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Rank newbie, again.

I need to replace the stringers in a 3 step (not including top deck step).
This is mainly due to the fact they are rotting and falling apart. I've
talked to one of my lumber suppliers (no box stores like Home Depot or
Lowe's) and they recommended "treated" wood. Didn't sound too expensive,
$10 vs $14 for 2x10 (I need a 2x12). Anyway, is this a valid expense or
should I jes get reg wood (pine) and use a sealer (which I'm also woefully
ignorant of). I'm reading DIY sites as fast as I can. Again, not
completely retarded. I got a Skil mag 77 and know how to hurt myself!

nb
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On Sun, 15 Mar 2009 22:09:58 GMT, notbob wrote:

Rank newbie, again.

I need to replace the stringers in a 3 step (not including top deck step).
This is mainly due to the fact they are rotting and falling apart. I've
talked to one of my lumber suppliers (no box stores like Home Depot or
Lowe's) and they recommended "treated" wood. Didn't sound too expensive,
$10 vs $14 for 2x10 (I need a 2x12). Anyway, is this a valid expense or
should I jes get reg wood (pine) and use a sealer (which I'm also woefully
ignorant of). I'm reading DIY sites as fast as I can. Again, not
completely retarded. I got a Skil mag 77 and know how to hurt myself!

nb



Yes. PT is the way to go and probably the lowest cost, the drier the
better. Use deck screws. You might want to find out why the old
stringers are rotting and maybe fix that too. Mine are 20 years old,
going strong, but they were protected with decking stain.
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"notbob" wrote
Rank newbie, again.

I need to replace the stringers in a 3 step (not including top deck step).
This is mainly due to the fact they are rotting and falling apart. I've
talked to one of my lumber suppliers (no box stores like Home Depot or
Lowe's) and they recommended "treated" wood. Didn't sound too expensive,
$10 vs $14 for 2x10 (I need a 2x12). Anyway, is this a valid expense or
should I jes get reg wood (pine) and use a sealer (which I'm also woefully
ignorant of). I'm reading DIY sites as fast as I can. Again, not
completely retarded. I got a Skil mag 77 and know how to hurt myself!


Use treated wood by all means, and, if there is ground contact, make sure
you get the type that is labeled for "ground contact".

Just ask.

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"Phisherman" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 15 Mar 2009 22:09:58 GMT, notbob wrote:

Rank newbie, again.

I need to replace the stringers in a 3 step (not including top deck step).
This is mainly due to the fact they are rotting and falling apart. I've
talked to one of my lumber suppliers (no box stores like Home Depot or
Lowe's) and they recommended "treated" wood. Didn't sound too expensive,
$10 vs $14 for 2x10 (I need a 2x12). Anyway, is this a valid expense or
should I jes get reg wood (pine) and use a sealer (which I'm also woefully
ignorant of). I'm reading DIY sites as fast as I can. Again, not
completely retarded. I got a Skil mag 77 and know how to hurt myself!

nb



Yes. PT is the way to go and probably the lowest cost, the drier the
better. Use deck screws. You might want to find out why the old
stringers are rotting and maybe fix that too. Mine are 20 years old,
going strong, but they were protected with decking stain.


Heh... mine are 19 yrs. old and I've always *meant* to re-treat them. I've
never gotten to it. They show no signs of decay. A few screws (hot dipped
galvanized) have rusted away and I've had to put new screws in but the wood
is as solid as the day they went down.

Pressure treatment puts the protection deep into the wood... much deeper
than painted on stain will ever get.

Ed

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"notbob" wrote in message
...
Rank newbie, again.

I need to replace the stringers in a 3 step (not including top deck step).
This is mainly due to the fact they are rotting and falling apart. I've
talked to one of my lumber suppliers (no box stores like Home Depot or
Lowe's) and they recommended "treated" wood. Didn't sound too expensive,
$10 vs $14 for 2x10 (I need a 2x12). Anyway, is this a valid expense or
should I jes get reg wood (pine) and use a sealer (which I'm also woefully
ignorant of). I'm reading DIY sites as fast as I can. Again, not
completely retarded. I got a Skil mag 77 and know how to hurt myself!

nb


My house deck and stairs from it was built with regular pine when the house
was built. It lasted six years. I replaced it with pressure treated wood
about 25 years ago and it is still in great shape.




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notbob wrote:
Rank newbie, again.

