, no problem, $100
difference, big problem....

It can. At the other end, Walmart sometimes has
products with the same SKU as the ones you buy
elsewhere but the product has been cheapened in
some way, which is something I really wish the
FTC would start stepping on.



Same product/model number and one is built with cheaper parts.

I ask, how does one prove that. And is that maybe not just a case of
the manufacturer improving the product with out changing the model
number?

Case in point.

When the fresh roasted green chile runs out and we are Jonesing for a
fix, we have occasionally picked up a tub from either the local
supermarket or Wal mart. Consistently, the Wal Mart tubs have lots more
peels and other undesireables where as the supermarket version is fine.

Tubs look the same (same SKU), but our guess is that undoubtedly Wal
Mart demands the manufacturer supply at a lower price, so the
manufacturer provides a product that falls down a notch on their QC.

Easy enough to do (for a manufacturer) with foods, a bit more difficult
to do with electronics, etc. Given the volume that Wal Mart generates
for them, I'd bet that they find a way to modify production to satisfy
the Wal Mart contracts and help keep their bottom line.

FWIW
-BR





One time use consumables are way different than a product designed to be
used for years.

-MIKE- wrote:
On 1/16/17 10:15 AM, Jack wrote:
On 1/14/2017 2:58 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
On 1/14/17 8:48 AM, Jack wrote:
On 1/13/2017 2:48 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Is it really that hard for posters here to delete the irrelevant text
that they are responding to? It's a very common problem from many of
the regulars here and that has long been an annoying thing in usenet.
Really guys - you can't snip everything except the relevant point you
are responding to? Sheese...

One of my main peeves, although I gave up complaining about it during
Fidonet days. When you see me not snip a long post, you can be sure
it's to get back at the poster(s) that didn't snip to begin with. It's
FAR more annoying than punctuation issues.

If they are too freaking lazy/dumb to snip, I'm happy to add to the
mix.
Complaining about it never works, so might as well try to annoy them
back.


I'm not so irritated by it anymore for a couple reasons.
1. Snipping long posts was necessary when people were paying for data
downloaded and using 14k modems that took quite a while to download even
text.

It was a minor issue with 9600k modems, ended with 14K, and non existent
with 56K. The bitch is not about paying for the data, it is annoying to
page though meaningless gibberish to see a reply related to one sentence
in a message. It was bad form in Fidonet days, and bad form today, for
the same reason.

Neither of those things are a concern anymore, since newsgroups
are never going to put anyone over a data limit and nobody's of dial-up
anymore. (If you are, that's your problem!) :-)

Like I said, that has not been an issue since 14k modems, and is not the
issue today.

2. The fact that we're even debating this in a newsgroup is like
complaining about the 8-track cassette fading out and switching tracks
in the middle of the guitar solo.

Nobody but you mentioned data cost/speed issue, that was stupid even in
14k days. It is poor form and annoying to post 50 lines of text and say
"agreed" at the end. It is NOT a cost or thru-put issue. You brought
up the speed/cost issue, then argued against it. Classic Strawman.


I still do it because it gives you an opportunity to bitch about
something, which you obviously love doing. Glad I can help.



I just think that all of you guys that cannot snip irrelevant text are
just assholes - or something like that,



--
-Mike-


---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

On 1/16/17 11:41 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
-MIKE- wrote:
On 1/16/17 10:15 AM, Jack wrote:
On 1/14/2017 2:58 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
On 1/14/17 8:48 AM, Jack wrote:
On 1/13/2017 2:48 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Is it really that hard for posters here to delete the irrelevant text
that they are responding to? It's a very common problem from many of
the regulars here and that has long been an annoying thing in usenet.
Really guys - you can't snip everything except the relevant point you
are responding to? Sheese...

One of my main peeves, although I gave up complaining about it during
Fidonet days. When you see me not snip a long post, you can be sure
it's to get back at the poster(s) that didn't snip to begin with. It's
FAR more annoying than punctuation issues.

If they are too freaking lazy/dumb to snip, I'm happy to add to the
mix.
Complaining about it never works, so might as well try to annoy them
back.


I'm not so irritated by it anymore for a couple reasons.
1. Snipping long posts was necessary when people were paying for data
downloaded and using 14k modems that took quite a while to download
even
text.

