Carter Electronic Tension Gauge?
 

Hello all,
Has anyone been able to try one out?
http://www.woodcraft.com/family.aspx?familyid=5353
Thanks,
Gene
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I haven't tried it. And I can't for the life of me see why anyone would
want one of these things.


"Gene T" wrote in message
...

Hello all,
Has anyone been able to try one out?
http://www.woodcraft.com/family.aspx?familyid=5353
Thanks,
Gene
--





This message has been scanned by Norton Anti-virus software

On Fri, 24 Jun 2005 09:04:04 GMT, "Gene T" wrote:


Hello all,
Has anyone been able to try one out?
http://www.woodcraft.com/family.aspx?familyid=5353
Thanks,
Gene

it looks like a good idea, but adding a $200 accessory to my $300 BS would seem
like taking a gold fish to the vet...


mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

Mike in Mystic wrote:
I haven't tried it. And I can't for the life of me see why anyone would
want one of these things.


I'm with ya'!

I never realized that tensioning a band saw needed to be so exact.

In article , wrote:
Mike in Mystic wrote:
I haven't tried it. And I can't for the life of me see why anyone would
want one of these things.

I never realized that tensioning a band saw needed to be so exact.

My son has a chromatic tuner that he uses for his piano and guitar... I bet
that would work for bandsaw blades, too, just pluck it and adjust the tension
til it hits the right note. And it only cost $20.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

Nobody ever left footprints in the sands of time by sitting on his butt.
And who wants to leave buttprints in the sands of time?

ah, but what is the correct note. Sure it would work though. Once you
got the first note correct. Would a 1/8" blade sound the same as a
3/4" blade when tensioned properly?

Alan

In article . com,
"arw01" wrote:

Would a 1/8" blade sound the same as a
3/4" blade when tensioned properly?

If tuned to the same tension/frequency...certainly.

In article . com,
"arw01" wrote:

ah, but what is the correct note. Sure it would work though. Once you
got the first note correct. Would a 1/8" blade sound the same as a
3/4" blade when tensioned properly?

Alan

E

In article ,
mac davis wrote:

like taking a gold fish to the vet

*gaSP* You'd just let it swim in circles with a broken fin? You would??

B a r r y wrote in
m:



Mike in Mystic wrote:
I haven't tried it. And I can't for the life of me see why anyone
would want one of these things.


I'm with ya'!

I never realized that tensioning a band saw needed to be so exact.




Goin' from memory - which is fair warning - the Iturra catalog walks
thru an example of using once. Seems to me it was a Lenox (Lennox?)
blade that he wanted to tension to the mfg'rs specifications.

"Doug Miller" wrote in message
m...
In article ,
wrote:
Mike in Mystic wrote:
I haven't tried it. And I can't for the life of me see why anyone would
want one of these things.

I never realized that tensioning a band saw needed to be so exact.

My son has a chromatic tuner that he uses for his piano and guitar... I
bet
that would work for bandsaw blades, too, just pluck it and adjust the
tension
til it hits the right note. And it only cost $20.


Just how hard is it on the fingers to "pluck" bandsaw blades??

My fingers hurt just to think about it.

Robatoy writes:

In article . com,
"arw01" wrote:

Would a 1/8" blade sound the same as a
3/4" blade when tensioned properly?

If tuned to the same tension/frequency...certainly.

Certainly. You are 100% CERTAIN?
I'm not so sure.

Here's my reason:

Take a guitar.
Have 6 strings of different thicknesses. (i.e. a standard set)
Have them all the same tension.
The tones will be different.

It seems to me that on a bandsaw, with the same tension, with
different blade widths, will have different tones.

Can anyone validate/refute this?


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"Lee Michaels" writes:

Just how hard is it on the fingers to "pluck" bandsaw blades??

My fingers hurt just to think about it.

Psst. Do it from the backside - that's the edge without the teeth. :-)


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In article ,
Bruce Barnett wrote:

You are 100% CERTAIN?

