I went to my local Porter Cable/Delta parts and recondition outlet in
Southern California and the name has been changed to Black & Decker. I was
****ED!!!!!!!! I was looking for a reconditioned circular saw, my old 25
year old Craftsman finally took a **** and I needed to replace it. For the
last 10 years I have only bought Porter Cable, Milwaukee, Bosch and Delta.
I went in and all I saw basically was orange and black, I got sick to my
stomach.
I asked the customer service guy what happened. He didn't look happy and
said that B&D had taken them over. My next question was how long will it
take B&D to implement it's cheap ass engineering into Porter Cable and
Delta? He had that stupid look on his face. I told him, "guess you're
forcing me to buy Milwaukee and Bosch". He did say that I wasn't the only
customer that had the same reaction.

The worst power tool builder now makes one of the best power tools. How long
will it take for Delta/Porter Cable to become second to the worst?

I'm so ****ed off
Rich
--
"you can lead them to LINUX
but you can't make them THINK"

"evodawg" wrote in message
news:z_Lif.5213$AB2.1182@trnddc08...
I went to my local Porter Cable/Delta parts and recondition outlet in
Southern California and the name has been changed to Black & Decker. I was
****ED!!!!!!!! I was looking for a reconditioned circular saw, my old 25
year old Craftsman finally took a **** and I needed to replace it. For the
last 10 years I have only bought Porter Cable, Milwaukee, Bosch and Delta.
I went in and all I saw basically was orange and black, I got sick to my
stomach.
I asked the customer service guy what happened. He didn't look happy and
said that B&D had taken them over. My next question was how long will it
take B&D to implement it's cheap ass engineering into Porter Cable and
Delta? He had that stupid look on his face. I told him, "guess you're
forcing me to buy Milwaukee and Bosch". He did say that I wasn't the only
customer that had the same reaction.

The worst power tool builder now makes one of the best power tools. How
long
will it take for Delta/Porter Cable to become second to the worst?

I'm so ****ed off
Rich
--
"you can lead them to LINUX
but you can't make them THINK"
Gee, the big switch took place over a year ago. Where have you been?
Jim

Jim wrote:


"evodawg" wrote in message
news:z_Lif.5213$AB2.1182@trnddc08...
I went to my local Porter Cable/Delta parts and recondition outlet in
Southern California and the name has been changed to Black & Decker. I
was
****ED!!!!!!!! I was looking for a reconditioned circular saw, my old 25
year old Craftsman finally took a **** and I needed to replace it. For
the last 10 years I have only bought Porter Cable, Milwaukee, Bosch and
Delta. I went in and all I saw basically was orange and black, I got sick
to my stomach.
I asked the customer service guy what happened. He didn't look happy and
said that B&D had taken them over. My next question was how long will it
take B&D to implement it's cheap ass engineering into Porter Cable and
Delta? He had that stupid look on his face. I told him, "guess you're
forcing me to buy Milwaukee and Bosch". He did say that I wasn't the only
customer that had the same reaction.

The worst power tool builder now makes one of the best power tools. How
long
will it take for Delta/Porter Cable to become second to the worst?

I'm so ****ed off
Rich
--
"you can lead them to LINUX
but you can't make them THINK"
Gee, the big switch took place over a year ago. Where have you been?
Jim

Well lets see, guess when you only buy great tools you aren't buying them
every week and I don't spend my spare time shooting the **** on newsgroups
and in retail stores, I'm to busy with my remodel business.

Rich
--
"you can lead them to LINUX
but you can't make them THINK"

I would jump to the conclusion that just because B&D owns PC, that PC
qulaity will go down. It might even go up if they get more R&D
funding....

Examples: Ford bought Volvo and as far as I know, Volvo hasn't become
worse. GM has bought many foreighn auto makers and the purchased auto
makers seem to have not changed much.