I need to replace the stringers in a 3 step (not including top deck step).
This is mainly due to the fact they are rotting and falling apart. I've
talked to one of my lumber suppliers (no box stores like Home Depot or
Lowe's) and they recommended "treated" wood. Didn't sound too expensive,
$10 vs $14 for 2x10 (I need a 2x12). Anyway, is this a valid expense or
should I jes get reg wood (pine) and use a sealer (which I'm also woefully
ignorant of). I'm reading DIY sites as fast as I can. Again, not
completely retarded. I got a Skil mag 77 and know how to hurt myself!

nb


The box stores sell pre-cut three or four step treated stringers. It
might be cheaper and easier going that route.
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On Sun, 15 Mar 2009 22:09:58 GMT, notbob wrote:

I need to replace the stringers in a 3 step (not including top deck step).
This is mainly due to the fact they are rotting and falling apart. I've
talked to one of my lumber suppliers (no box stores like Home Depot or
Lowe's) and they recommended "treated" wood.



Treated wood will work fine and last a while. While "ground contact"
treated material is supposed to last, it will still rot after some
time when contacting the ground. You might consider setting the
stringers on some concrete or a partially burried 1/2 cinderblock or
anything to help them stay more dry.
Also, if you use scews, make sure you use the coated screws made for
the treated material. The lumber yard will have them.

Mike O.
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On 2009-03-16, Mike Paulsen wrote:

talked to one of my lumber suppliers (no box stores like Home Depot or
Lowe's)....




The box stores sell pre-cut three or four step treated stringers. It
might be cheaper and easier going that route.


Didn't read my post, didja.

nb
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notbob wrote:
On 2009-03-16, Mike Paulsen wrote:

talked to one of my lumber suppliers (no box stores like Home Depot or
Lowe's)....



The box stores sell pre-cut three or four step treated stringers. It
might be cheaper and easier going that route.


Didn't read my post, didja.

nb


Course I did.

You said you talked to one of your lumber suppliers, which wasn't a box
store. If you meant to say you weren't willing to talk to a box store or
didn't have a box store to talk to, that wasn't clear from your post.
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Mike Paulsen wrote:
....
... If you meant to say you weren't willing to talk to a box store or
didn't have a box store to talk to, that wasn't clear from your post.


And, even if meant either of those, the precuts will be available at any
retail lumber outlet as well...

--


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On 2009-03-16, dpb wrote:
Mike Paulsen wrote:
...
... If you meant to say you weren't willing to talk to a box store or
didn't have a box store to talk to, that wasn't clear from your post.


Not much point in talking to a box store that's 95 miles away when it's not
practical to shop there. It's a bit of a shock to go to our biggest lumber
supplier and discover they're closed on Sunday, as are the other two yards.
Coming from CA and the "hundred yard blvd", rural CO is a real eye-opener.


And, even if meant either of those, the precuts will be available at any
retail lumber outlet as well...


They only have 3 and I need six. Besides, that completely negates cutting
the wood with all these cool new tools.

nb
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notbob wrote:
....
... rural CO is a real eye-opener.

....
Where might that be out of curiousity? We're not far from one part of
about the most rural CO there is...

They only have 3 and I need six. Besides, that completely negates cutting
the wood with all these cool new tools.


Buy one for the pattern for the others as a newbie would be a thought.

I concur w/ the other posters that suggested the support above the
ground for longevity.

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On 2009-03-16, dpb wrote:

Where might that be out of curiousity? We're not far from one part of
about the most rural CO there is...


Nathrop CO, right next to Cowbell Corners and Johnsonwidespot. (actully,
Salida and BuenaVista).


Buy one for the pattern for the others as a newbie would be a thought.


Might be a good idea if vert rise/drop and span and run are the same. I
found a neat website:

http://www.easy2diy.com/cm/easy/diy_...ge_id=35779940


I concur w/ the other posters that suggested the support above the
ground for longevity.


Will do that. Have half dozen spare red flat stones, about 8"x10"x1-1/2",
that form loose stone patio at bottom of steps. I don't know why the
original builder didn't use them on base of stringers.

nb
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notbob wrote:
On 2009-03-16, dpb wrote:

Where might that be out of curiousity? We're not far from one part of
about the most rural CO there is...


Nathrop CO, right next to Cowbell Corners and Johnsonwidespot. (actully,
Salida and BuenaVista).

....

Shucks, them ain't "rural" at all...

We're adjacent (bar one) to Baca County...

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On 2009-03-17, dpb wrote:

Shucks, them ain't "rural" at all...


Wow! That is "out there". A whole county of Nathrops.

nb


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notbob wrote:
....

http://www.easy2diy.com/cm/easy/diy_...ge_id=35779940

....

I'd suggest using 5/4 decking for the treads instead of the suggested
tubasix though. It looks less "klunky". If choose 2X anyway, then use
a minimum 1/2"R roundover bit to round the outer step edges instead of
leaving them square.

Don't forget the overhang when laying out the initial stringer -- didn't
look carefully but didn't see it mentioned; may have missed it.

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notbob wrote:

http://www.easy2diy.com/cm/easy/diy_...ge_id=35779940


Wow, there are so many errors in the first slide, there's no way I can
watch all 12.


