Home |
Search |
Today's Posts |
|
Woodturning (rec.crafts.woodturning) To discuss tools, techniques, styles, materials, shows and competitions, education and educational materials related to woodturning. All skill levels are welcome, from art turners to production turners, beginners to masters. |
Reply |
|
LinkBack | Thread Tools | Display Modes |
#1
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
Hi folks. I just purchased a Jet Mini Lathe. I have a question that some of
you might find silly but what the heck. The instructions that came with the lathe are not very clear. I would like to know if you can, and if so how, do you attach a Jacobs Chuck or drill chuck to the tailstock of the lathe? I can get the tail stock spindle out, and the center for the live center will pop out, but after that I am lost completely. Can any one help a complete newbie out here? Thank You, Al |
#2
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
"AWood70928" wrote: (clip) how, do you attach a Jacobs Chuck or drill chuck to the tailstock of the lathe? (clip) ^^^^^^^^^ Does your Jacobs chuck have a Morse taper on it? That's what you need. Just slip it into the tailstock the same way you insert your live center, or any other gadget. |
#3
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
You should be able to purchase a screw in taper shaft that would match a
Jacobs or other chuck. Take your live center to any regular machine shop and they can identify the taper No. in order that the one you buy will fit in your tailstock. They may even cite you a source. -- Chipper Wood useours, yours won't work "AWood70928" wrote in message ... Hi folks. I just purchased a Jet Mini Lathe. I have a question that some of you might find silly but what the heck. The instructions that came with the lathe are not very clear. I would like to know if you can, and if so how, do you attach a Jacobs Chuck or drill chuck to the tailstock of the lathe? I can get the tail stock spindle out, and the center for the live center will pop out, but after that I am lost completely. Can any one help a complete newbie out here? Thank You, Al |
#4
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
The piece you remove from the tailstock with the live center on it
should be a tapered piece (I'll call it a "morse taper" within the text of this post so the purists don't beat me to death with the proper termG). Sears (for example) sells a threaded morse taper that you can install a Jacobs chuck on, then slide back into the tapered hole in your Jet Mini tailstock. Take your old morse taper with you so you get the right one, probably a #1 or #2 morse taper. I paid $12.99 for mine at Sears & $4.99 for a Jacobs key chuck @ Harbor Freight. Grandpa AWood70928 wrote: Hi folks. I just purchased a Jet Mini Lathe. I have a question that some of you might find silly but what the heck. The instructions that came with the lathe are not very clear. I would like to know if you can, and if so how, do you attach a Jacobs Chuck or drill chuck to the tailstock of the lathe? I can get the tail stock spindle out, and the center for the live center will pop out, but after that I am lost completely. |
#5
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
I can't thank you all enough. I was having a fit trying to figure out how to
get the Live Center out of the tail stock spindle. Anyway, I got home from work tonight and took another look at it and used a wood dowl and hit it with a rubber mallet and it poped right out. Now I can go get a drill chuck. Thanks again. Al |
#6
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
A kinder, gentler way to remove the tailstock center is to use the handwheel
to retract the tailstock quill until the center drops out...............Barry "AWood70928" wrote in message ... I can't thank you all enough. I was having a fit trying to figure out how to get the Live Center out of the tail stock spindle. Anyway, I got home from work tonight and took another look at it and used a wood dowl and hit it with a rubber mallet and it poped right out. Now I can go get a drill chuck. Thanks again. Al |
#7
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
While this certainly does work for this brand lathe, it doesn't work for all
lathes. Not all of them have this auto-eject feature. Just a heads-up for the new lathe owners out there. - Andrew "Barry N. Turner" wrote in message ... A kinder, gentler way to remove the tailstock center is to use the handwheel to retract the tailstock quill until the center drops out...............Barry |
#8
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
Or with every taper. Some are not long enough to self-eject. Fortunately,
a bit of time with some brass or aluminum and a lathe will produce an extension to make a non-ejector into an ejector. "AHilton" wrote in message news While this certainly does work for this brand lathe, it doesn't work for all lathes. Not all of them have this auto-eject feature. Just a heads-up for the new lathe owners out there. - Andrew "Barry N. Turner" wrote in message ... A kinder, gentler way to remove the tailstock center is to use the handwheel to retract the tailstock quill until the center drops out...............Barry |
#9
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
Dummied up on the buttons. Also want to mention the wedge method, where a
piece of wood is placed between the edge of the chuck and the tailstock, popping it out as the wheel is rotated to retract. "George" george@least wrote in message ... Or with every taper. Some are not long enough to self-eject. Fortunately, a bit of time with some brass or aluminum and a lathe will produce an extension to make a non-ejector into an ejector. "AHilton" wrote in message news While this certainly does work for this brand lathe, it doesn't work for all lathes. Not all of them have this auto-eject feature. "Barry N. Turner" wrote in message ... A kinder, gentler way to remove the tailstock center is to use the handwheel to retract the tailstock quill until the center drops out...............Barry |
#10
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
Wanna borrow my egg rag? I always keep one handy................Barry
"I Hunt Predators" wrote in message ... Ah Ha. And said with so much tact too Never once called me a gorilla I will give that suggestion a try. Sounds a lot easier on the equipment. Live and learn. I always keep a rag handy to wipe the egg off my face. Thanks. |
#11
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
True........but it works on Jet Mini Lathes...........