I am if it is tuned to the same frequency.
However:
As the frequency increases with tension, wouldn't it stand to reason
that if the same frequency is reached.......waitasec..... wouldn't a
3/4" blade require more tension to get to the same pitch(frequency??)

This requires more thought.

Good answer and good article, Doug. I still dont' think I'll pay the money
for something like this, but I have a better idea why someone with more
stringent requirements than myself might want one.

Mike

"Doug Warner" wrote in message
...
"Mike in Mystic" wrote:

I haven't tried it. And I can't for the life of me see why anyone would
want one of these things.

Here's why: http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/pages/w00013.asp

And, if you're a metalworker as well, a hydraulic alternative: (Near
bottom of page)
http://www.homemetalshopclub.org/news/jun02/jun02.html

I like this one: No squinting at a dusty fiber washer (Delta), and
you know you have the right tension, instead of hoping the spring is
still good. I have the convave cut problem with thick material, and
have been investigating blade tension measurement systems.

To reply, please remove one letter from each side of "@"
Spammers are VERMIN. Please kill them all.

Itura has a tension measuring device similar to the Lennox
shown in the Lonnie Bird article referenced elsewhere in
this thread. Price is around $140 US.

Suffolk suggests using The Flutter Method. Open up
the throat to max blade exposure, move the blade
guides back away from the blade and put enough
tension on the blade so it won't spin off the wheels.
Turn on the saw. If the blade's under tensioned it
will flutter. If no fluttering then back off the tension
'til fluttering begins then add tension 'til the
fluttering stops. If you start with fluttering, add
tension until it stop.

Repeating - you need to start with enough tension
to keep the blade on the wheels!

And BTW - check the weld before using any blade.
A bad weld that lets loose with the saw running
will a) accordian an amazing length of band in
the blade guard and b) necessitate a shorts change
(DAMHIKT).

charlie b

On Fri, 24 Jun 2005 17:38:31 -0400, Robatoy wrote:

In article ,
mac davis wrote:

like taking a gold fish to the vet

*gaSP* You'd just let it swim in circles with a broken fin? You would??

only after giving it lots of room to swim... (flushing it)




mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

On Sat, 25 Jun 2005 10:04:22 -0400, Robatoy wrote:

In article ,
Bruce Barnett wrote:

You are 100% CERTAIN?

I am if it is tuned to the same frequency.
However:
As the frequency increases with tension, wouldn't it stand to reason
that if the same frequency is reached.......waitasec..... wouldn't a
3/4" blade require more tension to get to the same pitch(frequency??)

probably.. and my saw shows the "suggested" tension setting for a 3/4" blade
quite a bit higher on the scale than a 1/8" blade..



mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

On Fri, 24 Jun 2005 22:18:53 -0400, "Lee Michaels"
wrote:


"Doug Miller" wrote in message
om...
In article ,
wrote:
Mike in Mystic wrote:
I haven't tried it. And I can't for the life of me see why anyone would
want one of these things.

I never realized that tensioning a band saw needed to be so exact.

My son has a chromatic tuner that he uses for his piano and guitar... I
bet
that would work for bandsaw blades, too, just pluck it and adjust the
tension
til it hits the right note. And it only cost $20.


Just how hard is it on the fingers to "pluck" bandsaw blades??

My fingers hurt just to think about it.

maybe you get a band saw blade pick?



mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

"mac davis" wrote

"Lee Michaels" wrote:

Just how hard is it on the fingers to "pluck" bandsaw blades??

My fingers hurt just to think about it.

maybe you get a band saw blade pick?


Stainless steel pick?

"mac davis" wrote in message
probably.. and my saw shows the "suggested" tension setting for a 3/4"
blade
quite a bit higher on the scale than a 1/8" blade..

Not really. The 3/4" blade is six times wider than the 1/8" so it takes
more spring tension to get the same psi.

In article ,
"Lee Michaels" wrote:

"Doug Miller" wrote in message
m...
In article ,
wrote:
Mike in Mystic wrote:
I haven't tried it. And I can't for the life of me see why anyone would
want one of these things.

I never realized that tensioning a band saw needed to be so exact.

