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Woodturning (rec.crafts.woodturning) To discuss tools, techniques, styles, materials, shows and competitions, education and educational materials related to woodturning. All skill levels are welcome, from art turners to production turners, beginners to masters. |
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#1
Posted to rec.crafts.woodturning
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Stabilizing wood with detergent
On Monday, March 19, 2001 3:28:05 PM UTC-4, "Clifford A. Johnston" wrote:
I have been interested in trying to find an inexpensive way of stabilizing green wood for turning purposes for some time. One "replacement method" left the wood with a waxy finish and had some other draw backs (cost being one). I tried to follow up on ESP-90 and got nowhere. They haven't even answered my email. Then I came across Ron Kent's web site. Ron Kent has stabilized wood by treating it with a liquid detergent. I decided to try his methodology on a piece of Live Oak that I had cut down about 8 weeks ago. In Ron's article (off the top of my head; therefore, subject to error) he mentions that he is just experimenting with liquid dishwashing detergent and has found it to be suitable and inexpensive. It allows for easier cutting with less checking and wasted vessels/time/material/money. It does not alter his finishes; indeed, he feels that it enhances the wood. His methodology is just basically brushing on the concentrate 6 or so times over a period of several days and letting it dry. He raises questions about diluting it, immersion treating the wood, etc., but just hasn't gotten that far and/or hasn't documented it yet online. I decided to give it a go. I first tried brushing on the liquid detergent [Costco's brand, Kirkland Clout Ultra (antibacterial hand soap/dishwashing detergent) - $5.99/gallon. I recall that the Palmolive brand was slightly less expensive, but I shied away from it because of its green color which may or may not affect the wood.] Personally I found brushing it on to be a pain - I am prone to being sloppy with a paint brush. It also raised questions with me about how much to brush on and how often and how thick. In addition, how would I know what the penetration was? It really seemed like a shot in the dark method to me. Not that my next choice was all that much more scientific! My next attempt was to soak the wood. I had a 3 gallon plastic bucket. Into it I poured 1/2 gallon of the liquid detergent and water to cover the oak which I put in. The oak was a 12" length x 10" diameter piece of live oak cut in half lengthwise. I then added a slab of spalted live oak on top and put a brick on top of everything to hold it immersed. I screwed on the bucket top and went to Toronto to celebrate St. Patrick's Day. (We had our usual fun fest - my wife is Irish Roman Catholic and I'm Scots/Irish Presbyterian of Orange Lodge member ancestry! We had a great time until we found out that the pub owner was English - but that's another story.) I let the wood soak for 7 days. Today I took it out to dry. A couple of comments. I left the bark on. The tannic acid in the bark(?) leached out and tinted the spalted oak slab very pleasantly. The oak trunk sections also appear to be stained nicely. I don't know how deep this staining goes, yet. The detergent/water mixture is a dark brown. I may use it on a piece of kiln dried maple as an experiment just to see what the effect is. Some minor radial checking on the ends of the large oak halves closed up, as expected, from absorbing the liquid. The question now is, "How long should I let it dry before attempting to turn it?" I don't know. I'll keep an eye on it and perhaps turn one piece in 7 days and then another piece 7 days later. I'll try to keep you all posted on my progress and the results. As far as the dilution of the detergent mix goes, this was probably a 3 or 4:1 mix of water:detergent. I didn't measure it out exactly - I'll take the time to precisely calculate it later. I'll see how this works first before trying any other dilution. How did I choose this dilution for the first effort - strictly a SWAG decision. If anyone else out there is thinking of trying this for stabilizing wood perhaps we could coordinate our efforts and keep track of what we are attempting to stabilize, the water:detergent ratio, drying time, wood species, dimensions, etc., etc.. I would be more than willing to keep track of this in some sort of table form and make it available for future reference purposes. Any and all comments/suggestions/criticisms are welcomed. Cliff. Johnston Stephenville, TX "Round and round I go." -- Posted from ] via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG I am heading in the same direction as you I would love to hear how you are doing with it. jordonkitt |
#3
Posted to rec.crafts.woodturning
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Stabilizing wood with detergent
On 3/7/2013 6:40 AM, Ralph E Lindberg wrote:
In article , wrote: On Monday, March 19, 2001 3:28:05 PM UTC-4, "Clifford A. Johnston" wrote: I am heading in the same direction as you I would love to hear how you are doing with it. I haven't seen anything of CLiff in years, on any forum, you will note his post was from 12 years ago there was a long discussionof this, as pointed out, that was a long time ago - I tried detergent, didn't like the results, (it made the wood look weird), though others liked it. I tried freezing and boiling - boiling seems the best, but ultimately I do neither, I turn thin and let the wood stress do whatever it wants |
#4
Posted to rec.crafts.woodturning
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Stabilizing wood with detergent
In article , "." wrote:
On 3/7/2013 6:40 AM, Ralph E Lindberg wrote: In article , wrote: On Monday, March 19, 2001 3:28:05 PM UTC-4, "Clifford A. Johnston" wrote: I am heading in the same direction as you I would love to hear how you are doing with it. I haven't seen anything of CLiff in years, on any forum, you will note his post was from 12 years ago there was a long discussionof this, as pointed out, that was a long time ago - I tried detergent, didn't like the results, (it made the wood look weird), though others liked it. I tried freezing and boiling - boiling seems the best, but ultimately I do neither, I turn thin and let the wood stress do whatever it wants Personally I boil also, at least the poorly behaved woods. Well behaved, like Maple and Red Alder I don't bother -- -------------------------------------------------------- Personal e-mail is the n7bsn but at amsat.org This posting address is a spam-trap and seldom read RV and Camping FAQ can be found at http://www.ralphandellen.us/rv |
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