Wine cellar door question
 

I am building a wine cellar. The door choices are mindboggling but I have
narrowed it down to two similar doors (3'0x8'0, two panels, top is glass
2/3, bottom is raised panel 1/3). The first door is solid mahogany. The
other is mahogany veneer over MDF. Both are rated for exterior. I am in
FL. The cellar will be cooled to 55 (humidity at 60-70%), the other side
will be at about 75, humidity at 40-50%. I'm told that the MDF will hold up
better and not warp. Any thoughts?

Wine cellar door question
 

"Mike" wrote in message
m...
I am building a wine cellar. The door choices are mindboggling but I have
narrowed it down to two similar doors (3'0x8'0, two panels, top is glass
2/3, bottom is raised panel 1/3). The first door is solid mahogany. The
other is mahogany veneer over MDF. Both are rated for exterior. I am in
FL. The cellar will be cooled to 55 (humidity at 60-70%), the other side
will be at about 75, humidity at 40-50%. I'm told that the MDF will hold
up better and not warp. Any thoughts?

I should add that the price difference is immaterial and the core is FSC
certified laminated veneer lumber (LVL) core not MDF.

Wine cellar door question
 

On Aug 3, 11:40*am, "Mike" wrote:
I am building a wine cellar. *The door choices are mindboggling but I have
narrowed it down to two similar doors (3'0x8'0, two panels, top is glass
2/3, bottom is raised panel 1/3). *The first door is solid mahogany. *The
other is mahogany veneer over MDF. *Both are rated for exterior. *I am in
FL. *The cellar will be cooled to 55 (humidity at 60-70%), the other side
will be at about 75, humidity at 40-50%. *I'm told that the MDF will hold up
better and not warp. *Any thoughts?

If the door is sealed on all six sides either one will do just fine.

R

Wine cellar door question
 

Mike wrote:
I am building a wine cellar. The door choices are mindboggling but I have
narrowed it down to two similar doors (3'0x8'0, two panels, top is glass
2/3, bottom is raised panel 1/3). The first door is solid mahogany. The
other is mahogany veneer over MDF. Both are rated for exterior. I am in
FL. The cellar will be cooled to 55 (humidity at 60-70%), the other side
will be at about 75, humidity at 40-50%. I'm told that the MDF will hold up
better and not warp. Any thoughts?

Exterior doors should have no problem, pick the one you like best, if it
were I, I'd go for the solid mahogany, just because...

--
Jack
News Flash: Government Motors (GM) fines their top competitor $16 Mil.
http://jbstein.com

Wine cellar door question
 

On Aug 3, 8:48*am, "Mike" wrote:
"Mike" wrote in message

m...I am building a wine cellar. *The door choices are mindboggling but I have
narrowed it down to two similar doors (3'0x8'0, two panels, top is glass
2/3, bottom is raised panel 1/3). *The first door is solid mahogany. *The
other is mahogany veneer over MDF. *Both are rated for exterior. *I am in
FL. *The cellar will be cooled to 55 (humidity at 60-70%), the other side
will be at about 75, humidity at 40-50%. *I'm told that the MDF will hold
up better and not warp. *Any thoughts?

I should add that the price difference is immaterial and the core is FSC
certified laminated veneer lumber (LVL) core not MDF.

I made mine out of lauan door skins (1/8") sandwiching a extruded
polystyrene core (blue Styrofoam) and a western red cedar 2X2 frame.
More insulation = better

But living int he Yukon, the municipal water comes in at 2-4 degrees
Celsius, so I run all my water through radiators on the wine cellar
ceiling. Keeps it at 10-12 degrees all year round.

Luigi

Wine cellar door question
 

On Aug 5, 9:07*am, (Doug Miller) wrote:
"Morgans" wrote:
"Luigi Zanasi" wrote

But living int he Yukon, the municipal water comes in at 2-4 degrees
Celsius, so I run all my water through radiators on the wine cellar
ceiling. *Keeps it at 10-12 degrees all year round.

That sounds like a good way to drink lots of lead tainted water, unless you
are very careful to use only radiators made without lead solder. *

No, not really. Unless the water is significantly acidic, the amount of lead
that leaches into it from leaded solder is really rather low, and allowing the
tap to run for 30 to 60 seconds before filling one's glass eliminates nearly
all of it.

That would limit you to only using plastic end cap radiators.

What, you think he's running it through *automobile* radiators?? Could be, but
I rather doubt it. More likely, he's using normal residential radiators, which
are typically made of cast iron.

Or copper/aluminum fin tube baseboard radiators - probably the easiest
way to have an in-line water heat exchanger hung from a ceiling.