"AHilton" wrote in message news While this certainly does work for this brand lathe, it doesn't work for all lathes. Not all of them have this auto-eject feature. Just a heads-up for the new lathe owners out there. - Andrew "Barry N. Turner" wrote in message ... A kinder, gentler way to remove the tailstock center is to use the handwheel to retract the tailstock quill until the center drops out...............Barry |
#12
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
Ummmmm ..... yeeeessssssss. As my statement of "While this certainly does
work for this brand lathe" should have alluded to. At least I had hoped it would have. - Andrew "Barry N. Turner" wrote in message ... True........but it works on Jet Mini Lathes........... "AHilton" wrote in message news While this certainly does work for this brand lathe, it doesn't work for all lathes. Not all of them have this auto-eject feature. Just a heads-up for the new lathe owners out there. - Andrew "Barry N. Turner" wrote in message ... A kinder, gentler way to remove the tailstock center is to use the handwheel to retract the tailstock quill until the center drops out...............Barry |
#13
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
al:
on many NEW jet minis, backing out the live center using the hand wheel will be a bit tough for the first time ... put the live center back in and try popping it out with the hand wheel ....just keep turning and it will pop. "AWood70928" wrote in message ... I can't thank you all enough. I was having a fit trying to figure out how to get the Live Center out of the tail stock spindle. Anyway, I got home from work tonight and took another look at it and used a wood dowl and hit it with a rubber mallet and it poped right out. Now I can go get a drill chuck. Thanks again. Al |
#14
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
This doesn't work on all MT-2s. I have one Live Center that it
doesn't work on - The taper has to be long enough to reach the eject device. mike http://mike.vorefamily.net/twr On Sat, 19 Jun 2004 10:40:06 -0500, AHilton wrote: While this certainly does work for this brand lathe, it doesn't work for all lathes. Not all of them have this auto-eject feature. Just a heads-up for the new lathe owners out there. - Andrew "Barry N. Turner" wrote in message ... A kinder, gentler way to remove the tailstock center is to use the handwheel to retract the tailstock quill until the center drops out...............Barry |
#15
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
That must be a pretty short live center taper! Good point though. How long
is that taper you're talking about? I have a couple of tapers on devices for the tailstock that are too long. Not that they don't auto-eject but that they take up an additional 1.5" of tailstock travel that they really shouldn't have to. One of them is on a Jacobs' chuck. When I get some more time, I'll hack off a bit of that taper but I don't want to go too short either. - Andrew "Mike" wrote in message news This doesn't work on all MT-2s. I have one Live Center that it doesn't work on - The taper has to be long enough to reach the eject device. mike http://mike.vorefamily.net/twr |
#16
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
Nope. Think about it. If they're designed to be able to bore through them,
they'll lack the self-ejector. That's why I mentioned two methods of extraction. For example, the Nova is a non-ejector. "AHilton" wrote in message ... That must be a pretty short live center taper! Good point though. How long is that taper you're talking about? |
#17
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
!) What does your comment have to do with the quote from my message
concerning the length of a particular live center taper? 2) Why would the ability to bore through the tailstock negate the self-ejector feature of a piece of equipment (live center for example) inserted into it's morse taper? I personally have a few lathes where all are designed to bore through the tailstock and some are self-ejectors and some are not. No problems boring through the tailstocks on any of them. Or are you talking about the live center itself? I don't see where that would be relevant either as that piece of equipment doesn't have anything to do (except, obviously, it's length) with a "self-ejector" feature. Please explain yourself. - Andrew "George" george@least wrote in message ... Nope. Think about it. If they're designed to be able to bore through them, they'll lack the self-ejector. That's why I mentioned two methods of extraction. For example, the Nova is a non-ejector. "AHilton" wrote in message ... That must be a pretty short live center taper! Good point though. How long is that taper you're talking about? |
#18
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
You probably have noticed, at least once, that the self-ejecting feature is
an extension beyond the ~ 3/8 diameter portion of the #2 taper. Now, read carefully - with some centers you can bore through the CENTER , not just the tailstock, gaining extra stabilization for the piece. I even mentioned one of the type. This, unfortunately requires the center be shorter to accommodate the hollow. I have already mentioned two ways to overcome the (pun intended) shortcomings of such centers in this thread. You also use the hole in the Nova to knock out the various end appliances. There are also solid tapers, I think most I've seen are the 60 point degree metalworking kind, with no self ejection which respond similarly to the extraction methods I mentioned. The chuck which was the subject of this thread - not Andy's offended sense of importance - was probably designed to be used in one of the Taiwan drillpresses, and therefore lacks the ejection tang. "AHilton" wrote in message ... !) What does your comment have to do with the quote from my message concerning the length of a particular live center taper? 2) Why would the ability to bore through the tailstock negate the self-ejector feature of a piece of equipment (live center for example) inserted into it's morse taper? I personally have a few lathes where all are designed to bore through the tailstock and some are self-ejectors and some are not. No problems boring through the tailstocks on any of them. Or are you talking about the live center itself? I don't see where that would be relevant either as that piece of equipment doesn't have anything to do (except, obviously, it's length) with a "self-ejector" feature. Please explain yourself. - Andrew "George" george@least wrote in message ... Nope. Think about it. If they're designed to be able to bore through them, they'll lack the self-ejector. That's why I mentioned two methods of extraction. For example, the Nova is a non-ejector. "AHilton" wrote in message ... That must be a pretty short live center taper! Good point though. How long is that taper you're talking about? |
