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Is it any good, or just hype.

nb
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"notbob" wrote in message
...
Is it any good, or just hype.

nb



Only use it on your "Deck"


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Fit for purpose; outdoor wood.

I just saw yesterday a 3 year old set of Adirondack chairs that have
been out in the sun and rain all the time since I sold them. I made
them from Pine. They were stained with a brownish Thompsons. The stain
was now blotchy but the wood was in fine condition, as good as new
really. I have one chair from the same batch that I kept, with no
finish and left it outside also. I had to add wood screws for the
failing staples this year as the wood is deteriorating, it has turned
black and looks like it will last another few years before it fails.

On Aug 16, 5:06*pm, notbob wrote:
Is it any good, or just hype.

nb


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On 8/16/2009 5:06 PM notbob spake thus:

Is it any good, or just hype.


It does work, if that's what you're asking; it will seal wood.

However, there may be better stuff out there. A painter I trust told me
he uses Armstrong's deck sealer instead (the "natural" color, not clear,
he insisted).


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On Aug 16, 5:06*pm, notbob wrote:
Is it any good, or just hype.


IME, hype. Used on Greenhouse windows. Did not last a year.

Luigi


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"notbob" wrote in message
...
Is it any good, or just hype.

nb


Crap. Get Penofin oil.


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On Mon, 17 Aug 2009 00:06:35 GMT, notbob wrote:

Is it any good, or just hype.

nb

Depends on your use, like anything else...

I used it once when the walls of a house had old wallpaper paste on them and
knew the paste would bleed through the latex..

Didn't bring any Bullseye primer so used TWS instead and the latex covered in
one coat without bleed through..

I've also used it to soak wood parts for RV accessories and it seems to work
well..


mac

Please remove splinters before emailing
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On Mon, 17 Aug 2009 00:06:35 GMT, notbob wrote:

Is it any good, or just hype.

nb


I don't know how well it works on wood, but it is a terrific water proofer on canvas. Fifteen or
more years ago I needed a ground cloth for a diamond shelter I sometimes use in primitive camping.
I used a 5x9 foot piece of untreated heavy canvas. I washed the canvas to remove any sizing, then
hung it from a line and gave it a coat of Thompsons once a day for a week or two. Don't remember
the exact number. At least 6 coats, but no more than 10. After drying for a few days, I rubbed it
down to soften it.

Thing smelled nasty for about a year. Not solvent, just a very unpleasant odor I assumed was from
the Thompsons. About the time it quit stinking, it also became relatively flexible and non-sticky,
even on hot days. It was also waterproof as a rubber pond liner.

I still use it on a few campouts a year. It is still waterproof. I'd hate to see it catch fire.
All that wax burning could generate more excitement than would be proper for a refined gentleman of
my age, specially if I was sleeping on it at the time.


Regards,
Roy

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On Aug 16, 7:06*pm, notbob wrote:
Is it any good, or just hype.

nb


If you are talking about the square 4 or 5 quart can that sells in the
$20-25 range it is a 2 year solution at best. I used it on the deck
of a previous house for a few years. then we built a fence and
decided to go to something different. We put Olympic premium on both
about three years ago. Sold the house but had a chance to see it a
couple of weeks ago and the fence looks great. Costs more but well
worth it.

RonB
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notbob wrote:
: Is it any good, or just hype.

It's about the worst stuff on the market. A waste of money and time.


-- Andy Barss


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On Aug 16, 10:56*pm, RonB wrote:
On Aug 16, 7:06*pm, notbob wrote:

Is it any good, or just hype.


nb


If you are talking about the square 4 or 5 quart can that sells in the
$20-25 range it is a 2 year solution at best. *I used it on the deck
of a previous house for a few years. *then we built a fence and
decided to go to something different. *We put Olympic premium on both
about three years ago. *Sold the house but had a chance to see it a
couple of weeks ago and the fence looks great. *Costs more but well
worth it.

RonB


I believe I should have said Olympic "Maximum". You can get the
Olympic products in a light tint or a full stain. We used the tint
which lets grain definition get through better. A neighbor used the
stain version and IMO it come up looking kind of murky.