It was a minor issue with 9600k modems, ended with 14K, and non existent
with 56K. The bitch is not about paying for the data, it is annoying to
page though meaningless gibberish to see a reply related to one sentence
in a message. It was bad form in Fidonet days, and bad form today, for
the same reason.

Neither of those things are a concern anymore, since newsgroups
are never going to put anyone over a data limit and nobody's of dial-up
anymore. (If you are, that's your problem!) :-)

Like I said, that has not been an issue since 14k modems, and is not the
issue today.

2. The fact that we're even debating this in a newsgroup is like
complaining about the 8-track cassette fading out and switching tracks
in the middle of the guitar solo.

Nobody but you mentioned data cost/speed issue, that was stupid even in
14k days. It is poor form and annoying to post 50 lines of text and say
"agreed" at the end. It is NOT a cost or thru-put issue. You brought
up the speed/cost issue, then argued against it. Classic Strawman.


I still do it because it gives you an opportunity to bitch about
something, which you obviously love doing. Glad I can help.



I just think that all of you guys that cannot snip irrelevant text are
just assholes - or something like that,


That's probably the best assessment of the situation, by far. :-D


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 1/15/2017 11:00 PM, Leon wrote:
On 1/15/2017 9:35 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 15 Jan 2017 12:37:05 -0600, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 1/15/2017 11:17 AM, J. Clarke wrote:
In article 5bb738e7-7ee8-4c16-bd7e-e2a188f30248
@googlegroups.com,
says...

On Thursday, January 12, 2017 at 9:37:06 AM UTC-6, Jack wrote:

It's not hindsight, it is now. Sears could have easily shifted to
online sales at any time, but my guess is management had their
collective heads where the sun don't shine.

Amazon started from scratch, Sears had a long history of catalog
sales.
They blew it big time by ignoring the CURRENT trends. How on earth
could
a retail store with a history of catalog sales IGNORE Amazon? Brain
dead is what I think.

--
Jack

You seem to believe everything is so easy. Back in August Wal-Mart
paid $3 BILLION for Jet.com online sales company. After spending
years trying to increase online sales at Wal-Mart. Did all the
fools at Wal-Mart have their head up their behinds? Why couldn't
they just make online sales magically? Why? Wal-Mart is the
largest retailer in the world. How could they not know how to sell
online?

As for comparing catalog sales to online sales. Maybe they are
similar, maybe not. Catalog sales for Sears started dying out in
the 50s, 60s. They had physical stores so no need for catalog
sales. And the US became far more urban, not rural, in the second
half of the century. Today everyone almost lives in a city or near
a city. So today almost everyone is close to a physical Sears
store. Why would they use a catalog? Online sales you have 50
choices and prices.
Catalog you have 5. Are they the same? I have a tool catalog from
Acme Tools on the shelf. I doubt I would order anything from it.
I'd go to the store in town or use the internet. Is a catalog the
same as online ordering, even in philosophy?

You really are looking at this from the wrong
perspective. A "catalog" is not a paper book,
it is a list of items offered for sale. When
you order from Amazon you are ordering from a
catalog. May not seem that way but when you
make something available for sale on Amazon you
have to provide the information about what you
are selling and how much you want to charge for
it and so on and it goes into Amazon's database
where it becomes visible to potential buyers.
That database is no different in concept from
the Sears Big Book--the only difference is that
it's electronic and dynamic rather than paper
and static.


One importance difference is that some paper catalogs have codes that
will give you the same price as what is stated in the catalog.
Expiration dates,a change of season, usually put an end to that pricing,
ie. Spring Catalog or Winter catalog.


Many web sites ask for that code to give you the catalog price which may
or may not be the price stated on line.. IIRC LeeValley does this.

If you go to the internet the pricing can, as you stated, change "when
ever".

E-mails often have a discount code to lower the on-line pricing.

It goes a lot further than this. The price can change based on your
zip code, your purchasing history, your browsing histroy, or even what
browser you're using. They're watching.


Yes but if you have a catalog reference code to lock in the catalog
price it does not matter where you are, you get that price.



What if the "locked in price" is from 1999 Email catalog?