#19
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
Now, ALL of this self-ejector talk is assuming something big. There have
been a couple of different self-ejector mechanisms that I've seen on lathes. I'm mainly talking about the mechanism that fits into the female morse taper in the tailstock. The female morse taper, as it is extended and retracted, rides over/around the self-ejector which stays stationary deep inside. As the tailstock-fitting device (live center in this case) is moving toward the self-ejector, it hits it and causes the live center to stop ... but the female taper of the tailstock keeps going back a slight bit depending on how long the live centers' taper is. This process ejects the live center. Like I said, there are a couple of other mechanisms that I've seen (albeit on just a couple of older and fairly custom machines) so much of this talk may not be relavent to your exact lathe. Just so there's no (or at least less) misunderstanding in what we're talking about here. Comments inline below... You probably have noticed, at least once, that the self-ejecting feature is an extension beyond the ~ 3/8 diameter portion of the #2 taper. Well, actually, no. Some tailstock fitting devices have this extension, which isn't part of the taper of that device, and some do not. The live center that came with my Jet Mini doesn't have any extension, for instance, and it ejects just fine. As long as the taper OR the taper/extension is long enough, then it'll self-eject in a tailstock designed for it. It's the design of the tailstock AND the length of the tailstock fitting device (just the taper or the taper + any extension on the end of it) that determines if a device is going to self-eject or not. If the tailstock isn't designed to self-eject devices, then it won't no matter how long of a devices' taper or taper/extension. So, the "self ejecting feature" is a product of the lathe itself and not the device that fits into it. But, again and for clarity (not to mention repetition), the tailstock fitting devices' taper or taper/extension MUST be long enough to hit up against that tailstock feature. "Now, read carefully..." Ohhhh, I do try to and ask actual questions (that I, amazingly, would like answers to) when I don't feel like I have understood what was being said. Otherwise, misunderstandings and personal attacks (see below) can ensue. Now, read carefully - with some centers you can bore through the CENTER , not just the tailstock, gaining extra stabilization for the piece. I even Absolutely. I'm with you here. mentioned one of the type. This, unfortunately requires the center be shorter to accommodate the hollow. I have already mentioned two ways to You lost me here. Why must the center (I assume you mean the taper of the live center) be shorter in that case? Do you mean that the taper must be shorter so that you can crank the live center closer to the tailstock and not be sticking out so far? If so, then why would that matter? In many lathes, you're only talking 1/4" of an inch difference between either ejecting the taper fitting device (in this case a live center with a boring hole) and fully seating the tailstock to full retraction. Or perhaps (and I think this is it) you're talking about a tailstock that will allow 3/8" diameter boring, for example. If the taper of a center that allows boring through it had an extra long morse taper on it, then it might not allow a 3/8" hole to be through it. You could fit the 3/8" bit in the tailstock but it wouldn't fit into the centers' hole. So, to overcome this, the taper on the center is shortened up to allow that 3/8" hole through it. Is that right? Assuming that that is what you're talking about.... So what? That's just a design mistake of the lathe manufacturer by mismatching the boring hole of the tailstock to the size of the female morse taper of it (having a 1/2" boring hole with a morse taper #1 for instance g) AND the length of the morse taper before it hits the self ejecting feature of the tailstock when it's fully retracted if that's a feature of the lathe (to make this more relevant to this thread). If the manufacturer gets their design right, then any tailstock device with a boring hole that matches the tailstock boring hole (say 3/8" for both) will both fit the female taper of the tailstock AND the tailstock fitting device will self eject (given that the tailstock itself has that feature in the first place) AND be able to use the full boring diameter of the tailstock and the center. You can certainly have a center with a boring hole of, say, 1/2" fitted into a (properly designed as per above) tailstock with a boring hole of 3/8" where the center will be shorter to accomodate that larger diameter through-hole. And it might not auto-eject, that's true. It's not the fault of the tailstock. It's the fault of the person using the wrong center for the lathe! If you're not going to use a properly matching center to your lathe, then you can't expect everything to work out. The auto-eject feature of the tailstock might be that failure. You're not going to be boring a 1/2" hole through the 3/8" tailstock hole even if the center accomodates it. g So, assuming that I deduced what you were actually talking about in the quote from your email above correctly, your answer to my question of... "Why would the ability to bore through the tailstock negate the self-ejector feature of a piece of equipment (live center for example) inserted into it's morse taper?" would be that of length of the centers' morse taper. And considering the statement just after the one quoted above by me.... "Or are you talking about the live center itself? I don't see where that would be relevant either as that piece of equipment doesn't have anything to do (except, obviously, it's length) with a "self-ejector" feature. Please explain yourself." Those questions of mine were directed to you as per your statement of... "Nope. Think about it. If they're designed to be able to bore through them, they'll lack the self-ejector." Reading your last statement of: "used in one of the Taiwan drillpresses, and therefore lacks the ejection tang" got me to thinking (and coming back up here to insert this) that because you believe that a lathe tailstock "auto-eject" feature is the same as found on some drillpresses, the live center/Jacobs Chuck/whatever it is must be the one with the feature instead of the tailstock, right? Perhaps this is much of the misundertanding. So, the centers' that I have that allow boring through them won't self-eject as per the above quote of yours? Hmmmm amazing! Let's take a quick and easy example of a Jet Mini with the live center that came with it. It's right in front of me and many people have one so I'll use that. I pop out the sharp point and put the center into the tailstock taper. I then slide a 12" long, 3/8" diameter bit through the tailstock and through the center. So far so good. BUT, will the center self-eject? Yep. It does. Need a picture to verify? Not being mean ... just don't want there to be any misunderstanding. Should I try a few more lathes and centers? I have no doubt that I can find a couple of combinations where it won't work. But, by and large for the standard equipment lathes that I have access to, they'll work just like the Jet Mini in my test. So, it does appear that not all centers that are "designed to be able to bore through them" will lack a self-ejector feature. Of course, as I explained above, it's not the tailstock fitting device (live center or Jacobs Chuck in this case) that has that "feature" although it must have enough length for that tailstock feature to engage it.. overcome the (pun intended) shortcomings of such centers in this thread. And those were fine recommendations. You also use the hole in the Nova to knock out the various end appliances. There are also solid tapers, I think most I've seen are the 60 point degree metalworking kind, with no self ejection which respond similarly to the extraction methods I mentioned. Yes, I have a few of those as well. No problems self-ejecting here. Different models and lengths and tailstock designs are the culprits. As long as they are long enough (taper or taper/extension on it) to hit that self eject feature of the tailstock then it'll work. "The chuck which was the subject of this thread - not Andy's offended sense of importance -" Yet more trolling by George. *sigh* My only sense of importance comes internally from helping people and trying to give them the best information possible whether it's from me or directing them to another resource. NOT from just trolling newsgroups looking for a fight or lobbing personal attacks and cowering away from real questions. If a person can provide different opinions, evidence or experience then I am all for it. Just don't expect to not get called on it. I am not easily offended and you've not even come close. I've been through 18 years of Usenet, FIDOnet, Craig-soft, GlassRoomnet, and other online forum trolls that were far far worse than you. It still saddens me, though, that such things and people still exist. I have nothing to prove and everything of myself to offer in what limited areas of expertise that I have fought to learn. I have much to learn in many many fields of study, not the least of which is woodturning. As much as I wish the online forums to educate and inform me, I want even more for those that are just starting out to have accurate and helpful information to help them. "was probably designed to be used in one of the Taiwan drillpresses, and therefore lacks the ejection tang." Perhaps this is where you are erroneously extrapolating your views from? The ejection from most drillpresses is far different than from a "self-ejection" feature on a tailstock. No need for that "tang" on the end of some Jacobs Chuck morse tapers on a wood lathe tailstock. In fact, I'm going to go cut the one on one of mine off because it's not needed on the lathes I work on. It just makes the whole thing too big. - Andrew |
#20
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
AHilton wrote:
Now, ALL of this self-ejector talk is assuming something big. There have been a couple of different self-ejector mechanisms that I've seen on lathes. I'm mainly talking about the mechanism that fits into the female morse taper in the tailstock. The female morse taper, as it is extended and retracted, rides over/around the self-ejector which stays stationary deep inside. As the tailstock-fitting device (live center in this case) is moving toward the self-ejector, it hits it and causes the live center to stop ... but the female taper of the tailstock keeps going back a slight bit depending on how long the live centers' taper is. This process ejects the live center. Like I said, there are a couple of other mechanisms that I've seen (albeit on just a couple of older and fairly custom machines) so much of this talk may not be relavent to your exact lathe. Just so there's no (or at least less) misunderstanding in what we're talking about here. Just to clarify, and simplify matters here-- 1.) The "self-ejector" you speak of is nothing more than the end of the tailstock's feed screw which hits the end of the morse taper shank when the tailstock ram is retracted. 2.) If a tailstock center is hollow, and the hole is bigger than the screw, then of course it won't eject. 