Ron
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On 8/17/2009 9:23 AM Andrew Barss spake thus:

notbob wrote:
: Is it any good, or just hype.

It's about the worst stuff on the market. A waste of money and time.


So what do you suggest using?


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On Aug 17, 2:42*pm, David Nebenzahl wrote:
On 8/17/2009 9:23 AM Andrew Barss spake thus:

notbob wrote:
: Is it any good, or just hype.


It's about the worst stuff on the market. *A waste of money and time.


So what do you suggest using?

--
Found--the gene that causes belief in genetic determinism


I have used, with great success, Flood's Penetrol. I know, I know it
is supposed to be an additive, but what it is, is super clean BLO and
protects wood like nothing else I have seen. So, if one doesn't need
to do much, it is great stuff. For a big deck, it will be pricey.
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On 8/17/2009 11:47 AM Robatoy spake thus:

On Aug 17, 2:42 pm, David Nebenzahl wrote:

On 8/17/2009 9:23 AM Andrew Barss spake thus:

notbob wrote:
: Is it any good, or just hype.


It's about the worst stuff on the market. A waste of money and time.


So what do you suggest using?


I have used, with great success, Flood's Penetrol. I know, I know it
is supposed to be an additive, but what it is, is super clean BLO and
protects wood like nothing else I have seen. So, if one doesn't need
to do much, it is great stuff. For a big deck, it will be pricey.


1. You're in the UK, aren't you?

2. What' "BLO"?


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David Nebenzahl wrote:
On 8/17/2009 11:47 AM Robatoy spake thus:

On Aug 17, 2:42 pm, David Nebenzahl wrote:

On 8/17/2009 9:23 AM Andrew Barss spake thus:

notbob wrote:
: Is it any good, or just hype.

It's about the worst stuff on the market. A waste of money and time.

So what do you suggest using?


I have used, with great success, Flood's Penetrol. I know, I know it
is supposed to be an additive, but what it is, is super clean BLO and
protects wood like nothing else I have seen. So, if one doesn't need
to do much, it is great stuff. For a big deck, it will be pricey.


1. You're in the UK, aren't you?


Is Canada part of the UK?

2. What' "BLO"?

Cocaine?

or

Boiled Linseed Oil?

Which would you put on a deck?

--
Froz...


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"FrozenNorth" wrote in message ...
David Nebenzahl wrote:
On 8/17/2009 11:47 AM Robatoy spake thus:

On Aug 17, 2:42 pm, David Nebenzahl wrote:

On 8/17/2009 9:23 AM Andrew Barss spake thus:

notbob wrote:
: Is it any good, or just hype.

It's about the worst stuff on the market. A waste of money and time.

So what do you suggest using?

I have used, with great success, Flood's Penetrol. I know, I know it
is supposed to be an additive, but what it is, is super clean BLO and
protects wood like nothing else I have seen. So, if one doesn't need
to do much, it is great stuff. For a big deck, it will be pricey.


1. You're in the UK, aren't you?


Is Canada part of the UK?

2. What' "BLO"?

Cocaine?

or

Boiled Linseed Oil?

Which would you put on a deck?

--
Froz...



NO! NO!!

It is not BLO it is BLOW and you use the deck to cut it 52 ways. BEG

P D Q
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On 2009-08-17, FrozenNorth wrote:

Cocaine?

or

Boiled Linseed Oil?

Which would you put on a deck?


The former. I could find an actual use for the BLO.

nb
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Andrew Barss wrote:

notbob wrote:
: Is it any good, or just hype.

It's about the worst stuff on the market. A waste of money and time.


-- Andy Barss


Have you had direct experience with it Andy? I suspect that the Arizona
sun would beat the heck out of an inferior product. Do you have any
recommendations that do stand up fairly well out here?




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David Nebenzahl wrote:
: On 8/17/2009 9:23 AM Andrew Barss spake thus:

: notbob wrote:
: : Is it any good, or just hype.
:
: It's about the worst stuff on the market. A waste of money and time.

: So what do you suggest using?

Pretty much anything else. Cabot makes a very good line of
products (cleaners, sealers) for exterior wood. I've alo heard good
things about Olympic stain/sealer.


