I use a friction polish that is I make by mixing shellac, alcohol and boiled
linseed oil. This mixture has been discussed plenty of times here and in
other resources. My question is what are the trade offs in replacing the
linseed oil with tung oil? I know that tung oil is more expensive, but for
me, $30 would probably buy enough shellac, alcohol and tung oil to have
friction polish for over a year. It seems to me that tung oil has more
desirable properties than BLO. IIRC Tung oil doesn't darken as much as BLO
over time. It's more water resistant and cures harder (relative term, after
all how hard does an oil get). What if any are the disadvantages in using
tung oil instead of BLO?

--
Martin
Long Island, New York

Martin Rost wrote:
I use a friction polish that is I make by mixing shellac, alcohol and boiled
linseed oil. This mixture has been discussed plenty of times here and in
other resources. My question is what are the trade offs in replacing the
linseed oil with tung oil? I know that tung oil is more expensive, but for
me, $30 would probably buy enough shellac, alcohol and tung oil to have
friction polish for over a year. It seems to me that tung oil has more
desirable properties than BLO. IIRC Tung oil doesn't darken as much as BLO
over time. It's more water resistant and cures harder (relative term, after
all how hard does an oil get). What if any are the disadvantages in using
tung oil instead of BLO?

Doubt there's any shortcomings. I use mineral oil usually. Theory is
that the oil floats to the surface when the shellac cures and can be
wiped off. I think it just acts as a lubricant so the shellac doesn't
pill up...

....Kevin
--
Kevin Miller
http://www.alaska.net/~atftb
Juneau, Alaska

"Kevin Miller" wrote in message
...
Martin Rost wrote:
What if any are the disadvantages in using
tung oil instead of BLO?

Doubt there's any shortcomings. I use mineral oil usually. Theory is
that the oil floats to the surface when the shellac cures and can be
wiped off. I think it just acts as a lubricant so the shellac doesn't
pill up...

With the curing oil applied before the piece is sealed, it will color and
cure, unlike your non-curing mineral oil. To minimize coloring from either
oil, seal with straight shellac for a couple of quick coats prior to
friction polishing. Won't take but an hour, tops.

"Kevin Miller" wrote in message
...
Martin Rost wrote:
I use a friction polish that is I make by mixing shellac, alcohol and
boiled
linseed oil. This mixture has been discussed plenty of times here and
in
other resources. My question is what are the trade offs in replacing
the
linseed oil with tung oil? I know that tung oil is more expensive, but
for
me, $30 would probably buy enough shellac, alcohol and tung oil to have
friction polish for over a year. It seems to me that tung oil has more
desirable properties than BLO. IIRC Tung oil doesn't darken as much as
BLO
over time. It's more water resistant and cures harder (relative term,
after
all how hard does an oil get). What if any are the disadvantages in
using
tung oil instead of BLO?

Doubt there's any shortcomings. I use mineral oil usually. Theory is
that the oil floats to the surface when the shellac cures and can be
wiped off. I think it just acts as a lubricant so the shellac doesn't
pill up...

...Kevin
--
Kevin Miller
http://www.alaska.net/~atftb
Juneau, Alaska


I know that the oil acts as a lubricant, and the oil floating to the surface
is how French polishing of furniture is explained, but there they only use a
drop of mineral oil at a time. For a friction polish in turning, the usual
formula is equal parts of alcohol, shellac (3 pound cut - typically what is
sold at the store) and boiled linseed oil. After the alcohol evaporates
(what you added and what was in the shellac), more than half of the finish
is the BLO. I find it hard to believe that this is all being wiped away.
May it is.

--
Martin
Long Island, New York

"Martin Rost" wrote: (clip) more than half of the finish is the BLO. I find
it hard to believe that this is all being wiped away. May it is.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I agree. If the oil is going to be wiped away, it would matter very little
which oil is used in the original mix--in fact I would expect non-drying
oils to be preferable. I don't KNOW, but I think that by drying first, the
shellac acts as a binder, allowing the finish to be handled while the oil
continues to cure. If that is true, then this type of finish should become
more durable over time.

George wrote:
"Kevin Miller" wrote in message
...
Martin Rost wrote:
What if any are the disadvantages in using
tung oil instead of BLO?
Doubt there's any shortcomings. I use mineral oil usually. Theory is
that the oil floats to the surface when the shellac cures and can be
wiped off. I think it just acts as a lubricant so the shellac doesn't
pill up...

With the curing oil applied before the piece is sealed, it will color and
cure, unlike your non-curing mineral oil. To minimize coloring from either
oil, seal with straight shellac for a couple of quick coats prior to
friction polishing. Won't take but an hour, tops.

For a sealer coat you don't normally want to use straight shellac - from
the can it's about a #3 cut. Sealer coats are usually #1 cut or less so
they penetrate and fill the pores a bit. A #3 cut will build on the
surface.

I haven't really noticed a significant difference in discoloration
between the shellac and the oil. Shellac is usually so yellow anyway
that it has more effect than the oil if anything.

I like the mineral oil, as it's food safe - sold as an 'intestinal
lubricant'. Many will argue that any finish is food safe after fully
cured. I won't disagree with that. But I know there's no japan driers
in mineral oil. Not so with BLO, or Tung Oil (unless they're 100%
Linseed Oil or Tung Oil, in which case they're more or less in the
non-curing camp along with the MO). When my customers ask me, I can
tell them w/good conscience that the oil is safe for human consumption...