3.) The extension at the end of many morse tapers is called the tang, it fits in a slot inside the drillpress spindle to hold the shank from rotating in the spindle. Ken Grunke SW Wisconsin http://www.token.crwoodturner.com/ Member, Coulee Region Woodturners AAW chapter http://www.crwoodturner.com/ Comments inline below... You probably have noticed, at least once, that the self-ejecting feature is an extension beyond the ~ 3/8 diameter portion of the #2 taper. Well, actually, no. Some tailstock fitting devices have this extension, which isn't part of the taper of that device, and some do not. The live center that came with my Jet Mini doesn't have any extension, for instance, and it ejects just fine. As long as the taper OR the taper/extension is long enough, then it'll self-eject in a tailstock designed for it. It's the design of the tailstock AND the length of the tailstock fitting device (just the taper or the taper + any extension on the end of it) that determines if a device is going to self-eject or not. If the tailstock isn't designed to self-eject devices, then it won't no matter how long of a devices' taper or taper/extension. So, the "self ejecting feature" is a product of the lathe itself and not the device that fits into it. But, again and for clarity (not to mention repetition), the tailstock fitting devices' taper or taper/extension MUST be long enough to hit up against that tailstock feature. "Now, read carefully..." Ohhhh, I do try to and ask actual questions (that I, amazingly, would like answers to) when I don't feel like I have understood what was being said. Otherwise, misunderstandings and personal attacks (see below) can ensue. Now, read carefully - with some centers you can bore through the CENTER , not just the tailstock, gaining extra stabilization for the piece. I even Absolutely. I'm with you here. mentioned one of the type. This, unfortunately requires the center be shorter to accommodate the hollow. I have already mentioned two ways to You lost me here. Why must the center (I assume you mean the taper of the live center) be shorter in that case? Do you mean that the taper must be shorter so that you can crank the live center closer to the tailstock and not be sticking out so far? If so, then why would that matter? In many lathes, you're only talking 1/4" of an inch difference between either ejecting the taper fitting device (in this case a live center with a boring hole) and fully seating the tailstock to full retraction. Or perhaps (and I think this is it) you're talking about a tailstock that will allow 3/8" diameter boring, for example. If the taper of a center that allows boring through it had an extra long morse taper on it, then it might not allow a 3/8" hole to be through it. You could fit the 3/8" bit in the tailstock but it wouldn't fit into the centers' hole. So, to overcome this, the taper on the center is shortened up to allow that 3/8" hole through it. Is that right? Assuming that that is what you're talking about.... So what? That's just a design mistake of the lathe manufacturer by mismatching the boring hole of the tailstock to the size of the female morse taper of it (having a 1/2" boring hole with a morse taper #1 for instance g) AND the length of the morse taper before it hits the self ejecting feature of the tailstock when it's fully retracted if that's a feature of the lathe (to make this more relevant to this thread). If the manufacturer gets their design right, then any tailstock device with a boring hole that matches the tailstock boring hole (say 3/8" for both) will both fit the female taper of the tailstock AND the tailstock fitting device will self eject (given that the tailstock itself has that feature in the first place) AND be able to use the full boring diameter of the tailstock and the center. You can certainly have a center with a boring hole of, say, 1/2" fitted into a (properly designed as per above) tailstock with a boring hole of 3/8" where the center will be shorter to accomodate that larger diameter through-hole. And it might not auto-eject, that's true. It's not the fault of the tailstock. It's the fault of the person using the wrong center for the lathe! If you're not going to use a properly matching center to your lathe, then you can't expect everything to work out. The auto-eject feature of the tailstock might be that failure. You're not going to be boring a 1/2" hole through the 3/8" tailstock hole even if the center accomodates it. g So, assuming that I deduced what you were actually talking about in the quote from your email above correctly, your answer to my question of... "Why would the ability to bore through the tailstock negate the self-ejector feature of a piece of equipment (live center for example) inserted into it's morse taper?" would be that of length of the centers' morse taper. And considering the statement just after the one quoted above by me.... "Or are you talking about the live center itself? I don't see where that would be relevant either as that piece of equipment doesn't have anything to do (except, obviously, it's length) with a "self-ejector" feature. Please explain yourself." Those questions of mine were directed to you as per your statement of... "Nope. Think about it. If they're designed to be able to bore through them, they'll lack the self-ejector." Reading your last statement of: "used in one of the Taiwan drillpresses, and therefore lacks the ejection tang" got me to thinking (and coming back up here to insert this) that because you believe that a lathe tailstock "auto-eject" feature is the same as found on some drillpresses, the live center/Jacobs Chuck/whatever it is must be the one with the feature instead of the tailstock, right? Perhaps this is much of the misundertanding. So, the centers' that I have that allow boring through them won't self-eject as per the above quote of yours? Hmmmm amazing! Let's take a quick and easy example of a Jet Mini with the live center that came with it. It's right in front of me and many people have one so I'll use that. I pop out the sharp point and put the center into the tailstock taper. I then slide a 12" long, 3/8" diameter bit through the tailstock and through the center. So far so good. BUT, will the center self-eject? Yep. It does. Need a picture to verify? Not being mean ... just don't want there to be any misunderstanding. Should I try a few more lathes and centers? I have no doubt that I can find a couple of combinations where it won't work. But, by and large for the standard equipment lathes that I have access to, they'll work just like the Jet Mini in my test. So, it does appear that not all centers that are "designed to be able to bore through them" will lack a self-ejector feature. Of course, as I explained above, it's not the tailstock fitting device (live center or Jacobs Chuck in this case) that has that "feature" although it must have enough length for that tailstock feature to engage it.. overcome the (pun intended) shortcomings of such centers in this thread. And those were fine recommendations. You also use the hole in the Nova to knock out the various end appliances. There are also