The problem with Thompson's is that it's just a little bit of paraffin
wax, dissolved in a whole lot of solvent (kerosene, I think).
When it first goes on, the wax and oily solvent residue will indeed
repel water (hence the Thompson's ad image of water beads on wood).
But it only lasts for a few months, and then it's gone. And it provides
zero UV protection, so the wood will gray independent of
the short-term water repulsion.


Thompson's is the wood protection equivalent of those guys who
come by your house, give you a great deal on redoing an asphalt
driveway, and it looks great for two months until the thin layer
wears off.


They do have excellent marketing skills, though.


-- Andy Barss

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On Tue, 18 Aug 2009 06:44:47 +0000, Andrew Barss wrote:

Cabot makes a very good line of products (cleaners, sealers) for
exterior wood. I've alo heard good things about Olympic stain/sealer.


I've had pretty good luck with Watco's Outdoor Oil. Lasts 3-4 years on a
sunny surface and recoating is quick and easy. It doesn't cover nearly
as many square feet as the can claims it does, but that's common to just
about all of the sealers.

It does have UV and mildew inhibitors.

--
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"Andrew Barss" wrote in message
...
Pretty much anything else. Cabot makes a very good line of
products (cleaners, sealers) for exterior wood. I've alo heard good
things about Olympic stain/sealer.


One coat? Or two?


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On Mon, 17 Aug 2009 00:06:35 GMT, notbob wrote:

Is it any good, or just hype.

nb



No good, but better than nothing at all. A semi-transparent Cabot
Decking stain will protect wood for a long time, for me about 3-5
years.
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Mark & Juanita wrote:
: Andrew Barss wrote:

: notbob wrote:
: : Is it any good, or just hype.
:
: It's about the worst stuff on the market. A waste of money and time.
:
:
: -- Andy Barss

: Have you had direct experience with it Andy?

A bit, and I was so surprised at the result I then did some checking and
found the few-month experience was not uncommon. In the Northeast
20 years ago, it was, as far as I know, the only stuff around, which is
why I bought it when I came here.


I suspect that the Arizona
: sun would beat the heck out of an inferior product. Do you have any
: recommendations that do stand up fairly well out here?

I have a small amount of exposed wood on our guesthouse, and will be
trying Cabot's products when it cools off (and when I get the ithen
remodel done, which is gonna be a while -- found a disconnected air duct
in the attic, which explains the huge electrical bills!). I'll let you
know how it works out. One project for the winter is a screened-in
outside porch/sitting area/pagoda, and I want to find a decent
wood protectant before doing that. I was actually planning to ask you for
a reccomendation!


I did have a strangely terrific experience with spar varnish. I did
two exterior doors, one facing west (behind a security door), and one
facing south, in direct sun, in around 1996. Until 2 years ago, they
looked absolutely perfect. The screened westward one still looks great,
but the south one is peeling and so forth. But 10-11 years in bright sun
is pretty good!

-- Andy BArss
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"Andrew Barss" wrote:

I suspect that the Arizona
: sun would beat the heck out of an inferior product. Do you have
any
: recommendations that do stand up fairly well out here?


SFWIW:

Epifanes two (2) part poly is the gold standard for bright work on
boats, especially in the Caribbean which I would expect to be worse
than Arizona desert since you have the sun's reflected rays off the
water as well as direct sunlight.

Have fun.

Lew



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Only use it on your "Deck"

But what if my deck is REALLY big?

-Zz


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Andrew Barss wrote:

Mark & Juanita wrote:
: Andrew Barss wrote:

: notbob wrote:
: : Is it any good, or just hype.
:
: It's about the worst stuff on the market. A waste of money and time.
:
:
: -- Andy Barss

: Have you had direct experience with it Andy?

A bit, and I was so surprised at the result I then did some checking and
found the few-month experience was not uncommon. In the Northeast
20 years ago, it was, as far as I know, the only stuff around, which is
why I bought it when I came here.


I suspect that the Arizona
: sun would beat the heck out of an inferior product. Do you have any
: recommendations that do stand up fairly well out here?