R

Wine cellar door question
 

On Aug 5, 9:16*am, RicodJour wrote:
On Aug 5, 9:07*am, (Doug Miller) wrote:





*"Morgans" wrote:
"Luigi Zanasi" wrote

But living int he Yukon, the municipal water comes in at 2-4 degrees
Celsius, so I run all my water through radiators on the wine cellar
ceiling. *Keeps it at 10-12 degrees all year round.

That sounds like a good way to drink lots of lead tainted water, unless you
are very careful to use only radiators made without lead solder. *

No, not really. Unless the water is significantly acidic, the amount of lead
that leaches into it from leaded solder is really rather low, and allowing the
tap to run for 30 to 60 seconds before filling one's glass eliminates nearly
all of it.

That would limit you to only using plastic end cap radiators.

What, you think he's running it through *automobile* radiators?? Could be, but
I rather doubt it. More likely, he's using normal residential radiators, which
are typically made of cast iron.

Or copper/aluminum fin tube baseboard radiators - probably the easiest
way to have an in-line water heat exchanger hung from a ceiling.

R

Condensation wouldn't become an issue?

Wine cellar door question
 

On Aug 5, 10:39*am, Robatoy wrote:
On Aug 5, 9:16*am, RicodJour wrote:
On Aug 5, 9:07*am, (Doug Miller) wrote:
*"Morgans" wrote:
"Luigi Zanasi" wrote

But living int he Yukon, the municipal water comes in at 2-4 degrees
Celsius, so I run all my water through radiators on the wine cellar
ceiling. *Keeps it at 10-12 degrees all year round.

That sounds like a good way to drink lots of lead tainted water, unless you
are very careful to use only radiators made without lead solder. *

No, not really. Unless the water is significantly acidic, the amount of lead
that leaches into it from leaded solder is really rather low, and allowing the
tap to run for 30 to 60 seconds before filling one's glass eliminates nearly
all of it.

That would limit you to only using plastic end cap radiators.

What, you think he's running it through *automobile* radiators?? Could be, but
I rather doubt it. More likely, he's using normal residential radiators, which
are typically made of cast iron.

Or copper/aluminum fin tube baseboard radiators - probably the easiest
way to have an in-line water heat exchanger hung from a ceiling.


Condensation wouldn't become an issue?

It's a wine cellar. Dank and dripping ceilings are a feature. ;)

I have no experience with them, so I can't comment on how an inline
radiator would work out and how much condensation. A dehumidifier?

I was addressing my empathetic aching back's issue with hoisting a
surplus cast iron radiator and suspending it from the ceiling. I see
a bunch of downside, and not much upside with going cast iron.

R

Wine cellar door question
 

In article , RicodJour wrote:
On Aug 5, 10:39=A0am, Robatoy wrote:
On Aug 5, 9:16=A0am, RicodJour wrote:
On Aug 5, 9:07=A0am, (Doug Miller) wrote:
=A0"Morgans" wrote:
"Luigi Zanasi" wrote

But living int he Yukon, the municipal water comes in at 2-4 degrees
Celsius, so I run all my water through radiators on the wine cellar
ceiling. =A0Keeps it at 10-12 degrees all year round.

That sounds like a good way to drink lots of lead tainted water, unl=
ess you
are very careful to use only radiators made without lead solder.

No, not really. Unless the water is significantly acidic, the amount of lead
that leaches into it from leaded solder is really rather low, and allowing the
tap to run for 30 to 60 seconds before filling one's glass eliminates nearly
all of it.

That would limit you to only using plastic end cap radiators.

What, you think he's running it through *automobile* radiators?? Could be, but
I rather doubt it. More likely, he's using normal residential radiators, which
are typically made of cast iron.

Or copper/aluminum fin tube baseboard radiators - probably the easiest
way to have an in-line water heat exchanger hung from a ceiling.


Condensation wouldn't become an issue?

It's a wine cellar. Dank and dripping ceilings are a feature. ;)

I have no experience with them, so I can't comment on how an inline
radiator would work out and how much condensation. A dehumidifier?

A fan controlled by a humidistat would be a better choice. Dehumidifiers put
out a fair amount of heat, and unless there's a way to exhaust that from the
room, it would likely defeat the purpose of using a water-chilled radiator.

And of course if the ambient humidity isn't very high to begin with,
condensation isn't much of an issue.

I was addressing my empathetic aching back's issue with hoisting a
surplus cast iron radiator and suspending it from the ceiling. I see
a bunch of downside, and not much upside with going cast iron.

So use a drywall hoist. g Actually, the downside is also the upside: lots of
mass there. Once it's chilled, it's going to *stay* chilled.