solid tapers, I think most I've seen are the 60 point degree metalworking kind, with no self ejection which respond similarly to the extraction methods I mentioned. Yes, I have a few of those as well. No problems self-ejecting here. Different models and lengths and tailstock designs are the culprits. As long as they are long enough (taper or taper/extension on it) to hit that self eject feature of the tailstock then it'll work. "The chuck which was the subject of this thread - not Andy's offended sense of importance -" Yet more trolling by George. *sigh* My only sense of importance comes internally from helping people and trying to give them the best information possible whether it's from me or directing them to another resource. NOT from just trolling newsgroups looking for a fight or lobbing personal attacks and cowering away from real questions. If a person can provide different opinions, evidence or experience then I am all for it. Just don't expect to not get called on it. I am not easily offended and you've not even come close. I've been through 18 years of Usenet, FIDOnet, Craig-soft, GlassRoomnet, and other online forum trolls that were far far worse than you. It still saddens me, though, that such things and people still exist. I have nothing to prove and everything of myself to offer in what limited areas of expertise that I have fought to learn. I have much to learn in many many fields of study, not the least of which is woodturning. As much as I wish the online forums to educate and inform me, I want even more for those that are just starting out to have accurate and helpful information to help them. "was probably designed to be used in one of the Taiwan drillpresses, and therefore lacks the ejection tang." Perhaps this is where you are erroneously extrapolating your views from? The ejection from most drillpresses is far different than from a "self-ejection" feature on a tailstock. No need for that "tang" on the end of some Jacobs Chuck morse tapers on a wood lathe tailstock. In fact, I'm going to go cut the one on one of mine off because it's not needed on the lathes I work on. It just makes the whole thing too big. - Andrew Ken Grunke SW Wisconsin http://www.token.crwoodturner.com/ Member, Coulee Region Woodturners AAW chapter http://www.crwoodturner.com/ -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =----- |
#21
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
Just to clarify, and simplify matters here--
Well, sort-of g The way I read your description of 1 and 2 below is yet another version of a self-ejector mechanism. Your description suggests that the only part of the tailstock "screw", as you call it, that hits the end of the live center (I'll just use this example from now on to make it easier) is at the center (of whatever diameter) of it's end shank. Is that a correct reading of your comments below? If you have a hole in the bored live center that's bigger than that mechanism, then I can certainly see the live center passing right over it. This, of course, doesn't mean that every live center that has a hole bored through it will not self-eject as George blanketly stated. What I'm talking about is what's most often found these days and that's where the self-ejector mechanism acts very much the same but makes contact with the outermost ring of the live center end shank. It doesn't matter what size hole is bored (within reason ... you *could* have a 1mm sliver of metal ring and it might slip past the mechanism a little but eventually the taper would catch up to it and hit the mechanism anyway g) into that live center as long as the shank is long enough to reach that self-ejector mechanism when retracting the whole thing. The essence of it is the same (retracting causes what's inside the morse taper to stop retracting with the rest of the female morse taper) but it's the details that matter most and affects what will and what will not self-eject. Can you provide a picture or drawing of the exact mechanism? I'll do the same of at least one version of self-ejector tailstock mechanism that I've worked with on wood lathes and post it on abpw. Then we can compare. - Andrew 1.) The "self-ejector" you speak of is nothing more than the end of the tailstock's feed screw which hits the end of the morse taper shank when the tailstock ram is retracted. 2.) If a tailstock center is hollow, and the hole is bigger than the screw, then of course it won't eject. 3.) The extension at the end of many morse tapers is called the tang, it fits in a slot inside the drillpress spindle to hold the shank from rotating in the spindle. Ken Grunke SW Wisconsin http://www.token.crwoodturner.com/ Member, Coulee Region Woodturners AAW chapter http://www.crwoodturner.com/ |
#22
|
|||
|
|||
The Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe Blues
****** the Backcutter, and """""'"' the Shearscraper (names deleted to
protect the guilty) in the 9th inning of a tied Morse taper game at rcw stadium. *****: What ejects the tail center? """""": No: What's screwed on the ram *****: No! Which is screwed on the ram, What is centered into the end of the blank. """"": Can't be, Which is in the Barrel. *****: I told you, What goes into the barrel! """"": You are plumb out of the chuck, The ram screws on the barrel! *****: Nah, you have too much runout, rams screw old U gouges. """"": No V's on that old bowl gouge eh". *****: The bevel you say, a Ram actually prefers a female taper. """"": I just hope they take precautions to self eject. *****: A dignified turning ng is listening to us and I'm not gonna go there. """"": Well, what does the hand wheel do? *****: Now really, """"". You should be ashamed. Next you'll bring up the tailstock. """""": You know that dead center has a hollow ring, you dull spur. *****: No worse than a short tang! (the game was tied til the 17th when the umpire found that *****'s spindle had been plugged with carnauba and """"'s bowl blank had been soaked in LDD. Both turners were ejected along with the revolving center. ) Your correspondent was later arrested for sniffing acetone by a ng moderator. A very sad end to a civil thread with so much promise early on. Arch Fortiter, http://community.webtv.net/almcc/MacsMusings |
#23
|
|||
|
|||
The Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe Blues
Tsk... A good one but nothing about CA glue?
