Home |
Search |
Today's Posts |
|
Woodturning (rec.crafts.woodturning) To discuss tools, techniques, styles, materials, shows and competitions, education and educational materials related to woodturning. All skill levels are welcome, from art turners to production turners, beginners to masters. |
Reply |
|
LinkBack | Thread Tools | Display Modes |
#1
Posted to rec.crafts.woodturning
|
|||
|
|||
Is East still East & West still West? Musing about salad bowls.
Yesterday I went to the local Target store to buy some two cycle motor
oil. They don't sell it so I took a look at their imported wooden bowls. The built up layered ring bowls with their straight sides and wide flat bottoms were tacky and no competition at any price, but the large acacia bowls got my attention. Some were over 12 X 7 with 1/4 in. walls that sported smooth fair curves nicely fading into rounded bottoms. The finish wasn't much to write home about, but at less than $20,00 for a not bad, large acacia salad bowl do I hear footsteps? The wood and finish makes them easy to spot as 'cheap imports' made on production copying machines or by preteens in sweatshops. Many people don't want to display them or use them on their tables when company comes, but the quality seems to be improving pretty fast. Will it be long before we see them approaching ever more closely the appearance of a nicely turned domestic vessel? I wouldn't be surprised to see some attractive hollow forms on Target's shelves in the future. They might even graduate to being proudly displayed in gift shoppes. I wonder if we need to begin thinking about ways to keep the public's perception of our hand turned bowls separate from that of the the Far Eastern imports. Can't happen here? I remember when most imported Far East products were junky 'japanned' tinny sheet metal toys. Not anymore. Ask GM or RR. Are our present hand turned salad bowls so superior and so much more desirable than the 'cheap junk' in Target or Walmart? Maybe so, but assuming we want to keep it that way, what should we do or can we do to maintain the present image of our beloved 'plain, honest & respectable' hand turned bowls? Maybe we should consider veering away from the simple workmanlike, unadorned, maple work without that much to be avoided plastic shine, the kind of salad bowl we turners favor, and consider adding more coves, flourishes and glossy finishes. Perhaps we should employ a wider range of beautiful timber even for the things we turn for use. This frou frou is sure not my cuppa tea. I like a plain maple bowl, but then I don't sell many. What's your take? Turn to Safety, Arch Fortiter http://community.webtv.net/almcc/MacsMusings |
#2
Posted to rec.crafts.woodturning
|
|||
|
|||
Is East still East & West still West? Musing about salad bowls.
I believe the far east product wont advance much further and will
alwys be distinguishable. What you can do are two things: sign your work (ask collectors - signed work such as pottery or furniture is much higher in value) and emphasize use of local, non-industrially felled trees. Those who care will alwys prefer these. Last but not least - your musings are on a commercial basis. Most turners I know consider turning a fun past time, an appreciation of nature and one of its most appealing raw materials, an art or practice/celebration of craftsmanship. If you turn for income, far east competition is a niche killer, indeed. Arch כתב: Yesterday I went to the local Target store to buy some two cycle motor oil. They don't sell it so I took a look at their imported wooden bowls. |
#3
Posted to rec.crafts.woodturning
|
|||
|
|||
Is East still East & West still West? Musing about salad bowls.
|
#4
Posted to rec.crafts.woodturning
|
|||
|
|||
Is East still East & West still West? Musing about salad bowls.
"Prometheus" wrote in message ... On Wed, 16 May 2007 16:46:10 -0400, (Arch) wrote: Yesterday I went to the local Target store to buy some two cycle motor oil. They don't sell it so I took a look at their imported wooden bowls. The built up layered ring bowls with their straight sides and wide flat bottoms were tacky and no competition at any price, but the large acacia bowls got my attention. Some were over 12 X 7 with 1/4 in. walls that sported smooth fair curves nicely fading into rounded bottoms. The finish wasn't much to write home about, but at less than $20,00 for a not bad, large acacia salad bowl do I hear footsteps? That's the #1 reason I don't even *try* to sell turnings. I've had a few offers on various peices, and people always want me to compete with Walmart and Target. Sizzle versus steak. Some like 'em pretty, hand-crafted of local woods or are willing to pay for more that name on the bottom. Your stuff hold any less Romaine than "famous name" turnings which cost a bunch more lettuce? Though we can sell based on pure utility as well. As I remind people, you can put popcorn in a steel bowl and it tastes the same, just don't set that sucker in your lap. Wants a half inch of insulating wood to save the family jewels. You can put the chips in Corel, but they don't have that little recurve on the inside of the rim to keep your greasy thumb from slipping and spreading the contents into Aunt Martha's lap as you pass it. As to the business of dust-gathering "hollow forms" versus their ceramic clones, I think the potters have a real leg up. They've got the ease of forming, the hand craftspersonship, the name on the bottom, and any number of glazes and firing methods working for them. Some turners paint, stain or dye their stuff in hopes of imitating them, but it's more for self-gratification than added value. I sell the shelves to put those things on. |
#5
Posted to rec.crafts.woodturning
|
|||
|
|||
Is East still East & West still West? Musing about salad bowls.
Max, Jesse, George, Just to acknowledge your thoughtful responses. It's
very satisfying to have had something to do with this kind of balanced give & take among fellow turners. Thanks. Turn to Safety, Arch Fortiter http://community.webtv.net/almcc/MacsMusings |
#6
Posted to rec.crafts.woodturning
|
|||
|
|||
Is East still East & West still West? Musing about salad bowls.