Am I wrong?


evodawg wrote:
I went to my local Porter Cable/Delta parts and recondition outlet in
Southern California and the name has been changed to Black & Decker. I was
****ED!!!!!!!! I was looking for a reconditioned circular saw, my old 25
year old Craftsman finally took a **** and I needed to replace it. For the
last 10 years I have only bought Porter Cable, Milwaukee, Bosch and Delta.
I went in and all I saw basically was orange and black, I got sick to my
stomach.
I asked the customer service guy what happened. He didn't look happy and
said that B&D had taken them over. My next question was how long will it
take B&D to implement it's cheap ass engineering into Porter Cable and
Delta? He had that stupid look on his face. I told him, "guess you're
forcing me to buy Milwaukee and Bosch". He did say that I wasn't the only
customer that had the same reaction.

The worst power tool builder now makes one of the best power tools. How long
will it take for Delta/Porter Cable to become second to the worst?

I'm so ****ed off
Rich
--
"you can lead them to LINUX
but you can't make them THINK"

Never Enough Money wrote:

I would jump to the conclusion that just because B&D owns PC, that PC
qulaity will go down. It might even go up if they get more R&D
funding....

Examples: Ford bought Volvo and as far as I know, Volvo hasn't become
worse. GM has bought many foreighn auto makers and the purchased auto
makers seem to have not changed much.

Am I wrong?

Hmmmmm, what are you saying about Ford? I would not compare Ford to Black
and Decker. Besides I drive a Ford F-250 and have 4 more F-350 Flatbeds.
I'm kinda partial to Ford and Porter Cable. :P

Don't know much about Volvo except that it's a safe car.

Rich

--
"you can lead them to LINUX
but you can't make them THINK"

evodawg wrote:

The worst power tool builder now makes one of the best power tools. How long
will it take for Delta/Porter Cable to become second to the worst?

IIRC, Black & Decker has owned DeWalt since 1960. DeWalt still has some
decent tools.

--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA

(Remove -SPAM- to send email)

evodawg wrote:

I went to my local Porter Cable/Delta parts and recondition outlet in
Southern California and the name has been changed to Black & Decker. I was
****ED!!!!!!!! I was looking for a reconditioned circular saw, my old 25
year old Craftsman finally took a **** and I needed to replace it. For the
last 10 years I have only bought Porter Cable, Milwaukee, Bosch and Delta.
I went in and all I saw basically was orange and black, I got sick to my
stomach.
I asked the customer service guy what happened. He didn't look happy and
said that B&D had taken them over. My next question was how long will it
take B&D to implement it's cheap ass engineering into Porter Cable and
Delta? He had that stupid look on his face. I told him, "guess you're
forcing me to buy Milwaukee and Bosch". He did say that I wasn't the only
customer that had the same reaction.

The worst power tool builder now makes one of the best power tools. How long
will it take for Delta/Porter Cable to become second to the worst?

I'm so ****ed off
Rich

I've considered Delta to be a brand I buy only when there's no good
alternative. I love my Unisaw of a few years ago, and my DP is ok, but
their bandsaws suck big time in my opinion, and I've had lousy luck with
their technical assistance. I'm not too crazy with my 2 Delta belt
sanders. I bought them more for the price than quality. All my Porter
Cable stuff has been rock solid with the exception of a few times where
my 7518 would run at random speeds when set to the lowest RPM setting.

So I don't know why you are upset because of B&D's involvement. Can
Delta really get much worse? Porter Cable brand is the one I'd worry
about...

Dave

I have 2 older delta 14" bandsaws that are very good. Can't speak for the
newer ones. Having a Hi/Low transmission in great if you do metal work. I
have a VERY old delta drill press with an extra bearing over the spindle
pulley that is a tank compared to the stuff sold now.
"David" wrote in message
...
evodawg wrote:

I went to my local Porter Cable/Delta parts and recondition outlet in
Southern California and the name has been changed to Black & Decker. I
was
****ED!!!!!!!! I was looking for a reconditioned circular saw, my old 25
year old Craftsman finally took a **** and I needed to replace it. For
the
last 10 years I have only bought Porter Cable, Milwaukee, Bosch and
Delta.
I went in and all I saw basically was orange and black, I got sick to my
stomach. I asked the customer service guy what happened. He didn't look
happy and
said that B&D had taken them over. My next question was how long will it
take B&D to implement it's cheap ass engineering into Porter Cable and
Delta? He had that stupid look on his face. I told him, "guess you're
forcing me to buy Milwaukee and Bosch". He did say that I wasn't the only
customer that had the same reaction.