My son has a chromatic tuner that he uses for his piano and guitar... I
bet
that would work for bandsaw blades, too, just pluck it and adjust the
tension
til it hits the right note. And it only cost $20.


Just how hard is it on the fingers to "pluck" bandsaw blades??

My fingers hurt just to think about it.

It shouldn't be running, silly!

Robatoy writes:

In article ,
Bruce Barnett wrote:

You are 100% CERTAIN?

I am if it is tuned to the same frequency.

On a guitar, if you tune the big fat string to match the same
frequency as the skinny one, you will likely break the guitar.


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$500 per message, and acknowledges the legality of this contract.

When I started using a bandsaw, I read Duginske's book and worried all
the time about blade tension, distance to guide blocks, getting the
wheels perfectly parallel, etc. I also worried about what blade to use
for different tasks, etc. Then I read Lonnie Bird's book, who is much
more relaxed on all those topics.

Over time I've learned that most of those things don't make much
difference. Now I just use a Lenox 1/2", 4pi bi-metal blade and set
the factory guage to 1/2". If it flutters, I adjust it a little up or
done. I use that blade for everything -- ripping, resawing, and
dovetails. Works great. (I do have the Iturra spring because I
bottomed out the original obsessing over blade tension and it failed.)

You only need to worry about tension, etc. if your bandsaw doesn't
actually cut the way you expect it to. The bandsaw is a simple
machine. Using a sharp blade is probably what is most important.

Mark

In article . com, "arw01" wrote:
ah, but what is the correct note. Sure it would work though. Once you
got the first note correct. Would a 1/8" blade sound the same as a
3/4" blade when tensioned properly?

Probably not - I'm picturing a chart taped to the back of the bandsaw that
looks something like
1/2" resaw blade - Bb
1/4" utility blade - E
1/8" scroll blade - G#

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

Nobody ever left footprints in the sands of time by sitting on his butt.
And who wants to leave buttprints in the sands of time?

On 26 Jun 2005 19:29:00 -0700, "Mark Wells" wrote:

When I started using a bandsaw, I read Duginske's book and worried all
the time about blade tension, distance to guide blocks, getting the
wheels perfectly parallel, etc. I also worried about what blade to use
for different tasks, etc. Then I read Lonnie Bird's book, who is much
more relaxed on all those topics.

Over time I've learned that most of those things don't make much
difference. Now I just use a Lenox 1/2", 4pi bi-metal blade and set
the factory guage to 1/2". If it flutters, I adjust it a little up or
done. I use that blade for everything -- ripping, resawing, and
dovetails. Works great. (I do have the Iturra spring because I
bottomed out the original obsessing over blade tension and it failed.)

You only need to worry about tension, etc. if your bandsaw doesn't
actually cut the way you expect it to. The bandsaw is a simple
machine. Using a sharp blade is probably what is most important.

Mark

mark.. Maybe you can clear something up for me.. (I feel about the same as you
do about setup)
What IS fluttering?? I keep seeing it mentioned, but not described..


mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

He is referring to "blade flutter" and it requires that
you pay "a great deal" of attention during the tightning
process to actually see the flutter and then "back off"
till the flutter stops. These instructions come with
the low tension Lenox blades.

http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/pages/w00013.asp


mac davis wrote:

On 26 Jun 2005 19:29:00 -0700, "Mark Wells" wrote:


When I started using a bandsaw, I read Duginske's book and worried all
the time about blade tension, distance to guide blocks, getting the
wheels perfectly parallel, etc. I also worried about what blade to use
for different tasks, etc. Then I read Lonnie Bird's book, who is much
more relaxed on all those topics.

Over time I've learned that most of those things don't make much
difference. Now I just use a Lenox 1/2", 4pi bi-metal blade and set
the factory guage to 1/2". If it flutters, I adjust it a little up or
done. I use that blade for everything -- ripping, resawing, and
dovetails. Works great. (I do have the Iturra spring because I
bottomed out the original obsessing over blade tension and it failed.)

You only need to worry about tension, etc. if your bandsaw doesn't
actually cut the way you expect it to. The bandsaw is a simple
machine. Using a sharp blade is probably what is most important.