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On 2009-03-17, -MIKE- wrote:

Wow, there are so many errors in the first slide, there's no way I can
watch all 12.


I'd be more than happy to listen to any corrective info. Otherwise, the
original site is more helpful than you.

nb
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"-MIKE-" wrote in message
http://www.easy2diy.com/cm/easy/diy_...ge_id=35779940

Wow, there are so many errors in the first slide, there's no way I can
watch all 12.


Well, unless you're prepared to point out where the errors are, the only
error of any importance is your post wasting people's time.


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notbob wrote:
On 2009-03-17, -MIKE- wrote:

Wow, there are so many errors in the first slide, there's no way I can
watch all 12.


I'd be more than happy to listen to any corrective info. Otherwise, the
original site is more helpful than you.

nb



Just off the top of my head.
1. The animated illustration shows dimension lines for the vertical
rise, which go between the TOP of one tread to the BOTTOM of the tread
above it, instead of top to top.
2. It shows dimension lines for the vertical drop going from the ground
to the BOTTOM of the top tread, instead of the top (again).
3. The first step (from ground to tread) has a rise almost twice as high
as the rest. (I would guess, at least 10:6)

If there are so blatant of errors in such critical and elementary
aspects of stair construction on the very first frame of an expert
tutorial, how could one trust (or recommend) anything else on the site?

Was that helpful? :-)


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-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
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---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply


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Upscale wrote:
Wow, there are so many errors in the first slide, there's no way I can
watch all 12.


Well, unless you're prepared to point out where the errors are, the only
error of any importance is your post wasting people's time.


Wasted time? How long does it take you to read one sentence? :-p


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
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---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
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On 2009-03-18, -MIKE- wrote:

Just off the top of my head.
1. The animated illustration shows dimension lines for the vertical
rise, which go between the TOP of one tread to the BOTTOM of the tread
above it, instead of top to top.
2. It shows dimension lines for the vertical drop going from the ground
to the BOTTOM of the top tread, instead of the top (again).
3. The first step (from ground to tread) has a rise almost twice as high
as the rest. (I would guess, at least 10:6)

If there are so blatant of errors in such critical and elementary
aspects of stair construction on the very first frame of an expert
tutorial, how could one trust (or recommend) anything else on the site?

Was that helpful? :-)


Yes, it was and I thank you for taking the time to point out these errors.
Actually, I should have spotted this myself, especially when one reads the
text and realizes the explanation doesn't match the dimensioning as drawn.
The higher rise on the first step is a puzzlement. Perhap there are going
to be patio stones at base of stairs. (shrug)


nb
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On Sun, 15 Mar 2009 21:44:16 -0500, Mike Paulsen
wrote:

The box stores sell pre-cut three or four step treated stringers. It
might be cheaper and easier going that route.


The only problem I've found with those is that they never match what
I've needed for any particular application. They always seem to
require adjusting the rise of at least one of the steps to match the
required height. I don't like steps, even if there's only two of them,
that don't have equal rise and run for each step.

I've always found it very simple and easy to design and lay out the
steps on a 2x using the formula "2 x Rise + Run = 26 to 28 inches".
Makes for a set of comfortable steps which can be made to fit most any
location and have equal rise and run for each step.

Tom Veatch
Wichita, KS
USA
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"Tom Veatch" wrote

I've always found it very simple and easy to design and lay out the
steps on a 2x using the formula "2 x Rise + Run = 26 to 28 inches".
Makes for a set of comfortable steps which can be made to fit most any
location and have equal rise and run for each step.

Yep, that is what the old framers square is for. I wonder if very many
folks these days know how to mark and cut some steps the old fashioned way?
It wasn't long ago that this was a common skill.




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"Lee Michaels" wrote in message
...

"Tom Veatch" wrote

I've always found it very simple and easy to design and lay out the
steps on a 2x using the formula "2 x Rise + Run = 26 to 28 inches".
Makes for a set of comfortable steps which can be made to fit most any
location and have equal rise and run for each step.

Yep, that is what the old framers square is for. I wonder if very many
folks these days know how to mark and cut some steps the old fashioned
way? It wasn't long ago that this was a common skill.


Somewhere is a book of yore on the many uses of the framing square. Mine has
been lost for about 20 years. I'm sure there are reprints available on the
web, but I've been too limited of access lately to look it up.


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Lee Michaels wrote:
"Tom Veatch" wrote
I've always found it very simple and easy to design and lay out the
steps on a 2x using the formula "2 x Rise + Run = 26 to 28 inches".
Makes for a set of comfortable steps which can be made to fit most any
location and have equal rise and run for each step.

Yep, that is what the old framers square is for. I wonder if very many
folks these days know how to mark and cut some steps the old fashioned way?
It wasn't long ago that this was a common skill.