The worst power tool builder now makes one of the best power tools. How
long
will it take for Delta/Porter Cable to become second to the worst?

I'm so ****ed off
Rich

I've considered Delta to be a brand I buy only when there's no good
alternative. I love my Unisaw of a few years ago, and my DP is ok, but
their bandsaws suck big time in my opinion, and I've had lousy luck with
their technical assistance. I'm not too crazy with my 2 Delta belt
sanders. I bought them more for the price than quality. All my Porter
Cable stuff has been rock solid with the exception of a few times where my
7518 would run at random speeds when set to the lowest RPM setting.

So I don't know why you are upset because of B&D's involvement. Can Delta
really get much worse? Porter Cable brand is the one I'd worry
about...

Dave

"evodawg" wrote in message

I don't spend my spare time shooting the **** on newsgroups
and in retail stores, I'm to busy with my remodel business.


ooooookay, so go back to work and don't bother us by shooting the **** here.

evodawg wrote:


Well lets see, guess when you only buy great tools you aren't buying them
every week and I don't spend my spare time shooting the **** on newsgroups
and in retail stores, I'm to busy with my remodel business.

Rich
ok...so go back to work and stop wasting time here! I'm so happy for
you and your remodel business.

Dave

Edwin Pawlowski wrote:

"evodawg" wrote in message

I don't spend my spare time shooting the **** on newsgroups
and in retail stores, I'm to busy with my remodel business.


ooooookay, so go back to work and don't bother us by shooting the ****
here.

Well at least I put my tools to work, instead you two talk about them and
I'm sure all they do for you is collect DUST. PINHEADS
--
"you can lead them to LINUX
but you can't make them THINK"

"evodawg" wrote in message
Well at least I put my tools to work, instead you two talk about them and
I'm sure all they do for you is collect DUST. PINHEADS

Yep, I don't want to wear them out
--
Ed
http://pages.cthome.net/edhome/

I would jump to the conclusion that just because B&D owns PC, that PC
qulaity will go down. It might even go up if they get more R&D
funding....

B&D bought Elu and renamed it deWalt. Don't remember the quality there going
anywhere other than DOWN....

VL wrote:
I would jump to the conclusion that just because B&D owns PC, that PC
qulaity will go down. It might even go up if they get more R&D
funding....

B&D bought Elu and renamed it deWalt. Don't remember the quality there going
anywhere other than DOWN....

Really? Not all DW tools were Elu, which, in the states, was a
rebadging for most tools at first. The B&D Professional line turned
yellow and black, as did two Elu tools, a router and a slide compound
miter saw. No change of color on the saw, for which B&D can be
grateful, because the one I had was a POS from an operational
standpoint, as was the Elu biscuit joiner.

I don't know what happened to Elu in Europe, from whence it originally
came, but from the ads I see for most European power tools, if quality
went down after B&D bought them, it had plenty of company in the other
companies putting tools on the market. With some exceptionally
expensive exceptions--think Mafell--European tools appear to me to be
underdesigned and overgimmicked, with very high prices.

"Never Enough Money" wrote in message
oups.com...
I would jump to the conclusion that just because B&D owns PC, that PC
qulaity will go down. It might even go up if they get more R&D
funding....

Examples: Ford bought Volvo and as far as I know, Volvo hasn't become
worse. GM has bought many foreighn auto makers and the purchased auto
makers seem to have not changed much.

Am I wrong?


Delta/Rockwell/Delta bought out a number of brands on the way up, too.

Remember when there were thirty or so snowmobile brands?

"George" George@least wrote in message
...

"Never Enough Money" wrote in message
oups.com...
I would jump to the conclusion that just because B&D owns PC, that PC
qulaity will go down. It might even go up if they get more R&D
funding....