"Arch" wrote in message ... ****** the Backcutter, and """""'"' the Shearscraper (names deleted to protect the guilty) in the 9th inning of a tied Morse taper game at rcw stadium. *****: What ejects the tail center? """""": No: What's screwed on the ram *****: No! Which is screwed on the ram, What is centered into the end of the blank. """"": Can't be, Which is in the Barrel. *****: I told you, What goes into the barrel! """"": You are plumb out of the chuck, The ram screws on the barrel! *****: Nah, you have too much runout, rams screw old U gouges. """"": No V's on that old bowl gouge eh". *****: The bevel you say, a Ram actually prefers a female taper. """"": I just hope they take precautions to self eject. *****: A dignified turning ng is listening to us and I'm not gonna go there. """"": Well, what does the hand wheel do? *****: Now really, """"". You should be ashamed. Next you'll bring up the tailstock. """""": You know that dead center has a hollow ring, you dull spur. *****: No worse than a short tang! (the game was tied til the 17th when the umpire found that *****'s spindle had been plugged with carnauba and """"'s bowl blank had been soaked in LDD. Both turners were ejected along with the revolving center. ) Your correspondent was later arrested for sniffing acetone by a ng moderator. A very sad end to a civil thread with so much promise early on. Arch Fortiter, http://community.webtv.net/almcc/MacsMusings |
#24
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
I just posted a picture on ABPW of one type (the most common found on
todays' lathes) of tailstock design with the self-ejection feature. I'm just using the common bored-through live center design in these pictures. If needed, I can easily put a Jacobs' Chuck in there or anything else to show what's going on. Also, I can do a drawing of some other tailstock designs (that have the self-eject feature of course) to compare and contrast. The more I think about George's statement of "You probably have noticed, at least once, that the self-ejecting feature is an extension beyond the ~ 3/8 diameter portion of the #2 taper." the more he's describing a completely different tailstock design. And this statement of his ... "Nope. Think about it. If they're designed to be able to bore through them, they'll lack the self-ejector" really suggests that he's just thinking of that one kind of tailstock self-ejection feature design. He's expecting that "tang" to be there on the end of the male morse taper to hit the center-hitting device in the tailstock to knock it out. In my mind at least, he's confusing that tang as the self-ejection feature in wood lathes. Hopefully, George will respond in order to clarify what he said and answer my questions. I hate to assume but without a response, I am forced to until then. Anyway, if anybody has a problem with viewing or understanding the picture, let me know. Also, like I said above, if there's some clarification needed on other tailstock designs and/or different centers (jacobs chuck, etc.) let me know and I'll whip up some pictures. I have had to get some woodturning video editing done this weekend and earlier this week so I was delayed in getting the picture done and posted. Sorry about that. - Andrew self-eject. Can you provide a picture or drawing of the exact mechanism? I'll do the same of at least one version of self-ejector tailstock mechanism that I've worked with on wood lathes and post it on abpw. Then we can compare. |
#25
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
I'm describing the taper. Look at the overall length of the same, on the
Nova I mentioned, and you'll see that the entire is not long enough to butt against the end as you retract the quill in a lot of tailstocks. Seems like it needs about an extra half inch in length beyond the point at which it is 3/8 or so in diameter. http://miva3.synergydns.net/Merchant...s-acc-novacntr I still haven't the foggiest notion of what you're trying to prove. I'm merely noting that shorter tapers, including those which come with Chaiwan benchtop drill press chucks, like we have at school, might be the reason they didn't self eject for the original poster, not his lathe. The metal lathes at school also have short live centers which require help. I also gave two easy ways to eject such types. "AHilton" wrote in message ... I just posted a picture on ABPW of one type (the most common found on todays' lathes) of tailstock design with the self-ejection feature. I'm just using the common bored-through live center design in these pictures. If needed, I can easily put a Jacobs' Chuck in there or anything else to show what's going on. Also, I can do a drawing of some other tailstock designs (that have the self-eject feature of course) to compare and contrast. The more I think about George's statement of "You probably have noticed, at least once, that the self-ejecting feature is an extension beyond the ~ 3/8 diameter portion of the #2 taper." the more he's describing a completely different tailstock design. And this statement of his ... "Nope. Think about it. If they're designed to be able to bore through them, they'll lack the self-ejector" really suggests that he's just thinking of that one kind of tailstock self-ejection feature design. He's expecting that "tang" to be there on the end of the male morse taper to hit the center-hitting device in the tailstock to knock it out. In my mind at least, he's confusing that tang as the self-ejection feature in wood lathes. |
#26
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
