For years I have been putting screws in from the inside of the drawer
and letting their points make impressions on the back side of the false
drawer front that was to be attached. Often it was difficult to see the
impressions and if any thing slipped you started over. Then drill holes
for the pulls and attach.

I new there had to be a better way. There is and it all boils down to
the order I do thingd now. NOW I determine the location of the pulls
and predrill for their screws in the outer false drawer front.
Next I shim the false drawer front to the location I want it to be and
attach the false front to the drawer with screws through the predrilled
drawer pull holes. Open the drawer and place the 4 inside screws that
will be the permanent fasteners for the false drawer front. Remove the
drawer pull screws and finish drilling those holes completely through
and attach your pulls.

Check the attached first try results.

"Leon" lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote in message
Next I shim the false drawer front to the location I want it to be and
attach the false front to the drawer with screws through the predrilled
drawer pull holes. Open the drawer and place the 4 inside screws that
will be the permanent fasteners for the false drawer front. Remove the
drawer pull screws and finish drilling those holes completely through
and attach your pulls.

Ok, that method works well when using false drawer fronts. What method would
you use when you're building drawers that don't have false drawer fronts?
How would you properly align and fasten (or glue) a drawer front directly to
the drawer sides, say when you're using a lock miter bit?

Upscale wrote the following:
"Leon" lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote in message

Next I shim the false drawer front to the location I want it to be and
attach the false front to the drawer with screws through the predrilled
drawer pull holes. Open the drawer and place the 4 inside screws that
will be the permanent fasteners for the false drawer front. Remove the
drawer pull screws and finish drilling those holes completely through
and attach your pulls.


Ok, that method works well when using false drawer fronts. What method would
you use when you're building drawers that don't have false drawer fronts?
How would you properly align and fasten (or glue) a drawer front directly to
the drawer sides, say when you're using a lock miter bit?



Who cares"? He did what he did and it's fine for him, and for me too.
Besides, it was a good way to align the drawer fronts to the drawer,
which can be a bitch..
The drawer fronts look perfectly aligned to me.
He's not making antique furniture.

--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

"willshak" wrote in message
Who cares"? He did what he did and it's fine for him, and for me too.
Besides, it was a good way to align the drawer fronts to the drawer,
which can be a bitch..

As a matter of fact, I care. He had a decent and logical method for when
false drawer fronts are used, I'm hoping he might have an equally good
method for when there are no false drawer fronts.

On Sat, 21 May 2011 11:48:00 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote:

For years I have been putting screws in from the inside of the drawer
and letting their points make impressions on the back side of the false
drawer front that was to be attached. Often it was difficult to see the
impressions and if any thing slipped you started over. Then drill holes
for the pulls and attach.

I new there had to be a better way. There is and it all boils down to
the order I do thingd now. NOW I determine the location of the pulls
and predrill for their screws in the outer false drawer front.
Next I shim the false drawer front to the location I want it to be and
attach the false front to the drawer with screws through the predrilled
drawer pull holes. Open the drawer and place the 4 inside screws that
will be the permanent fasteners for the false drawer front. Remove the
drawer pull screws and finish drilling those holes completely through
and attach your pulls.

Check the attached first try results.

I've almost always done it that way, especially for over-lapping drawer fronts
on metal slides, because of the difficulty of knowing where things will end up
and the "invisibility" behind the over sized front.. You can also do that with
some types of doors on cabinets.

For flush drawers like the ones you show, but without extra fronts, I measure
out a larger front panel and sand it to fit. The idea there is to build it
carefully! I made some little jigs to compensate for the difference between the
drawer front bottom and the side bottom for example, and set the slide blocks
accordingly. Sometimes I use a temporary front as if I had a false front and do
my fitting first, and cut out the real front later and remove the temp one. This
is for non-metal sliders.