Mark


mark.. Maybe you can clear something up for me.. (I feel about the same as you
do about setup)
What IS fluttering?? I keep seeing it mentioned, but not described..


mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

Suffolk Machinary (Timber Wolf blades) suggests using a "flutter"
method to set the bandsaw tension. They say you should let the tension
off until the blade flutters. In other words, it oscillates back and
forth about 1/4". Then you increase the tension until the flutter is
gone. I found that process very time consuming, and and easy way to
ruin a blade because the tracking can change as you change the tension.

The flutter I'm talking about is that sometimes there can be a harmonic
oscillation in the blade after setting the tension. If that happens,
then you just have to change the tension slightly and the flutter will
go away.

When you see flutter, you'll know what it is. It's pretty obvious that
something is wrong because the blade will be vibrating back and forth
as opposed to just running straight down.

Mark

On 27 Jun 2005 11:27:29 -0700, "Mark Wells" wrote:

Suffolk Machinary (Timber Wolf blades) suggests using a "flutter"
method to set the bandsaw tension. They say you should let the tension
off until the blade flutters. In other words, it oscillates back and
forth about 1/4". Then you increase the tension until the flutter is
gone. I found that process very time consuming, and and easy way to
ruin a blade because the tracking can change as you change the tension.

The flutter I'm talking about is that sometimes there can be a harmonic
oscillation in the blade after setting the tension. If that happens,
then you just have to change the tension slightly and the flutter will
go away.

When you see flutter, you'll know what it is. It's pretty obvious that
something is wrong because the blade will be vibrating back and forth
as opposed to just running straight down.

Mark

ok, I'm pretty sure that I understand that, but on the basis of "there are no
stupid questions", I've had both "side to side" movement and forward and
backward" movement.. (improper roller bearing adjustment)..
are these both flutter, or are we talking something else?

BTW: I'm on my way to the saw shop to replace the blade that I broke last night,
trying to make it flutter.. lol


mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

mac davis wrote in
:



On 27 Jun 2005 11:27:29 -0700, "Mark Wells"
wrote:

ok, I'm pretty sure that I understand that, but on the basis of "there
are no stupid questions", I've had both "side to side" movement and
forward and backward" movement.. (improper roller bearing
adjustment).. are these both flutter, or are we talking something
else?

Side to Side. When my blades flutter, you can actually hear them slapping
the sides of the return channel on the left. Pretty loud. It usually
goes away with a turn or two of the tension knob.



BTW: I'm on my way to the saw shop to replace the blade that I broke
last night, trying to make it flutter.. lol


I gave up on the Suffolk Saw flutter approach. I could never find the
flutter spot. In the end, I end up tensioning the blades to the saw's
gauge marks.

On Tue, 28 Jun 2005 17:20:06 GMT, Patrick Conroy
wrote:

mac davis wrote in
:



On 27 Jun 2005 11:27:29 -0700, "Mark Wells"
wrote:

ok, I'm pretty sure that I understand that, but on the basis of "there
are no stupid questions", I've had both "side to side" movement and
forward and backward" movement.. (improper roller bearing
adjustment).. are these both flutter, or are we talking something
else?

Side to Side. When my blades flutter, you can actually hear them slapping
the sides of the return channel on the left. Pretty loud. It usually
goes away with a turn or two of the tension knob.



BTW: I'm on my way to the saw shop to replace the blade that I broke
last night, trying to make it flutter.. lol


I gave up on the Suffolk Saw flutter approach. I could never find the
flutter spot. In the end, I end up tensioning the blades to the saw's
gauge marks.
Thanks, Patrick... I've only had what you describe as flutter once, and it was
(as usual) stupidity on my part... I put a 5/8 blade on and was thinking 3/8
when I set the tension...

I spent a few hours cleaning and setting up the BS yesterday... added cool
blocks and a new blade..
Set it on the line for it's size and starting cutting bowl blanks, and my wife
asked what was wrong with the BS.. it was so much quieter that she thought that
it was messed up..lol


mac

Please remove splinters before emailing