Examples: Ford bought Volvo and as far as I know, Volvo hasn't become
worse. GM has bought many foreighn auto makers and the purchased auto
makers seem to have not changed much.

Am I wrong?


Delta/Rockwell/Delta bought out a number of brands on the way up, too.

Remember when there were thirty or so snowmobile brands?

Probably closer to 100 different brands in the early 70's. I still have a
magazine around here somewhere that lightly covers each brand from the era.
Just about anyone with some manufacturing ability was building sleds.
Greg

"evodawg" wrote in message
news:z_Lif.5213$AB2.1182@trnddc08...
I went to my local Porter Cable/Delta parts and recondition outlet in
Southern California and the name has been changed to Black & Decker. I was
****ED!!!!!!!! I was looking for a reconditioned circular saw, my old 25
year old Craftsman finally took a **** and I needed to replace it. For the
last 10 years I have only bought Porter Cable, Milwaukee, Bosch and Delta.
I went in and all I saw basically was orange and black, I got sick to my
stomach.
I asked the customer service guy what happened. He didn't look happy and
said that B&D had taken them over. My next question was how long will it
take B&D to implement it's cheap ass engineering into Porter Cable and
Delta? He had that stupid look on his face. I told him, "guess you're
forcing me to buy Milwaukee and Bosch". He did say that I wasn't the only
customer that had the same reaction.

The worst power tool builder now makes one of the best power tools. How
long
will it take for Delta/Porter Cable to become second to the worst?


Umm the quality of PC and Delta started down that slippery slope long before
B&D bought them.

On Mon, 28 Nov 2005 23:00:47 GMT, evodawg
wrote:

I went to my local Porter Cable/Delta parts and recondition outlet in
Southern California and the name has been changed to Black & Decker. I was
****ED!!!!!!!! I was looking for a reconditioned circular saw, my old 25
year old Craftsman finally took a **** and I needed to replace it. For the
last 10 years I have only bought Porter Cable, Milwaukee, Bosch and Delta.
I went in and all I saw basically was orange and black, I got sick to my
stomach.
I asked the customer service guy what happened. He didn't look happy and
said that B&D had taken them over. My next question was how long will it
take B&D to implement it's cheap ass engineering into Porter Cable and
Delta? He had that stupid look on his face. I told him, "guess you're
forcing me to buy Milwaukee and Bosch". He did say that I wasn't the only
customer that had the same reaction.

The worst power tool builder now makes one of the best power tools. How long
will it take for Delta/Porter Cable to become second to the worst?

I'm so ****ed off
Rich

Pentair was selling off all the tool line from there company.

The Pentair Tool Group includes Delta, Porter-Cable, DeVilbiss Air
Power, Oldham Saws, and Flex Tools
Black and Decker already owns Dewalt line. B&D also owns Emhart
fasteners, Price Pfister, and Kwikset.

The news release of July 2004:
The Corporation also announced that it has signed an agreement to
purchase the Tools Group from Pentair, Inc. (NYSE: PNR) for
approximately $775 million in cash. The Tools Group, with 2003 sales
of $1.08 billion and operating profit of $82 million, includes the
Porter-Cable, Delta, DeVilbiss Air Power, Oldham Saw, and FLEX
businesses.

Under the first contract with B&D, Dewalts engineering division would
be retained to continue providing the quality Dewalt had engineered in
their products. We can only hope that the same would go for the
Pentair Tool Group.

"evodawg" wrote in message
news:PpMif.7294$KZ2.678@trnddc05...

Well lets see, guess when you only buy great tools you aren't buying them
every week and I don't spend my spare time shooting the **** on newsgroups
and in retail stores, I'm to busy with my remodel business.

Rich
--
"you can lead them to LINUX
but you can't make them THINK"
You will buy more tools in a week than I do in a year (even if you don't buy
any). Go back to your remodel business and stay there.
Jim

On Tue, 29 Nov 2005 11:14:14 -0000, "VL" wrote:

I would jump to the conclusion that just because B&D owns PC, that PC
qulaity will go down. It might even go up if they get more R&D
funding....