My next project uses very fancy silent auto close hidden slides from Hettich,
(Quadro, customer ordered). The drawers will be flush, and everything has to be
precision built... the drawer length and bottom offset and side thickness and
location are all critical to fit on the slide. You place the drawer on the
slides, push it home and it locks in on fancy adjusters. It can be adjusted up
and down a bit but not sideways. The drawer has to lock into 4 things on the
slides.

I'll post some pics as I go along.

Oh by the way - nice job you did!

On 5/21/2011 7:18 PM, Upscale wrote:
"Leon"lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote in message
Next I shim the false drawer front to the location I want it to be and
attach the false front to the drawer with screws through the predrilled
drawer pull holes. Open the drawer and place the 4 inside screws that
will be the permanent fasteners for the false drawer front. Remove the
drawer pull screws and finish drilling those holes completely through
and attach your pulls.

Ok, that method works well when using false drawer fronts. What method would
you use when you're building drawers that don't have false drawer fronts?
How would you properly align and fasten (or glue) a drawer front directly to
the drawer sides, say when you're using a lock miter bit?

When I build an inset drawer, as you say you don't use false drawer
fronts, the drawer front is the front of the drawer.

Biggest problem when using wooden drawer slides with an inset drawer is
that it is generally difficult to get the bottom reveal to match the top
and side reveals because the drawer is sitting on it bottom edges.

Simplest way to do that is to rebate the desired reveal into the bottom
front edge of the drawer front ... a plane is the best tool for this.
That way, when the drawer is sitting on its sides in the opening, the
bottom reveal is always correct.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On 5/21/2011 9:32 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 21 May 2011 11:48:00 -0500, Leonlcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote:

For years I have been putting screws in from the inside of the drawer
and letting their points make impressions on the back side of the false
drawer front that was to be attached. Often it was difficult to see the
impressions and if any thing slipped you started over. Then drill holes
for the pulls and attach.

I new there had to be a better way. There is and it all boils down to
the order I do thingd now. NOW I determine the location of the pulls
and predrill for their screws in the outer false drawer front.
Next I shim the false drawer front to the location I want it to be and
attach the false front to the drawer with screws through the predrilled
drawer pull holes. Open the drawer and place the 4 inside screws that
will be the permanent fasteners for the false drawer front. Remove the
drawer pull screws and finish drilling those holes completely through
and attach your pulls.

Check the attached first try results.

I've almost always done it that way, especially for over-lapping drawer fronts
on metal slides, because of the difficulty of knowing where things will end up
and the "invisibility" behind the over sized front.. You can also do that with
some types of doors on cabinets.

As mention elsewhere we/I have done thing backwards so to speak when
compared to this method. We would put the 4 mounting screws in the
drawer first, point outward towards the false front. We would then
press the fronst against the points of the screws in the desired
location and use those point marks to realign the false fronts to the
screws with the drawers opened and finish screwing the screws into the
false fronts. Not too bad with 4 hands. ;~)


For flush drawers like the ones you show, but without extra fronts, I measure
out a larger front panel and sand it to fit. The idea there is to build it
carefully! I made some little jigs to compensate for the difference between the
drawer front bottom and the side bottom for example, and set the slide blocks
accordingly. Sometimes I use a temporary front as if I had a false front and do
my fitting first, and cut out the real front later and remove the temp one. This
is for non-metal sliders.

A few years ago I built a couple of high end jewelery chests. The
slides were wood and engaged dados on the sides of the drawers, 12 or so
for each chest. I built each drawer to be an exact no gap fit on the
tops and bottoms. I adjusted the fit of each drawer by running them
through the drum sander to remoev a bit off the top and a bit off the
bottom of each drawer to get that uniform spacing look.



My next project uses very fancy silent auto close hidden slides from Hettich,
(Quadro, customer ordered). The drawers will be flush, and everything has to be
precision built... the drawer length and bottom offset and side thickness and
location are all critical to fit on the slide. You place the drawer on the
slides, push it home and it locks in on fancy adjusters. It can be adjusted up
and down a bit but not sideways. The drawer has to lock into 4 things on the
slides.