"George" george@least wrote in message
... I'm describing the taper. Look at the overall length of the same, on the Nova I mentioned, and you'll see that the entire is not long enough to butt against the end as you retract the quill in a lot of tailstocks. Seems like Yep, I'll grant (for the upteenth time in this thread) you that some tailstocks and devices designed to fit into those tapers just don't go together or are simply poorly designed in the first place. Some of those devices' tapers just aren't long enough to hit the self-ejector in the tailstock. That's why I mentioned to Mike originally.... "That must be a pretty short live center taper! Good point though. How long is that taper you're talking about?". I still haven't the foggiest notion of what you're trying to prove. I'm merely noting that shorter tapers, including those which come with Chaiwan benchtop drill press chucks, like we have at school, might be the reason they didn't self eject for the original poster, not his lathe. The metal lathes at school also have short live centers which require help. I'm trying to get the point of the self-ejector mechanism discussion as clear as possible to those turners out there that might be having problems buying and using their centers and tailstocks. Poor and misleading information is not good. I'd hate for someone to read your "Nope. Think about it. If they're designed to be able to bore through them, they'll lack the self-ejector." statement and think that if they buy a live center with a boring hole in it, that their tailstock self-ejector feature will be negated in all cases. I was confused in what you were actually trying to say and wanted clarification so that those that might still be following this thread could have the facts and opinions of those of us posting in it clear. They can make up their own minds, then, as to what they want to buy or try in order to fix their problems. When you came up with those statements of having the self-ejector mechanism as part of the live center, for example, and of having a bore hole in any live center, again as an example, will negate the self-ejector feature, had me wondering what you were talking about. You still haven't directly referrenced your statements on those points, by the way. Do you still stand behind them? If so, are you willing to clarify those specific statements? Now, you're saying that it's the shorter tapers that might be the problem. Which, of course, is what was being talked about before you started in with these other statements. I'm always willing and interested in learning and maybe you've run across why those statements are true? Please help us to understand those statements of yours. I also gave two easy ways to eject such types. Yep. And as I've said before to you in this thread, they are good ways. They're also useful on some lathes' headstocks when a taper fitting device is stuck in there too. - Andrew |
#27
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
I have dignified your boorish "challenges" and accusations more than enough
through my previous answer. Those who purchase chucks for their tailstock should be aware that if they don't eject, it is not necessarily the fault of the lathe, nor is it reason to panic. The length of the taper may not be sufficient, for which there are two easy workarounds. "AHilton" wrote in message ... .. When you came up with those statements of having the self-ejector mechanism as part of the live center, for example, and of having a bore hole in any live center, again as an example, will negate the self-ejector feature, had me wondering what you were talking about. You still haven't directly referrenced your statements on those points, by the way. Do you still stand behind them? If so, are you willing to clarify those specific statements? Now, you're saying that it's the shorter tapers that might be the problem. Which, of course, is what was being talked about before you started in with these other statements. |
#28
|
|||
|
|||
Jacobs Chuck on Jet Mini Lathe
I'm sorry for asking you too many questions and trying to get a clearer
understanding of your statements. I'm also sorry for your interpretation of my questions as "boorish 'challenges'". I'm not aware of any actual accusations other than, perhaps, by your own conscience. You answered far more than I expected already but not as much as I had hoped nor as clearly as, at least I, needed. All I can do is stand by my own interpretations of your statements (which I have outlined in my many previous posts in this thread) as to your reasons behind them. Even if you will stop searching for knowlege or accurately expressing it, I will not. I will continue questioning; attempting to learn; and teaching what I can to those that will really listen. - Andrew "George" george@least wrote in message ... I have dignified your boorish "challenges" and accusations more than enough through my previous answer. Those who purchase chucks for their tailstock should be aware that if they don't eject, it is not necessarily the fault of the lathe, nor is it reason to panic. The length of the taper may not be sufficient, for which there are two easy workarounds. |
Reply |
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Forum | |||
Bison lathe chuck: how much scroll friction is normal? | Metalworking | |||
Teknatool Titan Chuck draft review | Woodturning | |||
New Mini Lathe | Woodturning | |||
Delta lathe tailstock chuck issue | Woodturning | |||
Cuemaking-Metal Lathe Chuck Question? | Metalworking |