B&D bought Elu and renamed it deWalt. Don't remember the quality there going
anywhere other than DOWN....


Dewalt has been around since 1922. Started in Leola, Pennsylvania and
later moved to Lancaster Pennsylvania.
Originally call Dewalt Products they changed there name to Dewalt Inc
in 1947
The original radial arm saw was named the Wonder worker.

ELU was a Swiss company purchased in 1980 by B&D.

Jaguar's mechanical quality has gone up since Ford bought 'em.

Never Enough Money wrote:
I would jump to the conclusion that just because B&D owns PC, that PC
qulaity will go down. It might even go up if they get more R&D
funding....

Examples: Ford bought Volvo and as far as I know, Volvo hasn't become
worse. GM has bought many foreighn auto makers and the purchased auto
makers seem to have not changed much.

Am I wrong?

The days of relying on brand names to judge quality (of any kind of goods)
is long gone. Brand names are bought and sold every day. Get to know the
guys at your local rental center... they'll tell you in a hurry what's
crap and what isn't.
Tom

"evodawg" wrote in message
news:z_Lif.5213$AB2.1182@trnddc08...
I went to my local Porter Cable/Delta parts and recondition outlet in
Southern California and the name has been changed to Black & Decker. I was
****ED!!!!!!!! I was looking for a reconditioned circular saw, my old 25
year old Craftsman finally took a **** and I needed to replace it. For the
last 10 years I have only bought Porter Cable, Milwaukee, Bosch and Delta.
I went in and all I saw basically was orange and black, I got sick to my
stomach.
I asked the customer service guy what happened. He didn't look happy and
said that B&D had taken them over. My next question was how long will it
take B&D to implement it's cheap ass engineering into Porter Cable and
Delta? He had that stupid look on his face. I told him, "guess you're
forcing me to buy Milwaukee and Bosch". He did say that I wasn't the only
customer that had the same reaction.

The worst power tool builder now makes one of the best power tools. How
long
will it take for Delta/Porter Cable to become second to the worst?

I'm so ****ed off
Rich
--
"you can lead them to LINUX
but you can't make them THINK"

"Mike Berger" wrote in message
...
Jaguar's mechanical quality has gone up since Ford bought 'em.


Yeah, I have not heard of any Jaguar owners having to put a Chevy V8 in to
make the car run any more. :~)

In article , Mike Berger wrote:
Jaguar's mechanical quality has gone up since Ford bought 'em.

That's sad, in so many ways.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.

"Doug Miller" wrote in message

Mike Berger wrote:
Jaguar's mechanical quality has gone up since Ford bought 'em.

That's sad, in so many ways.

I don't think it's "mechanical quality" so much as engineering, as a
science, has advanced sufficiently to produce more "consistent crap".

Used to be that each individual sports car had mechanical
characteristics/quirks all it's own, and that was part of the fun of owning
one.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 11/06/05

Greg O wrote:
"George" George@least wrote in message
...

"Never Enough Money" wrote in message
oups.com...
I would jump to the conclusion that just because B&D owns PC, that PC
qulaity will go down. It might even go up if they get more R&D
funding....

Examples: Ford bought Volvo and as far as I know, Volvo hasn't become
worse. GM has bought many foreighn auto makers and the purchased auto
makers seem to have not changed much.

Am I wrong?


Delta/Rockwell/Delta bought out a number of brands on the way up, too.

Remember when there were thirty or so snowmobile brands?

Probably closer to 100 different brands in the early 70's. I still have a
magazine around here somewhere that lightly covers each brand from the era.
Just about anyone with some manufacturing ability was building sleds.

Let's not forget that Ford owns Jaguar, today, too. But with
snowmobiles back in the '70s, I recall doing an article for, I believe,
Camping Journal, as a round-up. It was an impossibility, so I ended up
calling about 18 of the top sellers and covering their machines, while
adding in two or three that had novel features.