(Posted at end of 100 lines of extraneous text to conform to ignorance
level of previous poster[s])

--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

On 1/16/2017 9:32 AM, Scott Lurndal wrote:
Jack writes:

Since neither of you seem to have any experience with
online retailing, perhaps you're both tilting at windmills.

How would you know how much experience we have with on line retailing?

Besides, we certainly have plenty of experience with on-line retailing
from the customers point of view, and that's about all that counts. If
the customer doesn't like what you're doing, you're doing it wrong.

The customer doesn't necessarily know _how_ to run an on-line retailing business,
so I stand by the statement that you don't seem to have any experience
with online retailing. Inventory, Shipping, Taxes, Dispute resolution,
Returns, Sales Taxes, Legal, Finance et cetera et alia.

Customer doesn't care about _how_ to run an on-line retailing business.
On-line and off line retailer must be able to make customers happy, or
they are done.

As far as "Inventory, Shipping, Taxes, Dispute resolution, Returns,
Sales Taxes, Legal, Finance et cetera et alia." is concerned, it is not
much different than off-line retailing. You need to know how to present
it to the customer on-line, and I'm more familiar with that than you think.

--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

On 1/17/2017 9:27 AM, Jack wrote:
Snip


It goes a lot further than this. The price can change based on your
zip code, your purchasing history, your browsing histroy, or even what
browser you're using. They're watching.


Yes but if you have a catalog reference code to lock in the catalog
price it does not matter where you are, you get that price.



What if the "locked in price" is from 1999 Email catalog?

(Posted at end of 100 lines of extraneous text to conform to ignorance
level of previous poster[s])




In another post I indicated that the catalog must be one of the current
ones, Winter 2016 or Spring 2017.

Prices often change during a season and or a period that the catalog is
still valid.

The changed pricing shows up "on-line" as different than the catalog but
if you enter the key catalog number at check out it changes the price
back to the catalog price.

On 1/16/2017 9:43 AM, Scott Lurndal wrote:
Jack writes:
On 1/13/2017 3:05 PM, wrote:

There is a REASON there is a difference between wholesale (warehouse)
and retail (store) pricing - and it has nothing to do with the
retailer going after your gonads.

The reason a retailer is going after my gonads is not important to me.
If an item cost 3-10 times as much at a retail store, I'm not likely
going to buy it, nor will their price gouging ways send a chill up my leg.

I hate buying machine screws at Borgs, they come in sealed package of 3
for .99. I need 4, and the price is stupid.

Most of their customers only need two screws, and are not interested
in storing 98 others ad infinitum. Can't make everyone happy
(although my local Orchard Supply Hardware will sell the two/four packs
and also will sell an entire box of 25/50/100).

I reckon your local orchard supply hardware knows Jack about retail
sales. Perhaps your should advise them to drop the boxes as

"It costs the retailer money to stock small items (e.g. those bags of
three screws) for packaging, shipping, stocking, tracking."

Myself, I'd like it if HD carried both, just like your local hardware does.

Home Depot, Lowes aren't generally selling to the trade.

Well they sell a lot to the trades, but, one does not need to be in the
"trade" to get ****ed about paying 10x more for a product than it's
worth. They could offer boxes or 3 packs, and let the customer decide
what they need. They have options just like your Orchard has.

Hardware stores used to
sell them by the pound and they were cheap. Lowes sells threaded
inserts individually for 10x's more than I can buy them at Granger.

Why Sears, Lowes, Home Depot won't give a decent price on small items is
not important to me.

Again, your lack of retailing experience shows. It costs the retailer
money to stock small items (e.g. those bags of three screws) for packaging,
shipping, stocking, tracking.

Again, your lack of customer experience shows. Customers generally don't
like price gouging.

I guess enough people don't mind getting screwed,
or even know they are getting screwed.

Life must really suck for you.

One doesn't need to stick his head in the sand to be happy, well, I
don't anyway. Thanks for caring though...

--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

On 1/16/2017 10:56 AM, Leon wrote:
On 1/16/2017 9:51 AM, Jack wrote:
On 1/14/2017 11:26 AM, Leon wrote:
On 1/14/2017 8:36 AM, Jack wrote:
On 1/13/2017 12:37 PM, Leon wrote:

Prime is not always the least expensive way to order an item but often
it is, as seen with the shelf hanger clips/brackets.