Wine cellar door question
 

On Aug 5, 6:16*am, RicodJour wrote:
On Aug 5, 9:07*am, (Doug Miller) wrote:



*"Morgans" wrote:
"Luigi Zanasi" wrote

But living int he Yukon, the municipal water comes in at 2-4 degrees
Celsius, so I run all my water through radiators on the wine cellar
ceiling. *Keeps it at 10-12 degrees all year round.

That sounds like a good way to drink lots of lead tainted water, unless you
are very careful to use only radiators made without lead solder. *

No, not really. Unless the water is significantly acidic, the amount of lead
that leaches into it from leaded solder is really rather low, and allowing the
tap to run for 30 to 60 seconds before filling one's glass eliminates nearly
all of it.

That would limit you to only using plastic end cap radiators.

What, you think he's running it through *automobile* radiators?? Could be, but
I rather doubt it. More likely, he's using normal residential radiators, which
are typically made of cast iron.

Or copper/aluminum fin tube baseboard radiators - probably the easiest
way to have an in-line water heat exchanger hung from a ceiling.

R

That's it. & soldered using lead-free solder by my plumber.

Luigi

Wine cellar door question
 

On Aug 5, 7:39*am, Robatoy wrote:
On Aug 5, 9:16*am, RicodJour wrote:



On Aug 5, 9:07*am, (Doug Miller) wrote:

*"Morgans" wrote:
"Luigi Zanasi" wrote

But living int he Yukon, the municipal water comes in at 2-4 degrees
Celsius, so I run all my water through radiators on the wine cellar
ceiling. *Keeps it at 10-12 degrees all year round.

That sounds like a good way to drink lots of lead tainted water, unless you
are very careful to use only radiators made without lead solder. *

No, not really. Unless the water is significantly acidic, the amount of lead
that leaches into it from leaded solder is really rather low, and allowing the
tap to run for 30 to 60 seconds before filling one's glass eliminates nearly
all of it.

That would limit you to only using plastic end cap radiators.

What, you think he's running it through *automobile* radiators?? Could be, but
I rather doubt it. More likely, he's using normal residential radiators, which
are typically made of cast iron.

Or copper/aluminum fin tube baseboard radiators - probably the easiest
way to have an in-line water heat exchanger hung from a ceiling.

R

Condensation wouldn't become an issue?

It did on the way to the cellar. It dripped all over the suspended
ceiling. But pipe insulation fixed that.

Luigi

Wine cellar door question
 

On Aug 5, 1:45*pm, Luigi Zanasi wrote:
On Aug 5, 6:16*am, RicodJour wrote:

Or copper/aluminum fin tube baseboard radiators - probably the easiest
way to have an in-line water heat exchanger hung from a ceiling.

That's it. & soldered using lead-free solder by my plumber.

Good solution. Is there much condensation?

R

Wine cellar door question
 

On Aug 5, 10:17*am, (Doug Miller) wrote:
In article , RicodJour wrote:



On Aug 5, 10:39=A0am, Robatoy wrote:
On Aug 5, 9:16=A0am, RicodJour wrote:
On Aug 5, 9:07=A0am, (Doug Miller) wrote:
=A0"Morgans" wrote:
"Luigi Zanasi" wrote

But living int he Yukon, the municipal water comes in at 2-4 degrees
Celsius, so I run all my water through radiators on the wine cellar
ceiling. =A0Keeps it at 10-12 degrees all year round.

That sounds like a good way to drink lots of lead tainted water, unl=
ess you
are very careful to use only radiators made without lead solder.

No, not really. Unless the water is significantly acidic, the amount of lead
that leaches into it from leaded solder is really rather low, and allowing the
tap to run for 30 to 60 seconds before filling one's glass eliminates nearly
all of it.

That would limit you to only using plastic end cap radiators.

What, you think he's running it through *automobile* radiators?? Could be, but
I rather doubt it. More likely, he's using normal residential radiators, which
are typically made of cast iron.

Or copper/aluminum fin tube baseboard radiators - probably the easiest
way to have an in-line water heat exchanger hung from a ceiling.

Condensation wouldn't become an issue?

It's a wine cellar. *Dank and dripping ceilings are a feature. *;)

I have no experience with them, so I can't comment on how an inline
radiator would work out and how much condensation. *A dehumidifier?

A fan controlled by a humidistat would be a better choice. Dehumidifiers put
out a fair amount of heat, and unless there's a way to exhaust that from the
room, it would likely defeat the purpose of using a water-chilled radiator.

Wine cellar door question
 

On Aug 5, 10:52*am, RicodJour wrote:
On Aug 5, 1:45*pm, Luigi Zanasi wrote:

On Aug 5, 6:16*am, RicodJour wrote:

Or copper/aluminum fin tube baseboard radiators - probably the easiest
way to have an in-line water heat exchanger hung from a ceiling.