Haven't even thought about sleds in more than two decades. Snowfall in
south central VA doesn't add up to that kind of outdoor play, but I can
recall in Albany, NY in the late '60s where snow got so severe they had
to use snowmobiles (borrowed) for emergency vehicles...ambulances and
what not. Had to be a rough, cold ride for the patients.

On 29 Nov 2005 14:42:22 -0800, Charlie Self wrote:

Haven't even thought about sleds in more than two decades. Snowfall in
south central VA doesn't add up to that kind of outdoor play, but I can
recall in Albany, NY in the late '60s where snow got so severe they had
to use snowmobiles (borrowed) for emergency vehicles...ambulances and
what not. Had to be a rough, cold ride for the patients.

We've got a patient-hauling-trailer for snowmobile incidents. For the
record, it's also damn cold being the EMT holding c-spine traction while
the wind blows up the back of your jacket for the duration of the
snowmobile segment of the transport. DAMHIKT.

Swingman said:

Used to be that each individual sports car had mechanical
characteristics/quirks all it's own, and that was part of the fun of owning
one.

From the lips of an experienced 50's/60's era English car owner?

I shiver with a curious mix of nostalgia and pain when I think of some
of the cars I used to drive and service - but there remains one
unfailing truism - they definitely had character.

Had a customer who owned a really old MG with actual threaded
knock-offs and wire wheels. He ran it into a ditch and had to replace
the right spindle - only problem was, he could only find a left
spindle in the local scrap-yards. (It must have been a common problem
back then - running into ditches and such...)

The car spent the remainder of it's life in one ditch after another as
the wheel repeatedly fell off. He didn't have the sense to safety
wire the knock-off into in place, and couldn't/wouldn't pay to have it
fixed right.

Now THAT's a Character...


Greg G.

"Greg G." wrote in message
Swingman said:

Used to be that each individual sports car had mechanical
characteristics/quirks all it's own, and that was part of the fun of
owning
one.

From the lips of an experienced 50's/60's era English car owner?

Not exactly, but the next best thing ... I had that rare uncle, a bachelor
college professor (sort of a Hugh Hefner about town), who would give his 16
year old nephew a pint of whisky and the keys to his current sports cars to
take on a date ... included a couple of different Alfa Romeo's, more than a
few MG's, and at least one Mercedes rally car (300SL?) ... we loved each and
everyone, jointly.

And I was often his "advisor" when he went sports car shopping trips ...
then he had to go ruin it all by getting married (and all this time he'd
been instructing me in the philosophy of not buying the cow when the milk
was free)

... Can you imagine getting away with that today?

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 11/06/05

wayne mak wrote:

I have 2 older delta 14" bandsaws that are very good. Can't speak for the
newer ones. Having a Hi/Low transmission in great if you do metal work. I
have a VERY old delta drill press with an extra bearing over the spindle
pulley that is a tank compared to the stuff sold now.
"David" wrote in message
...

evodawg wrote:


I went to my local Porter Cable/Delta parts and recondition outlet in
Southern California and the name has been changed to Black & Decker. I
was
****ED!!!!!!!! I was looking for a reconditioned circular saw, my old 25
year old Craftsman finally took a **** and I needed to replace it. For
the
last 10 years I have only bought Porter Cable, Milwaukee, Bosch and
Delta.
I went in and all I saw basically was orange and black, I got sick to my
stomach. I asked the customer service guy what happened. He didn't look
happy and
said that B&D had taken them over. My next question was how long will it
take B&D to implement it's cheap ass engineering into Porter Cable and
Delta? He had that stupid look on his face. I told him, "guess you're
forcing me to buy Milwaukee and Bosch". He did say that I wasn't the only
customer that had the same reaction.

The worst power tool builder now makes one of the best power tools. How
long
will it take for Delta/Porter Cable to become second to the worst?

I'm so ****ed off
Rich

I've considered Delta to be a brand I buy only when there's no good
alternative. I love my Unisaw of a few years ago, and my DP is ok, but
their bandsaws suck big time in my opinion, and I've had lousy luck with
their technical assistance. I'm not too crazy with my 2 Delta belt
sanders. I bought them more for the price than quality. All my Porter
Cable stuff has been rock solid with the exception of a few times where my
7518 would run at random speeds when set to the lowest RPM setting.