And yet it was still 3 times cheaper than buying the same item at Sears.

Apples, Oranges.

To be fair you need to figure 50 cents per mile going
to and coming from Sears. That is your personal shipping cost.

Nope, I was already going past Sears to HD to get screwed buying 6 tiny
machine screws I needed NOW, so the shelf brackets were 79 cents and
free shipping at Sears, 5 cents and 20 cents shipping at Amazon. And
it's not apples and oranges, it is just apples, exact same item, massive
price variance.

--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

On 1/16/2017 12:47 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
On 1/16/17 10:15 AM, Jack wrote:
On 1/14/2017 2:58 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
On 1/14/17 8:48 AM, Jack wrote:
On 1/13/2017 2:48 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Is it really that hard for posters here to delete the irrelevant text
that they are responding to? It's a very common problem from many of
the regulars here and that has long been an annoying thing in usenet.
Really guys - you can't snip everything except the relevant point you
are responding to? Sheese...

One of my main peeves, although I gave up complaining about it during
Fidonet days. When you see me not snip a long post, you can be sure
it's to get back at the poster(s) that didn't snip to begin with. It's
FAR more annoying than punctuation issues.

If they are too freaking lazy/dumb to snip, I'm happy to add to the
mix.
Complaining about it never works, so might as well try to annoy them
back.


I'm not so irritated by it anymore for a couple reasons.
1. Snipping long posts was necessary when people were paying for data
downloaded and using 14k modems that took quite a while to download even
text.

It was a minor issue with 9600k modems, ended with 14K, and non existent
with 56K. The bitch is not about paying for the data, it is annoying to
page though meaningless gibberish to see a reply related to one sentence
in a message. It was bad form in Fidonet days, and bad form today, for
the same reason.

Neither of those things are a concern anymore, since newsgroups
are never going to put anyone over a data limit and nobody's of dial-up
anymore. (If you are, that's your problem!) :-)

Like I said, that has not been an issue since 14k modems, and is not the
issue today.

2. The fact that we're even debating this in a newsgroup is like
complaining about the 8-track cassette fading out and switching tracks
in the middle of the guitar solo.

Nobody but you mentioned data cost/speed issue, that was stupid even in
14k days. It is poor form and annoying to post 50 lines of text and say
"agreed" at the end. It is NOT a cost or thru-put issue. You brought
up the speed/cost issue, then argued against it. Classic Strawman.


I still do it because it gives you an opportunity to bitch about
something, which you obviously love doing. Glad I can help.


Thanks, but it was Mike Marlow that bitched about it, I pointed out
bitching about it to the lame doesn't work.

You of course brought up your own issue, and then argued against your
own issue (Classic Strawman).

I was willing to play, so Right back at ya.

--
Jack
Hope I got all my Caps and Punctuation right!!!
http://jbstein.com

Jack writes:
On 1/16/2017 9:32 AM, Scott Lurndal wrote:
Jack writes:

Since neither of you seem to have any experience with
online retailing, perhaps you're both tilting at windmills.

How would you know how much experience we have with on line retailing?

Besides, we certainly have plenty of experience with on-line retailing
from the customers point of view, and that's about all that counts. If
the customer doesn't like what you're doing, you're doing it wrong.

The customer doesn't necessarily know _how_ to run an on-line retailing business,
so I stand by the statement that you don't seem to have any experience
with online retailing. Inventory, Shipping, Taxes, Dispute resolution,
Returns, Sales Taxes, Legal, Finance et cetera et alia.

Customer doesn't care about _how_ to run an on-line retailing business.
On-line and off line retailer must be able to make customers happy, or
they are done.

They have to make enough customers happy to keep in business. They
don't have to make _you_ happy.

On 1/16/2017 1:00 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 16 Jan 2017 11:37:55 -0500, Jack wrote:

Sears makes me unhappy charging 79 cents for a nickle item (shelf
bracket) and making me look for a half hour for a salesman. Amazon
makes me unhappy charging $26 for a $14 product (Sony earphones). I
just noticed Amazon is charging $56 for an $18 chair slide. Do it
enough and you will be toast, that's a basic law of economics in a
competitive market.