Swingman and I have used those for several years now in his kitchens and
we have actually switched to a similar type KV slide.
Your are certainly NOT wrong about everything having to be precision
built, the drawers have to be built around the slides.



I'll post some pics as I go along.

Do that!

Oh by the way - nice job you did!

Thank you!. But it was all about finding a more fool proof and simple
way of attaching the fronts, not a lot of skill involved.

On 5/21/2011 7:18 PM, Upscale wrote:
"Leon"lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote in message
Next I shim the false drawer front to the location I want it to be and
attach the false front to the drawer with screws through the predrilled
drawer pull holes. Open the drawer and place the 4 inside screws that
will be the permanent fasteners for the false drawer front. Remove the
drawer pull screws and finish drilling those holes completely through
and attach your pulls.

Ok, that method works well when using false drawer fronts. What method would
you use when you're building drawers that don't have false drawer fronts?
How would you properly align and fasten (or glue) a drawer front directly to
the drawer sides, say when you're using a lock miter bit?



I am not sure I understand the problem. Are you asking how to center
the "box" in the hole, top to bottom using mechanical slides?

If so, my first attempt would probably involve setting the cabinet half
of the slide in the hole, I always try to have a divider between the
drawers to provide a solid surface to index/set the front side of the
slide on.

Then I would put the drawer inside and shim it up from the bottom until
it was centered. I would remove it all and use the same shims to
recreate the spacing on the work bench and mount attach he drawer side
of the slide.

"Leon" lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote in message
Then I would put the drawer inside and shim it up from the bottom until it
was centered. I would remove it all and use the same shims to recreate
the spacing on the work bench and mount attach he drawer side of the
slide.

Ok, I see what you're doing. You build the entire drawer and then align it
to the drawer slides in the hole. My habit was to in effect, assemble the
drawers piece by piece into the hole. Example: install the slides, attach
the drawer sides to the slides, slide in the drawer bottom, then attach the
drawer front. Admittedly, it looks like I've got the assembly process all
skewed (or screwed) up.

Being self taught with most of my woodworking, I've generally used what has
worked in the past for me (even though it appears to be more time consuming)
because I knew that eventually I'd get it installed and working. Obviously
there's always a better method to do something, one just has to go looking
for it.

On 5/22/2011 9:18 AM, Upscale wrote:

Obviously
there's always a better method to do something, one just has to go looking
for it.

We can always learn something new. Just the other day, after at least
50+ years of using this tool, someone young whippersnapper showed me
that you could actually cut small bolts down to size with it!

Duhhhh ... I never looked!!


--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)

Swingman wrote in
:

On 5/22/2011 9:18 AM, Upscale wrote:

Obviously
there's always a better method to do something, one just has to go
looking for it.

We can always learn something new. Just the other day, after at least
50+ years of using this tool, someone young whippersnapper showed me
that you could actually cut small bolts down to size with it!

Duhhhh ... I never looked!!

I'm going to try that right now ...


--
Best regards
Han
email address is invalid

Swingman wrote:
On 5/22/2011 9:18 AM, Upscale wrote:

Obviously
there's always a better method to do something, one just has to go looking
for it.

We can always learn something new. Just the other day, after at least
50+ years of using this tool, someone young whippersnapper showed me
that you could actually cut small bolts down to size with it!

Duhhhh ... I never looked!!



And if you screw it in from the threaded side it straightens out any
mangled threads when you screw the cut bolt back out.

--
Gerald Ross
Cochran, GA

Sing along if you know the words!

Swingman wrote the following:
On 5/22/2011 9:18 AM, Upscale wrote:

Obviously
there's always a better method to do something, one just has to go
looking
for it.

We can always learn something new. Just the other day, after at least
50+ years of using this tool, someone young whippersnapper showed me
that you could actually cut small bolts down to size with it!