So I don't know why you are upset because of B&D's involvement. Can Delta
really get much worse? Porter Cable brand is the one I'd worry
about...

Dave



Even the model that came out immediately before the 3450 RPM (the 1.5
HP) motor model was nicer. It lacked a few features of the later model,
but at least the earlier model ran more quietly and smoothly. I had
both models for a brief time. The 1 HP model (the model before they
upped the HP to 1.5) was pretty decent. I wouldn't have kept the 1.5
version in my shop if it were free. Seriously.

dave

On Tue, 29 Nov 2005 09:56:50 -0600, Mike Berger wrote:

Jaguar's mechanical quality has gone up since Ford bought 'em.


Having seen all of the British autos I ever care to, I would say that it
wouldn't have taken much to improve a British auto's mechanical quality.



Never Enough Money wrote:
I would jump to the conclusion that just because B&D owns PC, that PC
qulaity will go down. It might even go up if they get more R&D
funding....

Examples: Ford bought Volvo and as far as I know, Volvo hasn't become
worse. GM has bought many foreighn auto makers and the purchased auto
makers seem to have not changed much.

Am I wrong?


+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+

If you're gonna be dumb, you better be tough

+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+

On Tue, 29 Nov 2005 14:43:05 GMT, "Leon"
wrote:


"evodawg" wrote in message
news:z_Lif.5213$AB2.1182@trnddc08...
I went to my local Porter Cable/Delta parts and recondition outlet in
Southern California and the name has been changed to Black & Decker. I was
****ED!!!!!!!! I was looking for a reconditioned circular saw, my old 25
year old Craftsman finally took a **** and I needed to replace it. For the
last 10 years I have only bought Porter Cable, Milwaukee, Bosch and Delta.
I went in and all I saw basically was orange and black, I got sick to my
stomach.
I asked the customer service guy what happened. He didn't look happy and
said that B&D had taken them over. My next question was how long will it
take B&D to implement it's cheap ass engineering into Porter Cable and
Delta? He had that stupid look on his face. I told him, "guess you're
forcing me to buy Milwaukee and Bosch". He did say that I wasn't the only
customer that had the same reaction.

The worst power tool builder now makes one of the best power tools. How
long
will it take for Delta/Porter Cable to become second to the worst?


Umm the quality of PC and Delta started down that slippery slope long before
B&D bought them.


Would certainly agree with that. Bought a PC cordless drill in 1999
(Pentair era). Nice drill, but at about 1 to 1 1/2 years old, I wound up
shaking plastic parts out of it (not really sure what they were a part of,
I think they were part of a guide for the forward/reverse switch). This
was for a drill that had never been dropped nor abused in any way. That
was the reason I decided not to replace the batteries when they went, but
bought a Milwaukee to replace it. The difference in quality between the
two drills is staggering and apparent. It's just so obvious which one was
"value-engineered" and which one was engineered for value.




+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+

If you're gonna be dumb, you better be tough

+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+

"Mark & Juanita" wrote in message
...

Would certainly agree with that. Bought a PC cordless drill in 1999
(Pentair era). Nice drill, but at about 1 to 1 1/2 years old, I wound up
shaking plastic parts out of it (not really sure what they were a part of,
I think they were part of a guide for the forward/reverse switch). This
was for a drill that had never been dropped nor abused in any way. That
was the reason I decided not to replace the batteries when they went, but
bought a Milwaukee to replace it. The difference in quality between the
two drills is staggering and apparent. It's just so obvious which one was
"value-engineered" and which one was engineered for value.

I have a friend that bought a PC cordless drill. Parts fell out of it
also... He went back to Craftsman. LOL

I did however buy another PC Speed Bloc last week, my old one pooped out
after only 16 years.

Mike Berger wrote:

Jaguar's mechanical quality has gone up since Ford bought 'em.


SFWIW, when FoMoCo bought Jag, it took 35 mqn hours to assemble one vs
less than 1 hour for most FoMoCo units.