And how do YOU determine it is a nocle item, or a $14 product?, or
an $18 chair slide? Just because someone had them on either clearance
or as a loss leader does NOT make them only worth that amount.

Well, if Amazon says it is for sale for a nickle, plus 20 cents
shipping, who am I to argue?

If Amazon increased the price in a couple of years from $12 to $28
dollars and Walmart sells the same item for $14 today, then I get a feel
for what something is worth. Otherwise, I can look at an item, like a 5
cent shelf bracket and say, yeah, looks like about a 5 - 10 cent item,
and should be sold for under 79 cents allowing for large profits and
ridiculous shipping and handling fees. You may not mind paying $28 for
something you can readily buy elsewhere for $14 but I don't enjoy
getting gouged, and exercise due diligence.

If the replacement cost to the retailer is more than a nickel he can't
sell them for a nickel. Depending on the volume he buys at a time, his
price may vary from $0.05 to $0.17 each - then the shipping costs getr
devided by yhe number bought, and added to that cost - so if shipping
is $10.00 for a minimum order of 100, and the same for up to 500, his
shipping cost per unit ranges from 2 cents to 10 cents each for
shipping. If he buys 1000 at a time, it's only 1 cent each --

The more he buys, the more his warehousing costs and carrying costs
(including opportunity costs) are per unit, which can easily offset
the ammortized shipping savings.

By the time that nickel part is sold, if he has an average turnover
cycle of 90 days, his total cost will be somewhere between $0.08 and
$0.20 cents per unit - and that's not counting retail costs (keeping
the lights on, paying the cashier, cleaning staff, heat and AC, etc -
nor is it accounting for the "five finger discount" shrinkage due to
the "customer" who figures it's fair play becaude he's being "ripped
off" for $0.20 for a nickel item.

In many cases, with parts such as those shelf brackets, the "five
finger discount" can exceed 30%..

You really need to have some experience on the reseller side, or an
education in basic business accounting, to understand that YOUR
understanding is WAY off.

So how do the online retailers sell for the price they sell for??
I'll give you an example.

Say ou can buy a brake rotor for your 1004 Taurus, for anywhere from
$9 to $30 on a given day from Rock Auto, pluis $7 shipping.

That same part is $39 shop price at Napa, with a $54 MSRP, or as a
mechanic your shop price from the Ford Dealer is $57 with a MSRP of,
say, $85.

Just pulling numbers out of a hat here, based on past experience.

How does Rock Auto sell for such low prices???

They buy the dead stock off the shelves of bankrupt resellers, and
overstock from large warehousing companies who are optimizing their
shelf space and minimizing their "opportunity cost" by freeing up cash
to buy higher profit and higher turnover parts. They buy the stock
for pennies on the dollar.
So just because Rock Auto can sell you a Centric brand rotor for $9
does NOT mean that ba Centric brand rotor is only worth $9. Nor does
the fact they can sell you a motorcraft rotor for $27 mean the
Motorcraft rotor is only worth $27, or that it is worth 3 times as
much as a Centric branded rotor.

The actual wholesale value of both may be close to $20, and the "fair
retail" may be closer to $55. Your NAPA store may well be paying $35
each quantity 10, and $40 for a single order shipped to their store
for a NAPA branded rotor that came off the Centric asswembly line.



--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

On 1/16/2017 1:02 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 16 Jan 2017 12:06:58 -0500, Jack wrote:

On 1/14/2017 3:29 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 14 Jan 2017 09:36:10 -0500, Jack wrote:

On 1/13/2017 12:37 PM, Leon wrote:

It just seemed that Jack was comparing different prices on Amazon for
the same thing and apparently not noticing that a low price, that does
not include shipping, was more expensive than the Prime item which
included shipping.

No, that's not what I was doing, and in fact bitched about item prices
being higher when bought thru prime. If an item cost $5 plus $5
shipping and $9 with free shipping under prime, then, how much free
shipping are you getting? Someone is lying, both can't be right. I'm
absolutely certain Amazon used to do that, not sure if they still do,
but they did, and I bet they still do.

