Hi, I think this is my first post here. I have been lurking here for
a little more than a year when I bought my first lathe. It is a mini
(10 inch). I have one of Raffan's books, have taken several turning
books out of the library, been to many websites (Around the Woods is
my favorite), and don't have a clue how to search this group for ruts
in concave turning. On concave pieces - plates and bowls I get "ruts"
on the inside surfaces after using a bowl gouge. I've only turned one
green bowl and everything else was with dried wood. I am using a
Benjamins Best bowl gouge with the grind it came with. I've turned
cross grain and crotch pieces so far. What I end up with are what look
like ruts in the bottom. I also have trouble with the nubbin in the
center. It dosen't come off cleanly - sometimes leaving an
indentation.. I eventually get the ruts out with a round nose scraper
and sandpaper. .It seems to take forever.

I am hoping that someone might recongize these "symptoms" and provide
some advice

TIA,

Bob

Bob
Welcome to the group and to turning. Thanks for the kind words on the web
site.
You have dicovered one of the bug bears of wood turning, leaving "ruts" or
grooves in the wood. It takes ages longer to sand out a groove than to
remove a rib or ridge. The trick is to practice. No surprise there I
warrant. There are two ways to prevent a groove; you have already found a
cure with scraper and sand paper.
1) A long gradual cut from outer edge to the center of the bowl. He who
hesitates is groovy :-) I like to do this with an Oland tool with long edges
or a bowl gouge with Irish grind. I hold it parallel to the ways with the
point of the tool leading and cutting just behind the point. I am NOT
riding the bevel although others do a similar cut with the bevel riding. The
cut proceeds to the center or close to it.
2) Using the same tool make a cut from edge toward center with the bevel
rubbing. If you can go right to the center, but in most cases the bevel need
changes so fast that about two inches can be cut at a time, then the hands
need to chage position. Watch the ridge left behind to begin the next cut.
Ideally it rides the bevel into the waste wood at exactly the same level and
the last cut finsihed. If not ideal, enter a hair above the last level, not
below it.
These are finish cuts with a freshly sharpened tool and little pressure,
aiming for fine shavings and a good surface, not fast wood removal.

To get rid of that nubbin in the center, I like a scraper, either flat or
slightly curved. If the wood tears easily sandpaper works great. No shame
here.

--
God bless and safe turning
Darrell Feltmate
Truro, NS Canada
http://aroundthewoods.com
http://roundopinions.blogspot.com
"rjdankert" wrote in message
...
Hi, I think this is my first post here. I have been lurking here for
a little more than a year when I bought my first lathe. It is a mini
(10 inch). I have one of Raffan's books, have taken several turning
books out of the library, been to many websites (Around the Woods is
my favorite), and don't have a clue how to search this group for ruts
in concave turning. On concave pieces - plates and bowls I get "ruts"
on the inside surfaces after using a bowl gouge. I've only turned one
green bowl and everything else was with dried wood. I am using a
Benjamins Best bowl gouge with the grind it came with. I've turned
cross grain and crotch pieces so far. What I end up with are what look
like ruts in the bottom. I also have trouble with the nubbin in the
center. It dosen't come off cleanly - sometimes leaving an
indentation.. I eventually get the ruts out with a round nose scraper
and sandpaper. .It seems to take forever.

I am hoping that someone might recongize these "symptoms" and provide
some advice

TIA,

Bob

On Apr 16, 9:47 pm, "Darrell Feltmate"
wrote:

SNIP of great advice

To get rid of that nubbin in the center, I like a scraper, either flat or
slightly curved. If the wood tears easily sandpaper works great. No shame
here.

Darrell, to make sure you don't even have a moment of self doubt when
sanding, please use the more common name I am trying to get into the
turning language: "The 80g finishing gouge". The "g" is actually
spoken to keep from having any confusion with other tools, and it
should be noted that the "g" style gouge comes in different sizes as
well, like the 100g and the 120g gouges.