Duhhhh ... I never looked!!



------------------------------------------------------------------------


I use that feature more than I use the tool for attaching connectors to
wires.

--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

Gerald Ross wrote the following:
Swingman wrote:
On 5/22/2011 9:18 AM, Upscale wrote:

Obviously
there's always a better method to do something, one just has to go
looking
for it.

We can always learn something new. Just the other day, after at least
50+ years of using this tool, someone young whippersnapper showed me
that you could actually cut small bolts down to size with it!

Duhhhh ... I never looked!!



And if you screw it in from the threaded side it straightens out any
mangled threads when you screw the cut bolt back out.

That's the proper way to use it.

--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

"Swingman" wrote:

We can always learn something new. Just the other day, after at
least
50+ years of using this tool, someone young whippersnapper showed me
that you could actually cut small bolts down to size with it!

Duhhhh ... I never looked!!
--------------------------------------
That's why you are not an electricianG.

BTW, works well for 6-32 & 8-32 BUT you are pushing the limits for a
10-32.

Lew

"Leon" lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote in message
...
For years I have been putting screws in from the inside of the drawer
and letting their points make impressions on the back side of the false
drawer front that was to be attached. Often it was difficult to see the
impressions and if any thing slipped you started over. Then drill holes
for the pulls and attach.

I new there had to be a better way. There is and it all boils down to
the order I do thingd now. NOW I determine the location of the pulls
and predrill for their screws in the outer false drawer front.
Next I shim the false drawer front to the location I want it to be and
attach the false front to the drawer with screws through the predrilled
drawer pull holes. Open the drawer and place the 4 inside screws that
will be the permanent fasteners for the false drawer front. Remove the
drawer pull screws and finish drilling those holes completely through
and attach your pulls.

Check the attached first try results.


Say, Leon, where can I get me some of them plastic shims here in
Houston?

Dave in Houston

"Dave In Texas" wrote in message
Say, Leon, where can I get me some of them plastic shims here in Houston?

Don't know about Houston, but Lee Valley Tools sells them.

http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/pag...17&cat=1,43456

On 5/23/2011 9:22 AM, Dave In Texas wrote:

"Leon" lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote in message
...
For years I have been putting screws in from the inside of the drawer
and letting their points make impressions on the back side of the false
drawer front that was to be attached. Often it was difficult to see the
impressions and if any thing slipped you started over. Then drill holes
for the pulls and attach.

I new there had to be a better way. There is and it all boils down to
the order I do thingd now. NOW I determine the location of the pulls
and predrill for their screws in the outer false drawer front.
Next I shim the false drawer front to the location I want it to be and
attach the false front to the drawer with screws through the predrilled
drawer pull holes. Open the drawer and place the 4 inside screws that
will be the permanent fasteners for the false drawer front. Remove the
drawer pull screws and finish drilling those holes completely through
and attach your pulls.

Check the attached first try results.


Say, Leon, where can I get me some of them plastic shims here in Houston?

Dave in Houston

Rat out'a you mail box! ;~)

I had to order them from Lee Valley. You can order direct from the
manufacturer, http://www.handi-shim.com/ also. But note that the
manufacturer sells a slightly different style shim, apparently the Lee
Valley shims are unique, they are twice as big.
Swingman and I used them extensively on the last kitchen remodel.

On 5/21/2011 11:48 AM, Leon wrote:
For years I have been putting screws in from the inside of the drawer
and letting their points make impressions on the back side of the false
drawer front that was to be attached. Often it was difficult to see the
impressions and if any thing slipped you started over. Then drill holes
for the pulls and attach.

I new there had to be a better way. There is and it all boils down to
the order I do thingd now. NOW I determine the location of the pulls and
predrill for their screws in the outer false drawer front.
Next I shim the false drawer front to the location I want it to be and
attach the false front to the drawer with screws through the predrilled
drawer pull holes. Open the drawer and place the 4 inside screws that
will be the permanent fasteners for the false drawer front. Remove the
drawer pull screws and finish drilling those holes completely through
and attach your pulls.