Granted again prices are all over the board on Amazon. While Prime is
expensive up front each year, $99, that gets whittled away quickly if
you need items quickly and actually pay extra for 2nd day delivery.

Prime is good for some and so much for others.

My kids have Prime, I sometimes buy through them if the item warrants
it. Mostly I just add stuff to my wish list and when it gets high enough
for free shipping, I buy it. Everything they sell doesn't qualify for
free shipping, and everything doesn't qualify for prime, so due
diligence is required. I've been screwed more than once when I paid
stupid prices for shipping that I thought was included with the free
stuff.

Another nasty habit I noticed is sometimes an online search will find
the item on Amazon at a low price. If you go off the page and do a
search directly on Amazon for the exact same item, it comes up with a
different price and you can't get back to the original price. They
obviously have a number of pricing schemes to get into your pocket.
Another reason Amazon loses trust from me. They are a shaky out fit and
if you are price conscious (cheap, like me) due diligence is a must.

You finally caught on. It's up to YOU - not Amazon, or anyone else,
what you pay. Either you do your homework and find a price you can
live with - and then live with it - or you keep looking and don't buy.

I always knew this. About time you caught on that it is up the the
retailer to make me happy and gain my trust if they want to continue
doing business with me. If a retailer gets over on me one to many
times, I will no longer go to him for my needs. I've lost a ton of
trust in Amazon over the years, I still go there, but ALWAYS look around
to other places before buying from them.

"free shipping" is a PLOY. It is not crooked. There is no such thing
as a "free lunch". Prime pricing is "shipping included" pricing. It
is "convenience" pricing and "convenience" shopping.. It does not
implement "combined shipping" and the economies that go with that.

You say that, but, $28 for a set of Sony headphones plus shipping at
Amazon vs $14 and free shipping from Walmart is not a ploy, it was a
fact. Amazon added to their "BAD SIDE" ledger on that one, and there
seem to be more and more as time goes on. If you followed the post here
on Forever wood glides, the price difference was pretty silly, $56 vs
$19 for 20 at the tool shop. Unless the tool shop charges $38 for
shipping, Amazon is out to lunch again.

The only "free shipping" that really does appear to be free is buying
stuff from China or other far east countries on Ebay where you buy
something for less than it would cost you to send an empty envelope.
In those cases, the chinese government is subsidizing the foreign
trade by ssubsidizing the shipping..

Pretty much nothing is manufactured in the US any more, so the above
applies to most everything, right?

I still can't figure out how I can buy something like an arduino
micro, fully assembled, for less than the price of the processor chip
- and have it shipped from China (for something like $3, believe it or
not - try sending a letter to China for under $3 postage from the USA
or Canada - - -)

While Chinese government subsidies may be a factor, the big factor is
labor and taxes. Trump wants to fix the tax thing by lowering business
tax from 35% to 15% which is more like China. What's he going to do
about wages? Nothing, can't be done, so it will have to be tariffs,
which means my $14 Sony headphone will cost $100 which means minimum
wage will need to go to $35/hr, which means... well, looks grim to me.
At least it's a lot easier adding zero's to a computer screen than
wheeling around paper in a wheelbarrow to buy something.
Please see my last posting.\ And as far as Walmart pricing, you
should really try being a supplier to Walmart sometime - you'll find
out what being SCREWED really feals like!!!

No one is forced to supply Walmart and I am not forced to buy from
Walmart. Walmart MUST pay what the suppler demands and the supplier
must charge what Walmart is willing to pay. Otherwise, no deal is made.

I buy mostly at Sams club, it's generally cheaper than Walmart.

The cheapest I could find my Sony earphones was thru Walmart on line,
so, that's where I bought them. I was a happy camper, and bought 2 of
them. I don't know if Walmart, their supplier, or the manufacturer was
happy, I know I was OK with it. I'll let you lose sleep over the rest
of it.