Reducing direct labor and getting rid of the "Prince of Darkness"
electrical system were great starts to improve the reliability of the Jag.

Personally, I wouldn't have one.

Nothing personal, just not my type of vehicle.

Lew

"evodawg" wrote:

I went to my local Porter Cable/Delta parts and recondition outlet in
Southern California and the name has been changed to Black & Decker.

Was that the factory PC service center in Ontario or somebody in L/A?

I was
****ED!!!!!!!!

Doesn't take much huh? G


Lew

Lew Hodgett wrote:


"evodawg" wrote:

I went to my local Porter Cable/Delta parts and recondition outlet in
Southern California and the name has been changed to Black & Decker.

Was that the factory PC service center in Ontario or somebody in L/A?

I was
****ED!!!!!!!!

Doesn't take much huh? G


Lew

It used to be in Ontario right off Miliken but now has moved to Riverside
and the name is now Black and Decker
--
"you can lead them to LINUX
but you can't make them THINK"

Swingman wrote:

And I was often his "advisor" when he went sports car shopping trips ...
then he had to go ruin it all by getting married (and all this time he'd
been instructing me in the philosophy of not buying the cow when the milk
was free)

.. Can you imagine getting away with that today?


What? Buying the cow?

For an interesting couple of shots of old sports check the MG TC on my
web site, and the 1934 Jaguar SS1.

Just read a babbling book that said the SS100s were the first Jaguars,
in 1936. Well, I didn't exactly read it. Paged through to points of
interest. When I catch a writer telling me that Plymouth had such and
such power, and in the very next sentence, no para break, he babbles on
about Pontiac, I know he got his notes confused, his mind in a whirl,
and didn't do the work of rereading and rewriting. And nobody proofread
the blinking thing. I thought lack of proofreading was a trendy, today
sort of thing, but this book was out in '78 or so, and I caught an
earlier one by the same guy doing the same stuff. Expensive books in
their day, too.

"Dave Hinz" wrote in message
...
On 29 Nov 2005 14:42:22 -0800, Charlie Self wrote:

Haven't even thought about sleds in more than two decades. Snowfall in
south central VA doesn't add up to that kind of outdoor play, but I can
recall in Albany, NY in the late '60s where snow got so severe they had
to use snowmobiles (borrowed) for emergency vehicles...ambulances and
what not. Had to be a rough, cold ride for the patients.

We've got a patient-hauling-trailer for snowmobile incidents. For the
record, it's also damn cold being the EMT holding c-spine traction while
the wind blows up the back of your jacket for the duration of the
snowmobile segment of the transport. DAMHIKT.



What I like is the way they pay attention to the trail markers as they blast
through. You take the recovery sled in for six miles before you find them.
A quarter mile from another road. Of course, at the speeds they travel,
the color - trail number code - rather than the mileage is about all they
_might_ catch. Digital cell phones are a help, as long as they're not in a
swale.

It was nine winters before I recovered my first _sober_ snowmobiler. Says a
lot.

"Greg G." wrote in message
...
Had a customer who owned a really old MG with actual threaded
knock-offs and wire wheels. He ran it into a ditch and had to replace
the right spindle - only problem was, he could only find a left
spindle in the local scrap-yards. (It must have been a common problem
back then - running into ditches and such...)

Wire wheels was what made them a "sports car" to my insurer. With solids,
the MGA, even the DOHC, was an "economy" car. Guess which kind I had -
according to his paperwork.

The 120 Jag I rebuilt afterward had knockoffs too. Seems there were holes
for safety wires, though my memory is starting to fade.

On Tue, 29 Nov 2005 21:27:27 -0700, Mark & Juanita
wrote:

On Tue, 29 Nov 2005 09:56:50 -0600, Mike Berger wrote:

Jaguar's mechanical quality has gone up since Ford bought 'em.


Having seen all of the British autos I ever care to, I would say that it
wouldn't have taken much to improve a British auto's mechanical quality.

But at least the Brits designed cars so they went round corners, 50
years later it's something the Yanks still have considerable
difficulty with.


--