That's it. & soldered using lead-free solder by my plumber.

Good solution. *Is there much condensation?

Like I told Rob, only on the pipes leading to the cellar. That issue
was solved using regular foam pipe insulation, not after ruining a
number of ceiling tiles.

The wine cellar itself is drier than I would like, but that's not a
serious issue. (yes I did try a humidifier which eventually crapped
out & I didn't bother to replace it.

Luigi

Luigi

Wine cellar door question
 

In article , Luigi Zanasi wrote:

The thermal mass is supplied by the vino itself. The cellar is 4 feet
by 10 feet by 8' high & generally holds three to five 54-litre (15
gallons, Doug) demijohns as well as a similar amount of bottled
stuff. :-)

You make your own, then? How come I haven't ever seen you over at
rec.crafts.winemaking?

Wine cellar door question
 

On Aug 5, 3:01*pm, Luigi Zanasi wrote:
On Aug 5, 10:52*am, RicodJour wrote:

On Aug 5, 1:45*pm, Luigi Zanasi wrote:

On Aug 5, 6:16*am, RicodJour wrote:

Or copper/aluminum fin tube baseboard radiators - probably the easiest
way to have an in-line water heat exchanger hung from a ceiling.

That's it. & soldered using lead-free solder by my plumber.

Good solution. *Is there much condensation?

Like I told Rob, only on the pipes leading to the cellar. That issue
was solved using regular foam pipe insulation, not after ruining a
number of ceiling tiles.

The wine cellar itself is drier than I would like, but that's not a
serious issue. (yes I did try a humidifier which eventually crapped
out & I didn't bother to replace it.

Luigi

Luigi

I put a truck radiator in a garage window once (late 60's) and ran
tapwater through it and used a box fan to blow the cool air into the
garage. After a few minutes it started to cool off AND pretty much
'rain' in the garage ruining one of my Bardot posters. At first I
thought the old rad had a leak in it.

Wine cellar door question
 

On Aug 5, 12:15*pm, (Doug Miller) wrote:
In article , Luigi Zanasi wrote:

The thermal mass is supplied by the vino itself. The cellar is 4 feet
by 10 feet by 8' high & generally holds three to five 54-litre (15
gallons, Doug) demijohns as well as a similar amount of bottled
stuff. *:-)

You make your own, then? How come I haven't ever seen you over at
rec.crafts.winemaking?

Yes you have.

http://groups.google.ca/group/rec.cr...8ed6c18 567ec

:-)

I was there in the mid-late 90s, but sort of gave up on it, don't
exactly remember why.

Luigi

Wine cellar door question
 

In article , Luigi Zanasi wrote:
On Aug 5, 12:15=A0pm, (Doug Miller) wrote:
In article =
..com, Luigi Zanasi wrote:

The thermal mass is supplied by the vino itself. The cellar is 4 feet
by 10 feet by 8' high & generally holds three to five 54-litre (15
gallons, Doug) demijohns as well as a similar amount of bottled
stuff. :-)

You make your own, then? How come I haven't ever seen you over at
rec.crafts.winemaking?

Yes you have.

http://groups.google.ca/group/rec.cr.../thread/12e66=
2f91023fc18/ccfb8ed6c18567ec?hl=3Den&lnk=3Dgst&q=3DLuigi#ccfb8 ed6c18567ec

:-)

That was eleven years ago! I've slept since then.

I was there in the mid-late 90s, but sort of gave up on it, don't
exactly remember why.

I mostly lurk there now.

Wine cellar door question
 

On Aug 6, 4:01*am, (Doug Miller) wrote:
In article , Luigi Zanasi wrote:



On Aug 5, 12:15=A0pm, (Doug Miller) wrote:
In article =
..com, Luigi Zanasi wrote:

The thermal mass is supplied by the vino itself. The cellar is 4 feet
by 10 feet by 8' high & generally holds three to five 54-litre (15
gallons, Doug) demijohns as well as a similar amount of bottled
stuff. :-)

You make your own, then? How come I haven't ever seen you over at
rec.crafts.winemaking?

Yes you have.

http://groups.google.ca/group/rec.cr...wse_frm/thread...
2f91023fc18/ccfb8ed6c18567ec?hl=3Den&lnk=3Dgst&q=3DLuigi#ccfb8 ed6c18567ec

:-)

That was eleven years ago! I've slept since then.

:-) It was pretty funny. I was quite amused to see that when I
searched on Luigi in rec.crafts.winemaking, the first post that showed
up also had Doug Miller participating in the same thread. ;-) I hadn't
remembered that you participated in that group too.

Luigi