(Posted at end of a zillion lines of extraneous un-snipped text to
conform to ignorance level of previous poster[s])
--
Jack
No matter how much you push the envelope, it'll still be stationery.
http://jbstein.com

On 1/17/2017 12:41 AM, Mike Marlow wrote:

I just think that all of you guys that cannot snip irrelevant text are
just assholes - or something like that,

i think you would be right

(irrelevant text snipped but caps and punctuation messed up to give mike
the drummer who loves to bitch something to bitch about )
--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

On 1/17/2017 1:45 AM, -MIKE- wrote:
On 1/16/17 11:41 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
-MIKE- wrote:
On 1/16/17 10:15 AM, Jack wrote:
On 1/14/2017 2:58 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
On 1/14/17 8:48 AM, Jack wrote:
On 1/13/2017 2:48 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Is it really that hard for posters here to delete the irrelevant
text
that they are responding to? It's a very common problem from
many of
the regulars here and that has long been an annoying thing in
usenet.
Really guys - you can't snip everything except the relevant point
you
are responding to? Sheese...

One of my main peeves, although I gave up complaining about it during
Fidonet days. When you see me not snip a long post, you can be sure
it's to get back at the poster(s) that didn't snip to begin with.
It's
FAR more annoying than punctuation issues.

If they are too freaking lazy/dumb to snip, I'm happy to add to the
mix.
Complaining about it never works, so might as well try to annoy them
back.


I'm not so irritated by it anymore for a couple reasons.
1. Snipping long posts was necessary when people were paying for data
downloaded and using 14k modems that took quite a while to download
even
text.

It was a minor issue with 9600k modems, ended with 14K, and non
existent
with 56K. The bitch is not about paying for the data, it is
annoying to
page though meaningless gibberish to see a reply related to one
sentence
in a message. It was bad form in Fidonet days, and bad form today, for
the same reason.

Neither of those things are a concern anymore, since newsgroups
are never going to put anyone over a data limit and nobody's of
dial-up
anymore. (If you are, that's your problem!) :-)

Like I said, that has not been an issue since 14k modems, and is not
the
issue today.

2. The fact that we're even debating this in a newsgroup is like
complaining about the 8-track cassette fading out and switching tracks
in the middle of the guitar solo.

Nobody but you mentioned data cost/speed issue, that was stupid even in
14k days. It is poor form and annoying to post 50 lines of text and
say
"agreed" at the end. It is NOT a cost or thru-put issue. You brought
up the speed/cost issue, then argued against it. Classic Strawman.


I still do it because it gives you an opportunity to bitch about
something, which you obviously love doing. Glad I can help.



I just think that all of you guys that cannot snip irrelevant text are
just assholes - or something like that,


That's probably the best assessment of the situation, by far. :-D


true enough but how easy was the call really

--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

On 1/17/2017 10:13 AM, Jack wrote:
On 1/16/2017 10:56 AM, Leon wrote:
On 1/16/2017 9:51 AM, Jack wrote:
On 1/14/2017 11:26 AM, Leon wrote:
On 1/14/2017 8:36 AM, Jack wrote:
On 1/13/2017 12:37 PM, Leon wrote:

Prime is not always the least expensive way to order an item but often
it is, as seen with the shelf hanger clips/brackets.

And yet it was still 3 times cheaper than buying the same item at Sears.

Apples, Oranges.

To be fair you need to figure 50 cents per mile going
to and coming from Sears. That is your personal shipping cost.

Nope, I was already going past Sears to HD to get screwed buying 6 tiny
machine screws I needed NOW, so the shelf brackets were 79 cents and
free shipping at Sears, 5 cents and 20 cents shipping at Amazon. And
it's not apples and oranges, it is just apples, exact same item, massive
price variance.



We can all make up a story to contradict the expected results.

On Tue, 17 Jan 2017 16:39:05 GMT, (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

Jack writes:
On 1/16/2017 9:32 AM, Scott Lurndal wrote:
Jack writes:

Since neither of you seem to have any experience with
online retailing, perhaps you're both tilting at windmills.

How would you know how much experience we have with on line retailing?

Besides, we certainly have plenty of experience with on-line retailing
from the customers point of view, and that's about all that counts. If
the customer doesn't like what you're doing, you're doing it wrong.

The customer doesn't necessarily know _how_ to run an on-line retailing business,
so I stand by the statement that you don't seem to have any experience
with online retailing. Inventory, Shipping, Taxes, Dispute resolution,
Returns, Sales Taxes, Legal, Finance et cetera et alia.