I have a small amount of exposed wood on our guesthouse, and will be
trying Cabot's products when it cools off (and when I get the ithen
remodel done, which is gonna be a while -- found a disconnected air duct
in the attic, which explains the huge electrical bills!).


Ouch!

I'll let you
know how it works out. One project for the winter is a screened-in
outside porch/sitting area/pagoda, and I want to find a decent
wood protectant before doing that. I was actually planning to ask you for
a reccomendation!


I really don't have much with exposed wood. The shop is composite siding.
If you are looking for paint, the Dunn Edwards paint we used looks like a
winner, but it's only been two summers since it was put on.


I did have a strangely terrific experience with spar varnish. I did
two exterior doors, one facing west (behind a security door), and one
facing south, in direct sun, in around 1996. Until 2 years ago, they
looked absolutely perfect. The screened westward one still looks great,
but the south one is peeling and so forth. But 10-11 years in bright sun
is pretty good!


Thanks -- that's helpful, I've got some doors that need to be re-finished.
The kid was supposed to scrape them this summer; I think he got 1/2 way
done with one of them, so will work that when it cools off. If we don't
paint them, will look at using spar.



-- Andy BArss


--

There is never a situation where having more rounds is a disadvantage

Rob Leatham
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On 8/17/2009 10:02 AM RonB spake thus:

On Aug 16, 10:56 pm, RonB wrote:

On Aug 16, 7:06 pm, notbob wrote:

Is it any good, or just hype.


If you are talking about the square 4 or 5 quart can that sells in the
$20-25 range it is a 2 year solution at best. I used it on the deck
of a previous house for a few years. then we built a fence and
decided to go to something different. We put Olympic premium on both
about three years ago. Sold the house but had a chance to see it a
couple of weeks ago and the fence looks great. Costs more but well
worth it.


I believe I should have said Olympic "Maximum". You can get the
Olympic products in a light tint or a full stain. We used the tint
which lets grain definition get through better. A neighbor used the
stain version and IMO it come up looking kind of murky.


Well, guess what? I've got a deck to seal in a couple days. Went to
local hardware store (Orchard Supply) where I saw some Olympic clear
sealer (not stain) in a gallon paint can, not the rectangular cans
solvents and stuff come in. It looks pretty good and I think I'll use
it. Says it contains linseed oil, so it's not just wax and solvent as
Thompson's is spozed to be.


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On 8/18/2009 10:01 PM Mark & Juanita spake thus:

Andrew Barss wrote:

I did have a strangely terrific experience with spar varnish. I did
two exterior doors, one facing west (behind a security door), and one
facing south, in direct sun, in around 1996. Until 2 years ago, they
looked absolutely perfect. The screened westward one still looks great,
but the south one is peeling and so forth. But 10-11 years in bright sun
is pretty good!


Thanks -- that's helpful, I've got some doors that need to be re-finished.
The kid was supposed to scrape them this summer; I think he got 1/2 way
done with one of them, so will work that when it cools off. If we don't
paint them, will look at using spar.


Spar varnish is *THE* stuff to use on exterior wood, assuming you want a
glossy surface. Just recently refinished a client's front door with it.
I expect it to last at least 5 years, maybe more. Very pleasant stuff to
work with, too. (Assuming one doesn't mind contact with paint thinner.)


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"David Nebenzahl" wrote:

Spar varnish is *THE* stuff to use on exterior wood, assuming you
want a glossy surface.


True spar varnish should be restricted to wooden spars on sailboats
since it never truly hardens so you don't want to sit on it for
instance.

Standard marine varnish or poly is a far better solution.

(See previous post).

Lew



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David Nebenzahl wrote:
On 8/18/2009 10:01 PM Mark & Juanita spake thus:

Andrew Barss wrote:

I did have a strangely terrific experience with spar varnish. I did
two exterior doors, one facing west (behind a security door), and
one facing south, in direct sun, in around 1996. Until 2 years
ago, they looked absolutely perfect. The screened westward one
still looks great, but the south one is peeling and so forth. But
10-11 years in bright sun is pretty good!