Check the attached first try results.

Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote:
On 5/23/2011 9:22 AM, Dave In Texas wrote:


Say, Leon, where can I get me some of them plastic shims here in Houston?

Dave in Houston

Rat out'a you mail box! ;~)

I had to order them from Lee Valley. You can order direct from the
manufacturer, http://www.handi-shim.com/ also. But note that the
manufacturer sells a slightly different style shim, apparently the Lee
Valley shims are unique, they are twice as big.
Swingman and I used them extensively on the last kitchen remodel.

Indeed, I got the original batch from Lee Valley. Glad I ordered as many as
I did because I'm always finding another use for them.

--
www.ewoodshop.com

Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote in
:

On 5/21/2011 11:48 AM, Leon wrote:
For years I have been putting screws in from the inside of the drawer
and letting their points make impressions on the back side of the
false drawer front that was to be attached. Often it was difficult to
see the impressions and if any thing slipped you started over. Then
drill holes for the pulls and attach.

I new there had to be a better way. There is and it all boils down to
the order I do thingd now. NOW I determine the location of the pulls
and predrill for their screws in the outer false drawer front.
Next I shim the false drawer front to the location I want it to be
and attach the false front to the drawer with screws through the
predrilled drawer pull holes. Open the drawer and place the 4 inside
screws that will be the permanent fasteners for the false drawer
front. Remove the drawer pull screws and finish drilling those holes
completely through and attach your pulls.

Check the attached first try results.

Gorgeous!!!

--
Best regards
Han
email address is invalid

Screw the screw in from the threaded side, do your cut, then back the screw
off 180 degrees squeeze again, to push the burr back on top of the screw for
a "no file" clean end...


just like the instructions tell us to use it that came with the tool...
or do now.

--------------------
"Gerald Ross" wrote in message
...
And if you screw it in from the threaded side it straightens out any
mangled threads when you screw the cut bolt back out.



---------------------
Swingman wrote:
On 5/22/2011 9:18 AM, Upscale wrote:

Obviously
there's always a better method to do something, one just has to go looking
for it.

We can always learn something new. Just the other day, after at least
50+ years of using this tool, someone young whippersnapper showed me
that you could actually cut small bolts down to size with it!

Duhhhh ... I never looked!!

"Upscale" wrote in message
...

"Dave In Texas" wrote in message
Say, Leon, where can I get me some of them plastic shims here in Houston?

Don't know about Houston, but Lee Valley Tools sells them.

http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/pag...17&cat=1,43456

That'll work. Thanks!

Dave in Houston

"Leon" lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote in message
...

I had to order them from Lee Valley. You can order direct from the
manufacturer, http://www.handi-shim.com/ also. But note that the
manufacturer sells a slightly different style shim, apparently the Lee
Valley shims are unique, they are twice as big.
Swingman and I used them extensively on the last kitchen remodel.

I will, too!

On 5/23/2011 11:10 AM, Han wrote:
Leonlcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote in
:

On 5/21/2011 11:48 AM, Leon wrote:
For years I have been putting screws in from the inside of the drawer
and letting their points make impressions on the back side of the
false drawer front that was to be attached. Often it was difficult to
see the impressions and if any thing slipped you started over. Then
drill holes for the pulls and attach.

I new there had to be a better way. There is and it all boils down to
the order I do thingd now. NOW I determine the location of the pulls
and predrill for their screws in the outer false drawer front.
Next I shim the false drawer front to the location I want it to be
and attach the false front to the drawer with screws through the
predrilled drawer pull holes. Open the drawer and place the 4 inside
screws that will be the permanent fasteners for the false drawer
front. Remove the drawer pull screws and finish drilling those holes
completely through and attach your pulls.

Check the attached first try results.

Gorgeous!!!



Thank you Han