Customer doesn't care about _how_ to run an on-line retailing business.
On-line and off line retailer must be able to make customers happy, or
they are done.

They have to make enough customers happy to keep in business. They
don't have to make _you_ happy.
Somed customers cannot be satisfied - even if you PAID them to take
the product (because then they'd have nothing to biutch about, and
only bitching makes them happy.

Some customers also need to be "fired"

On Tue, 17 Jan 2017 10:40:16 -0500, Jack wrote:

On 1/16/2017 9:32 AM, Scott Lurndal wrote:
Jack writes:

Since neither of you seem to have any experience with
online retailing, perhaps you're both tilting at windmills.

How would you know how much experience we have with on line retailing?

Besides, we certainly have plenty of experience with on-line retailing
from the customers point of view, and that's about all that counts. If
the customer doesn't like what you're doing, you're doing it wrong.

The customer doesn't necessarily know _how_ to run an on-line retailing business,
so I stand by the statement that you don't seem to have any experience
with online retailing. Inventory, Shipping, Taxes, Dispute resolution,
Returns, Sales Taxes, Legal, Finance et cetera et alia.

Customer doesn't care about _how_ to run an on-line retailing business.
On-line and off line retailer must be able to make customers happy, or
they are done.

Yeah, since you've been ranting, Amazon stock has been really tanking.


As far as "Inventory, Shipping, Taxes, Dispute resolution, Returns,
Sales Taxes, Legal, Finance et cetera et alia." is concerned, it is not
much different than off-line retailing. You need to know how to present
it to the customer on-line, and I'm more familiar with that than you think.

On Tue, 17 Jan 2017 12:14:59 -0500, Jack wrote:



No one is forced to supply Walmart and I am not forced to buy from
Walmart. Walmart MUST pay what the suppler demands and the supplier
must charge what Walmart is willing to pay. Otherwise, no deal is made.

I buy mostly at Sams club, it's generally cheaper than Walmart.

The cheapest I could find my Sony earphones was thru Walmart on line,
so, that's where I bought them. I was a happy camper, and bought 2 of
them. I don't know if Walmart, their supplier, or the manufacturer was
happy, I know I was OK with it. I'll let you lose sleep over the rest
of it.

(Posted at end of a zillion lines of extraneous un-snipped text to
conform to ignorance level of previous poster[s])
Not true. A supplier works hard to get on WalMart's supplier list
because it means VOLUME - so after they get on, Walmart whores there
product out at cost or below as a loss leader (think Vladic Pickles)
and they only want the large size - so the supplier switches their
production over to the big bottles and produces at full capacity to
supply WalMart - and is unable to keep up with some of their smaller
accounts who traditionally sold the smaller bottles. After a year or
two, Walmart decides they need a lower price and tells the supplier,
drop the price to $x or no deal. By this point, the supplier needs
walmart more than walmart needs the supplier, because they have lost
their other sales - partly through lack of capacity, but moreso from
people seeing the brand as a "discouint " brand and being unwilling to
buy from the other dealers at the price they need to get to stay alive
- so the supplier drops the price - and eventually almost goes
bankrupt.

see: https://www.fastcompany.com/47593/wa...-you-dont-know

They almost took down a major shoe company as well - strikes me it was
RedWing, but I'm not sure.

On 1/17/17 11:30 AM, Jack wrote:
On 1/17/2017 12:41 AM, Mike Marlow wrote:

I just think that all of you guys that cannot snip irrelevant text are
just assholes - or something like that,

i think you would be right

(irrelevant text snipped but caps and punctuation messed up to give mike
the drummer who loves to bitch something to bitch about )

:-D Nice.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 1/5/2017 12:40 PM, Leon wrote:


It appears that StanelyBD will have to honor the warranty Craftsman
products sold by Sears unless Sears holdings goes belly up.


If Sears Holdings goes under, SB&D is not contractually obligated to
support warranty claims for Craftsman tools that were sold at Sears.
Based on comments made during the conference call, it seems possible
SB&D might choose to honor those claims to protect the reputation of the
brand and because the obligation is expected to be €œonly€� $5M per
year€”which to a company the size of SB&D is probably not much.

More details.

http://www.toolsofthetrade.net/power...c05c6eecb92632