Thanks -- that's helpful, I've got some doors that need to be
re-finished. The kid was supposed to scrape them this summer; I
think he got 1/2 way done with one of them, so will work that when
it cools off. If we don't paint them, will look at using spar.


Spar varnish is *THE* stuff to use on exterior wood, assuming you
want a glossy surface. Just recently refinished a client's front door
with it. I expect it to last at least 5 years, maybe more. Very
pleasant stuff to work with, too. (Assuming one doesn't mind contact
with paint thinner.)


Just pray that that client doesn't lean on that door in an expensive suit
on a hot day. If it's real spar varnish and you didn't warn him about that
he's going to be very unhappy.

Spar varnish is a niche product intended for a specific purpose.




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On Wed, 19 Aug 2009 01:04:33 -0700, David Nebenzahl
wrote:

On 8/18/2009 10:01 PM Mark & Juanita spake thus:

Andrew Barss wrote:

I did have a strangely terrific experience with spar varnish. I did
two exterior doors, one facing west (behind a security door), and one
facing south, in direct sun, in around 1996. Until 2 years ago, they
looked absolutely perfect. The screened westward one still looks great,
but the south one is peeling and so forth. But 10-11 years in bright sun
is pretty good!


Thanks -- that's helpful, I've got some doors that need to be re-finished.
The kid was supposed to scrape them this summer; I think he got 1/2 way
done with one of them, so will work that when it cools off. If we don't
paint them, will look at using spar.


Spar varnish is *THE* stuff to use on exterior wood, assuming you want a
glossy surface. Just recently refinished a client's front door with it.
I expect it to last at least 5 years, maybe more. Very pleasant stuff to
work with, too. (Assuming one doesn't mind contact with paint thinner.)



Varnish is mostly clear so it doesn't have as much UV protection as a
stain or paint (I would not use paint on a deck). Whatever you
decide, pay particular attention to exposed end grain--those areas
should get 2-3 coats.
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On 8/19/2009 5:40 AM J. Clarke spake thus:

David Nebenzahl wrote:

On 8/18/2009 10:01 PM Mark & Juanita spake thus:

Andrew Barss wrote:

I did have a strangely terrific experience with spar varnish. I did
two exterior doors, one facing west (behind a security door), and
one facing south, in direct sun, in around 1996. Until 2 years
ago, they looked absolutely perfect. The screened westward one
still looks great, but the south one is peeling and so forth. But
10-11 years in bright sun is pretty good!

Thanks -- that's helpful, I've got some doors that need to be
re-finished. The kid was supposed to scrape them this summer; I
think he got 1/2 way done with one of them, so will work that when
it cools off. If we don't paint them, will look at using spar.


Spar varnish is *THE* stuff to use on exterior wood, assuming you
want a glossy surface. Just recently refinished a client's front door
with it. I expect it to last at least 5 years, maybe more. Very
pleasant stuff to work with, too. (Assuming one doesn't mind contact
with paint thinner.)


Just pray that that client doesn't lean on that door in an expensive suit
on a hot day. If it's real spar varnish and you didn't warn him about that
he's going to be very unhappy.


Don't think that's going to be a problem. A few years ago I refinished
the floors of my living space using spar varnish, the same stuff I used
on that door (McCloskey Man-o-War). Never had any problem with things
sticking to the floor or soft varnish there, even on extremely hot days
(poor ventilation, so it got pretty hot there sometimes).

Have you actually experienced this problem? I haven't.


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David Nebenzahl wrote:
On 8/19/2009 5:40 AM J. Clarke spake thus:

David Nebenzahl wrote:

On 8/18/2009 10:01 PM Mark & Juanita spake thus:

Andrew Barss wrote:

I did have a strangely terrific experience with spar varnish. I
did two exterior doors, one facing west (behind a security door),
and one facing south, in direct sun, in around 1996. Until 2
years ago, they looked absolutely perfect. The screened westward
one still looks great, but the south one is peeling and so forth.
But 10-11 years in bright sun is pretty good!

Thanks -- that's helpful, I've got some doors that need to be
re-finished. The kid was supposed to scrape them this summer; I
think he got 1/2 way done with one of them, so will work that when
it cools off. If we don't paint them, will look at using spar.