;^)

Robert

In message cTyNj.137$og.91@edtnps91, Darrell Feltmate
writes
Bob
Welcome to the group and to turning. Thanks for the kind words on the web
site.
You have dicovered one of the bug bears of wood turning, leaving "ruts" or
grooves in the wood. It takes ages longer to sand out a groove than to
remove a rib or ridge. The trick is to practice. No surprise there I
warrant. There are two ways to prevent a groove; you have already found a
cure with scraper and sand paper.
1) A long gradual cut from outer edge to the center of the bowl. He who
hesitates is groovy :-) I like to do this with an Oland tool with long edges
or a bowl gouge with Irish grind. I hold it parallel to the ways with the
point of the tool leading and cutting just behind the point. I am NOT
riding the bevel although others do a similar cut with the bevel riding. The
cut proceeds to the center or close to it.
2) Using the same tool make a cut from edge toward center with the bevel
rubbing. If you can go right to the center, but in most cases the bevel need
changes so fast that about two inches can be cut at a time, then the hands
need to chage position. Watch the ridge left behind to begin the next cut.
Ideally it rides the bevel into the waste wood at exactly the same level and
the last cut finsihed. If not ideal, enter a hair above the last level, not
below it.
These are finish cuts with a freshly sharpened tool and little pressure,
aiming for fine shavings and a good surface, not fast wood removal.

To get rid of that nubbin in the center, I like a scraper, either flat or
slightly curved. If the wood tears easily sandpaper works great. No shame
here.

I would add one additional item to check. If the tool rest is not smooth
it will make it difficult to slide the tool smoothly and each stop is a
potential rut, OK that's what I found
--
John

"
I would add one additional item to check. If the tool rest is not smooth
it will make it difficult to slide the tool smoothly and each stop is a
potential rut, OK that's what I found
--
John

if you have a heavy enough gouge, with a reasonably sharp fingernail grind,
and you rotate it properly as you go from rim to bottom, you do it all in
one smooth cut and there are no ridges - my guess is that you are stopping
and starting, and are not changing the angle from nearly horizontal to
nearly vertical (for the flute) as you go from edge to bottom. - you can
also shear scrape with the gouge coming from bottom to rim but that takes
more practice to avoid a rather spectacular catch.


** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

On Apr 16, 3:19 pm, rjdankert wrote:
Hi, I think this is my first post here. I have been lurking here for
a little more than a year when I bought my first lathe. It is a mini
(10 inch). I have one of Raffan's books, have taken several turning
books out of the library, been to many websites (Around the Woods is
my favorite), and don't have a clue how to search this group for ruts
in concave turning. On concave pieces - plates and bowls I get "ruts"
on the inside surfaces after using a bowl gouge. I've only turned one
green bowl and everything else was with dried wood. I am using a
Benjamins Best bowl gouge with the grind it came with. I've turned
cross grain and crotch pieces so far. What I end up with are what look
like ruts in the bottom. I also have trouble with the nubbin in the
center. It dosen't come off cleanly - sometimes leaving an
indentation.. I eventually get the ruts out with a round nose scraper
and sandpaper. .It seems to take forever.

I am hoping that someone might recongize these "symptoms" and provide
some advice

TIA,

Bob

Hello Bob,

I'm not sure what grind the Benjamins Best bowl gouge has on it, but
my experience says that most bowl gouges from the factory do not have
a good grind on them. If the gouge happens to be a 5/8" shaft, I would
recommend purchasing the Ellsworth Grinding Jig and put the Ellsworth
grind on your gouge. This gives you a nose bevel angle of somewhere
between 60 and 65 degrees and good swept back wings. This particular
grind will allow you to cut from the rim to the center of the bottom
of the bowl in one smooth pass. Normal, factory ground bowl gouges
will not let you do this. Unless you have the Ellsworth Grind or a
very similar one, you will need two grinds on your gouge to cover the
area from rim to center. A gouge with a 45 degree nose angle will cut
smoothly about 2/3 of the way down the side of the inside of the bowl.
You then need a gouge with an angle of between 60 degrees and 70
degrees to continue on to the center of the bowl bottom.

With the Ellsworth grind, you can cut from rim all of the way to the
center, including removing that little nubbin at the center if you
finish your cut exactly on center. When you get close to the bottom
center, the wood is moving very slow so you must move your gouge very
slow and smoothly to avoid tearing out the center point and having a
detent instead of a nubbin.

The ridges you are talking about generally come from moving the tool
to quickly and not moving it smoothly. I think that most of this will
all be eliminated with a well ground bowl gouge and lots of practice.
When it comes to good woodturning, nothing beats making lots of
shavings; i.e., practice, practice, practice!!!

Welcome to woodturning and good luck with your turnings. As others
have said, the last resort is the 80 grit gouge, which also leave
grooves in the wood. I can remember when I started turning many years
ago, that the 40 grit gouge came in quite handy to start to smooth the
bottom of the bowl.

Some other reference material are videos and DVD's on turning and
three US magazines devoted to woodturning: American Woodturner
published by the American Association of Woodturners, More Woodturning
published my me, and Woodturning Design published by one of the large
publishing companies.

Fred Holder
www.morewoodturning.net