Is the a new fangled way?
I've always used a square with the little clips that I have, amazingly,
not lost.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
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--
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notbob wrote:
The higher rise on the first step is a puzzlement. Perhap there are going
to be patio stones at base of stairs. (shrug)


nb



I thought the same thing, but if that's the case, it really should be
noted or illustrated.


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"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

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On 2009-03-19, Lee Michaels wrote:

Yep, that is what the old framers square is for. I wonder if very many
folks these days know how to mark and cut some steps the old fashioned way?
It wasn't long ago that this was a common skill.


I jes bought a new framing square. My late brother, a master carpenter,
didn't have one in his estate, that I could find. I got those little
framing square stops one attaches to keep a repeatable measurement. I will
be cutting the stringers with smaller than usual rise cuz mom, at 81, is
becoming limited in leg strength. I'm no carpenter, but as a machinist am
more than familiar with measuring.

Honestly, I'm enjoying the heck outta learning woodworking. I also like
this newsgroup. Seems to have a nice ambience with lottsa folks willing to
help a newb like me.

nb
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"phorbin" wrote in message
...
In article ,
says...

"Lee Michaels" wrote in message
...

"Tom Veatch" wrote

I've always found it very simple and easy to design and lay out the
steps on a 2x using the formula "2 x Rise + Run = 26 to 28 inches".
Makes for a set of comfortable steps which can be made to fit most any
location and have equal rise and run for each step.

Yep, that is what the old framers square is for. I wonder if very many
folks these days know how to mark and cut some steps the old fashioned
way? It wasn't long ago that this was a common skill.


Somewhere is a book of yore on the many uses of the framing square. Mine
has
been lost for about 20 years. I'm sure there are reprints available on
the
web, but I've been too limited of access lately to look it up.



Was it in the first book in the Audels Carpenters and Builders Guide?
(4 book set)

Chapter 23 How to Use the Steel Square


My set is a third edition dated 1945 and my wife found it at Attic Books
in London Ontario.

http://www.atticbooks.ca/index.html


Lee Valley has reprinted it.

http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.a...=1,46096,46100
&ap=1

Lee Valley has also extracted the chapter in question and turned it into
a booklet.

http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.a...=1,46096,46100



Ahh......, leave it to Rob Lee to stay a couple steps ahead of us and
provide a valuable reference work. It obviously is an insidious plot to to
extract some hard earned cash from our wallets!!





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Lee Michaels wrote:
"phorbin" wrote in message
...
In article ,
says...

"Lee Michaels" wrote in message
...

"Tom Veatch" wrote

I've always found it very simple and easy to design and lay out
the steps on a 2x using the formula "2 x Rise + Run = 26 to 28
inches". Makes for a set of comfortable steps which can be made
to fit most any location and have equal rise and run for each
step.
Yep, that is what the old framers square is for. I wonder if very
many folks these days know how to mark and cut some steps the old
fashioned way? It wasn't long ago that this was a common skill.

Somewhere is a book of yore on the many uses of the framing square.
Mine has
been lost for about 20 years. I'm sure there are reprints available
on the
web, but I've been too limited of access lately to look it up.



Was it in the first book in the Audels Carpenters and Builders Guide?
(4 book set)

Chapter 23 How to Use the Steel Square


My set is a third edition dated 1945 and my wife found it at Attic
Books in London Ontario.

http://www.atticbooks.ca/index.html


Lee Valley has reprinted it.

http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.a...=1,46096,46100
&ap=1

Lee Valley has also extracted the chapter in question and turned it
into a booklet.

http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.a...=1,46096,46100



Ahh......, leave it to Rob Lee to stay a couple steps ahead of us and
provide a valuable reference work. It obviously is an insidious plot
to to extract some hard earned cash from our wallets!!


Amazon also carries one
http://www.amazon.com/Essential-Guid...71405&sr= 8-1.

Note that if you're considering buying a steel square, get it somewhere
where you can look at it first. Most of the ones I'm seeing on the shelves
in stores have the inch markings along the edges but none of the others.
And if you do find one that has the other markings, make sure that they're
clearly stamped.

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"phorbin" wrote

Was it in the first book in the Audels Carpenters and Builders Guide?
(4 book set)

Chapter 23 How to Use the Steel Square


My set is a third edition dated 1945 and my wife found it at Attic Books
in London Ontario.

http://www.atticbooks.ca/index.html


Lee Valley has reprinted it.

http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.a...=1,46096,46100
&ap=1

Lee Valley has also extracted the chapter in question and turned it into
a booklet.

http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.a...=1,46096,46100


Bingo ... thank you!


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In article ,
says...

Ahh......, leave it to Rob Lee to stay a couple steps ahead of us and
provide a valuable reference work. It obviously is an insidious plot to to
extract some hard earned cash from our wallets!!


I believe the reprint end of things is Leonard Lee's beiliwick.
.........Which would make it a conspiracy :-)

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