Spar varnish is *THE* stuff to use on exterior wood, assuming you
want a glossy surface. Just recently refinished a client's front
door with it. I expect it to last at least 5 years, maybe more. Very
pleasant stuff to work with, too. (Assuming one doesn't mind contact
with paint thinner.)


Just pray that that client doesn't lean on that door in an expensive
suit on a hot day. If it's real spar varnish and you didn't warn
him about that he's going to be very unhappy.


Don't think that's going to be a problem. A few years ago I refinished
the floors of my living space using spar varnish, the same stuff I
used on that door (McCloskey Man-o-War). Never had any problem with
things sticking to the floor or soft varnish there, even on extremely
hot days (poor ventilation, so it got pretty hot there sometimes).

Have you actually experienced this problem? I haven't.


Yep, repeatedly. Railings on boats, canoe seats and thwarts, etc. Wrecked
my whites that way just before an inspection once.


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"Phisherman" wrote:

Varnish is mostly clear so it doesn't have as much UV protection as
a
stain or paint (I would not use paint on a deck). Whatever you
decide, pay particular attention to exposed end grain--those areas
should get 2-3 coats.


That's why you use a marine varnish or varnish, they contain UV
inhibitors.

You won't find true marine varnish at a general finish supplier.

Strictly a speciality item found at a good chandlery.

Lew



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notbob wrote:

Is it any good, or just hype.

nb


It's used on the decks at the "Cave Of The Winds" at the Bridal Falls in
the Niagara Falls, NY State Park. Of course the decking is removed
every November and re-assembled each spring after being recoated which
Thompson doesn't mention in their TV commercial (but they do on their
web site).

http://www.thompsonswaterseal.com/ne...ls_support.cfm

For personal experience with the product I had to recoat the deck on my
house every year as well. I quit using it because of this.

--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA



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Used a Cabot oil based redwood stain on an outdoor arbor made with old
reused pine 2 X 6 boards. Good stuff. Planned to put a coat of oil
poly on that but never got around to it. Nothing on the wood except
the stain. Repelled water like oil. Just beaded up and rolled off.


On Tue, 18 Aug 2009 16:13:32 -0400, Phisherman
wrote:

On Mon, 17 Aug 2009 00:06:35 GMT, notbob wrote:

Is it any good, or just hype.

nb



No good, but better than nothing at all. A semi-transparent Cabot
Decking stain will protect wood for a long time, for me about 3-5
years.

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"Zz Yzx" wrote in message
...
Only use it on your "Deck"


But what if my deck is REALLY big?

-Zz


Get 2


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J. Clarke wrote:

: Just pray that that client doesn't lean on that door in an expensive suit
: on a hot day. If it's real spar varnish and you didn't warn him about that
: he's going to be very unhappy.

: Spar varnish is a niche product intended for a specific purpose.

Well, the product I used was Behr brand spar varnish. It may not have
been true spar varnish -- it did dry, though wasn't as rock hard as normal
varnish. I never had a problem with it.

-- Andy Barss
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Andrew Barss wrote:
J. Clarke wrote:

: Just pray that that client doesn't lean on that door in an expensive suit
: on a hot day. If it's real spar varnish and you didn't warn him about that
: he's going to be very unhappy.

: Spar varnish is a niche product intended for a specific purpose.

Well, the product I used was Behr brand spar varnish. It may not have
been true spar varnish -- it did dry, though wasn't as rock hard as normal
varnish. I never had a problem with it.



I don't know what the supposed complaint would be--spar varnish will
certainly dry and stay dry. They're simply tung-oil (as opposed to soya
or other oil) based varnishes that also include UV inhibitors and a
little less brittle final film as compared to "ordinary" varnishes...

They're suitable for virtually any exterior purpose...

--
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On Mon, 17 Aug 2009 00:06:35 GMT, the infamous notbob
scrawled the following:

Is it any good, or just hype.


IHMO: ****ty product, great marketing ploy. I'd sooner apply uric acid
directly. At least it would wash off more quickly (one hour of rain
instead of two)


--
"Giving every man a vote has no more made men wise and free
than Christianity has made them good." --H. L. Mencken
---
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