....Kevin
--
Kevin Miller
http://www.alaska.net/~atftb
Juneau, Alaska

Martin Rost wrote:

I know that the oil acts as a lubricant, and the oil floating to the surface
is how French polishing of furniture is explained, but there they only use a
drop of mineral oil at a time. For a friction polish in turning, the usual
formula is equal parts of alcohol, shellac (3 pound cut - typically what is
sold at the store) and boiled linseed oil. After the alcohol evaporates
(what you added and what was in the shellac), more than half of the finish
is the BLO. I find it hard to believe that this is all being wiped away.
May it is.

I've always sort of wondered about that too. I think some gets absorbed
into the wood too. If it leaches in one dirction it must in the other
as well by my way of thinking.

When I use shellac, I don't actually use the old 1:1:1 formula. I
usually rub some MO into the wood, then use the same cloth or paper
towel to wipe on the shellac, let that sit a few minutes, wipe off the
excess then spin it up, buffing w/the same applicator. Friction dried
it pretty fast. Sometimes it'll take a couple applications. Depending
on a very scientific principle, called a 'whim', I may decant a bit of
shellac off to a disposable container and add a bit of oil - just a
dollup, probably nothing close to a third or half.

I think the lubrication is the important quality, and it doesn't really
take much to achieve that...

....Kevin
--
Kevin Miller
http://www.alaska.net/~atftb
Juneau, Alaska

"Kevin Miller" wrote in message
...
George wrote:
"Kevin Miller" wrote in message
...


For a sealer coat you don't normally want to use straight shellac - from
the can it's about a #3 cut. Sealer coats are usually #1 cut or less so
they penetrate and fill the pores a bit. A #3 cut will build on the
surface.

I haven't really noticed a significant difference in discoloration
between the shellac and the oil. Shellac is usually so yellow anyway
that it has more effect than the oil if anything.

I like the mineral oil, as it's food safe - sold as an 'intestinal
lubricant'. Many will argue that any finish is food safe after fully
cured. I won't disagree with that. But I know there's no japan driers
in mineral oil. Not so with BLO, or Tung Oil (unless they're 100%
Linseed Oil or Tung Oil, in which case they're more or less in the
non-curing camp along with the MO). When my customers ask me, I can
tell them w/good conscience that the oil is safe for human consumption...


"Straight" as with no oil, and as I mix my own , I use a 1# cut. If you're
getting as much color from your shellac as with a mix, try a different
shellac. I shop with Russ http://www.woodfinishingsupplies.com/ and have
been satisfied with both product and service.

I guess you don't want to hear how a cured oil makes it possible to wash
away bacterial contamination, while an uncured oil shelters same for as long
as it's present.

I tell my customers not to eat the bowl.

George wrote:
"Kevin Miller" wrote in message
...
George wrote:
"Kevin Miller" wrote in message
...

For a sealer coat you don't normally want to use straight shellac - from
the can it's about a #3 cut. Sealer coats are usually #1 cut or less so
they penetrate and fill the pores a bit. A #3 cut will build on the
surface.

I haven't really noticed a significant difference in discoloration
between the shellac and the oil. Shellac is usually so yellow anyway
that it has more effect than the oil if anything.

I like the mineral oil, as it's food safe - sold as an 'intestinal
lubricant'. Many will argue that any finish is food safe after fully
cured. I won't disagree with that. But I know there's no japan driers
in mineral oil. Not so with BLO, or Tung Oil (unless they're 100%
Linseed Oil or Tung Oil, in which case they're more or less in the
non-curing camp along with the MO). When my customers ask me, I can
tell them w/good conscience that the oil is safe for human consumption...


"Straight" as with no oil, and as I mix my own , I use a 1# cut. If you're

Oh, ok. Just wanted to clarify for folks that haven't used much shellac
before since most people would probably just use it straight from the can.

getting as much color from your shellac as with a mix, try a different
shellac. I shop with Russ http://www.woodfinishingsupplies.com/ and have
been satisfied with both product and service.

Unlike vegitable based oils like linseed or tung, mineral oil is clear.
My current batch of shellac is platina which is a very light colored
shellac. Thanks for the link - I got the platina from O'Deen way back
when and am getting low. It's probably similar to the ultra on Russ'
page. Never seen/used the bleached before.


I guess you don't want to hear how a cured oil makes it possible to wash
away bacterial contamination, while an uncured oil shelters same for as long
as it's present.

I'm always open to new information. May or may not adopt a particular
stance, but the more knowledge to evaluate the better. Not sure that
mineral oil is really conducive to bacteral retainment, it being a
petroleum product, not a vegitable oil. It also evaporates over time
I'm told. Since the shellac forms a film finish over the wood (with or
w/o oil mixed in) I wouldn't expect much bacteria to be present assuming
that the bowl is cleaned after use. The shellac is the primary finish
after all.


I tell my customers not to eat the bowl.

Good comeback! g Hopefully they follow that advice!

....Kevin
--
Kevin Miller
http://www.alaska.net/~atftb
Juneau, Alaska

Kevin Miller wrote in
:

snip
My current batch of shellac is platina which is a very light colored
shellac. Thanks for the link - I got the platina from O'Deen way back
when and am getting low. It's probably similar to the ultra on Russ'
page. Never seen/used the bleached before.


I needed some to match the platina, and ended up buying from Homestead.
Got the German ultra pale, both in flake and liquid.

A quart of the liquid, in a five lb cut, is _very_ convenient, when what I
want is 4 ounces of 1.5 lb in a squeeze bottle, and right quick.

Patriarch