Arch - first, good to see you post. Seems like it has been a while.
I think there will be a flood of low end bowls and turnings from Indonesia, S. America, etc. if it can be determined that those things can be made and sold for a profit. The amount of mass produced work from those places has steadily increased, and certainly their manufacturing methods and finishing have as well. But this has always been the case. There is a turner that used to frequent this group a few years ago that has sold his turnings to make a living for many years. He told me that if he didn't have the side income from his own mass bowl and platter turning efforts the he could not stay afloat. So in effect he was his own competition, and the there were only three differences in his "studio pieces" and his mass produced. 1) mass produced was in big volume (I seem to remember a M. Mahoney-like 600+ a year in addition to his studio work) 2) The pieces sold at 50% of the studio price, and 3) they weren't signed by him as an artist While many people can appreciate good workmanship and a fine chunk of wood, how many are willing to pay what we might think it is worth? A pressed monkey wood/acacia/who knows what wood bowl that you can beat the living crap out of for $20, and buy another if it gets screwed up, or $200 for a nicely shaped and oiled maple bowl from an artist. The artist's bowl required special care and feeding, and to some extent, special handling. The Indonesian bowl can be bounced, kicked, dropped and then cleaned easily. No oiling necessary, no special care, no worries. So is the maple artist's bowl worth 10X more? Only you and your client know. The prattle about "educating the public about our craft" is an old saw. And I might add, it is in every aspect of any craft work. You should have heard the boys I knew (excuse me, artists/crafstmen) that were making humidors in the cigar days of the late 80's and 90's. They were selling their boxes (exotic wood on the outside, melamine on the inside with a humidifier strip) for about $300 to $600, and couldn't keep up with the orders. Then the foreign imports came in from every direction. Some more expensive, most much less. Artistry didn't matter at that point, nor did educating the public. The question of the day was "real or percieved value". Out of concern for my buddies whom would never let me live it down, I passed on buying a humidor at Sam's club that was a tastefully inlaid solid mahogany with polished lacquer finish affair. It held more cigars, had a better humidifier, and even had a built in hygrometer. It was $69. I also remember the "ironwood" artists from the 70s. Guys went out to the desert areas and found ironwood bushes/trees that would make good project candidates. They did well for themselves until someone in Mexico discovered that the Sonoran desert was covered in it. They cut down so much and flooded the market so thoroughly that all that is left of the market is cheap, ugly carved crap. I can't help think that somewhere along the line we may see mass turned bowls from S. America if some enterprising person will just go raid the burn pile at the edges of the rain forest to get exotic woods. There is a lot of material, a lot of man power, and a ready market. I promise you this; If I knew someone I could trust to run it after I set it up, I would go down there and do it. I think the market is ripe. As always, just my 0.02. Robert |
#7
Posted to rec.crafts.woodturning
|
|||
|
|||
Is East still East & West still West? Musing about salad bowls.
That's not eacatly high volume. I am fully equiped to make two an hour. I
would, if there was a market. wrote in message ups.com... 1) mass produced was in big volume (I seem to remember a M. Mahoney-like 600+ a year in addition to his studio work) |
#8
Posted to rec.crafts.woodturning
|
|||
|
|||
Is East still East & West still West? Musing about salad bowls.
On May 17, 8:46 pm, "CW" wrote:
That's not eacatly high volume. I am fully equiped to make two an hour. I would, if there was a market. I agree. That's not Mahoney numbers by any means. But he also turns platters, super custom pens from all manner of materials, produces exquisite hollow forms, does custom turning, and makes a lot of gallery pieces for his studio and associated galleries. He also harvests almost all of his turning wood, writes books, maintains a website, produces DVDs, tests tools and turning related paraphenalia, and besides that, maintains the business end of it all. He was a long time denizen of this group, but I think he is just too damn busy these days. Check him out: http://ezinearticles.com/?expert_bio=Steven_Russell Robert |
#9
Posted to rec.crafts.woodturning
|
|||
|
|||
Is East still East & West still West? Musing about salad bowls.
In article .com,
" wrote: On May 17, 8:46 pm, "CW" wrote: That's not eacatly high volume. I am fully equiped to make two an hour. I would, if there was a market. I agree. That's not Mahoney numbers by any means. But he also turns platters, super custom pens from all manner of materials, produces exquisite hollow forms, does custom turning, and makes a lot of gallery pieces for his studio and associated galleries. He also harvests almost all of his turning wood, writes books, maintains a website, produces DVDs, tests tools and turning related paraphenalia, and besides that, maintains the business end of it all. He was a long time denizen of this group, but I think he is just too damn busy these days. Check him out: http://ezinearticles.com/?expert_bio=Steven_Russell That's who I thought you meant... Last year Steve was the demo guy at the woodworking show, he posted almost nothing then. This year he has been posting a little. He also posts over on the AWW forum and on Wood Centeral. He also hosts the Wed night chat room there. -- -------------------------------------------------------- Personal e-mail is the n7bsn but at amsat.org This posting address is a spam-trap and seldom read RV and Camping FAQ can be found at http://www.ralphandellen.us/rv |
Reply |
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Forum | |||
A Bit OT - Satellite & Terrestrial TV in West Cork, Ireland | UK diy | |||
B & Q threaten small retailer in Nth East | UK diy | |||
OT- Anyone used G & S Gas Services in Willerby East Yorks | UK diy | |||
Musing about coffee cups and popcorn bowls, salad forks and treen. | Woodturning | |||
Telefunken 74cm TV East west problem | Electronics Repair |