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Circular Saw on the lathe
Hi All,
some time ago, somebody in the group (I think it was Arch) posted that he used a small circular saw, held in the lathe to cut things. At the time, people were talking about lost fingers and it appeared as a not so safe method or technique. I liked the use, but since it did seem a bit dangoures I also didn't try it. However, I've been reading what I call turners bible (Hand Or Simple Turning by Holtzapffel) and decided to purchase most if not all of that series, which includes much more material besides turning, concerning machines etc... He has in volume II a whole section dedicated to saws (types, usage, sharpening etc...) and at the end of the section he discusses all kinds of saw machines (the book is from 1845, so obviously these are not the power tools we know) you can recognize there the father of the modern band saw (which doesn't appear to have existed then) and an already working table saw. One of the applictions he talks about (being a master turner that he was) is using circular saws on a lathe. He has explanations on how to mount a small saw (slitting saw) and how to mount larger saws (between 8" and 10" in diameter) on the lathe, including two drawings of two jigs, actually saw tables to place on the lathe - including blade height adjustment. it was an eye opener - since this is such a simple idea, I couldn't believe I didn't think of it before. Now all I have to find is a MT2 arbor that will hold a large circular saw well. I don't know about copyright laws concerning this book, so I haven't scanned any of the images or text. Sorry. Moshe Eshel |
Circular Saw on the lathe
There were machine manufacturers in England like Coronet, I believe, that
turned out lathes with attachments like table saws. Some of the older turning books from England have pictures of these machines in them. Occasionally one of these lathes will come up for sale in the British magazines or on one of the e-groups. I am sure someone posted a link to a company that sells used machines and parts for these machines recently but I have no idea where I saw it. |
Circular Saw on the lathe
"Moshe Eshel" wrote in message oups.com... Hi All, some time ago, somebody in the group (I think it was Arch) posted that he used a small circular saw, held in the lathe to cut things. At the time, people were talking about lost fingers and it appeared as a not so safe method or technique. I liked the use, but since it did seem a bit dangoures I also didn't try it. Some claim that the classic lathe turned into circular saw - Shopsmith - is dangerous because of tilting the table versus the arbor. What you describe, while common practice when, just isn't worth the risk. Mount a cutoff saw upside down in a table and at least get a bit of a guard. |
Circular Saw on the lathe
Hi Moshe,
IIRC, I mentioned using a small (1") slitting saw (milling cutter) to slot a shaft for holding a scraper blade. However, many of us do use larger blades in Shop- Smiths safely. Of course there are dangers in spinning any cutting tool against the work or spinning the work against a tool. I've turned wood on my little Atlas horizontal milling machine and others have used their drill press as a Vertilathe (see archives). I probably could remove the table and use my bench saw to turn wood, grind chisels, or buff bowls. Most machines end up as arbors for holding and rotating something. (yes, I've heard of shapers, presses and recip saws. 'G' ) It's the utility and efficiency plus the safety features of a machine and its human that count the most, but sometimes we have to consider other factors such as space and cost, and multiuse what we have. Didn't I say something new and sound smart 'til I fell off the soapbox? :) Turn to Safety, Arch Fortiter http://community.webtv.net/almcc/MacsMusings |
Circular Saw on the lathe
In news:Moshe Eshel typed:
Hi All, some time ago, somebody in the group (I think it was Arch) posted that he used a small circular saw, held in the lathe to cut things. At the time, people were talking about lost fingers and it appeared as a not so safe method or technique. I liked the use, but since it did seem a bit dangoures I also didn't try it. I use a 2" jewelers saw on a mandrel in my router connected to the tool post on the cross slide for parting off parts very accurately. Works better than anything I have used, including cut-off tools. Not to mention, it is more accurate and faster. I cut wood, phenolics, ivory, and soft metals such as silver with it. I suppose it could be dangerous, but no more so than any other tool in the shop. Ted Harris http://www.tedharris.com |
Circular Saw on the lathe
Hi Moshe
Moshe I am not aware of any off the shelf MT arbor made to hold a wood saw blade, there are slitting saw arbors, the slitting saws are mostly small up to 4" and used in the metal industry, electrical motors, jewelry, etc. The slitting saws usually have a notch cut out to help keep them from slipping, no notch in wood saw blades If you go to the Busy Bee website you'll find a slitting saw arbor the cat. # is B044 and you can have a look, Busy Bee also carries a #3 and #2 MT that is ground and hardened and drilled and tapped for a 3/8" draw bar, that has a 1"D stub that is soft so it can be machined, the catalog # B460. Anyway without some custom machining, I don't know how you would be able to get a large saw blade on your lathe. Maybe that is a good thing though, as it is not the safest thing to do IMO. Have fun and take care Leo Van Der Loo |
Circular Saw on the lathe
" wrote:
Hi Moshe Moshe I am not aware of any off the shelf MT arbor made to hold a wood saw blade, there are slitting saw arbors, the slitting saws are mostly small up to 4" and used in the metal industry, electrical motors, jewelry, etc. The slitting saws usually have a notch cut out to help keep them from slipping, no notch in wood saw blades If you go to the Busy Bee website you'll find a slitting saw arbor the cat. # is B044 and you can have a look, Busy Bee also carries a #3 and #2 MT that is ground and hardened and drilled and tapped for a 3/8" draw bar, that has a 1"D stub that is soft so it can be machined, the catalog # B460. Anyway without some custom machining, I don't know how you would be able to get a large saw blade on your lathe. MT to 5/8", then use a Shopsmith saw blade arbor. Not that *I* would want to do it - bad enough sawing on the Shopsmith and it has the appropriate blade guards. |
Circular Saw on the lathe
it's trivial to make a MT taper with a LH threaded hole to accept a LH
bolt and thus hold the saw - you can buy a MT taper with a "un machined" soft steel part. No, this sounds really dangerous so I won't make it, but you can do it on your wood lathe all by yourself - buy the stuff at www.use-enco.com for example, you can drill accurately using your tail stock, and tap the hole with a LH tap held in the tail stock (rotate lathe by hand for this, with tailstock not clamped down) - remember to use a drawbar to hold the MT taper in place lest it come loose and you have a saw blade spinning around your shop with the MT taper attached to it. Note also that you can machine soft steel with a HSS or carbide gouge no problem (I've done it), but it is hard to keep everything perfectly concentric - but you can get pretty good (maybe a few thousandths) if you are careful. On Sat, 22 Apr 2006 21:05:40 GMT, Lobby Dosser wrote: " wrote: Hi Moshe Moshe I am not aware of any off the shelf MT arbor made to hold a wood saw blade, there are slitting saw arbors, the slitting saws are mostly small up to 4" and used in the metal industry, electrical motors, jewelry, etc. The slitting saws usually have a notch cut out to help keep them from slipping, no notch in wood saw blades If you go to the Busy Bee website you'll find a slitting saw arbor the cat. # is B044 and you can have a look, Busy Bee also carries a #3 and #2 MT that is ground and hardened and drilled and tapped for a 3/8" draw bar, that has a 1"D stub that is soft so it can be machined, the catalog # B460. Anyway without some custom machining, I don't know how you would be able to get a large saw blade on your lathe. MT to 5/8", then use a Shopsmith saw blade arbor. Not that *I* would want to do it - bad enough sawing on the Shopsmith and it has the appropriate blade guards. Bill www.wbnoble.com to contact me, do not reply to this message, instead correct this address and use it will iam_ b_ No ble at msn daught com *** Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com *** |
Circular Saw on the lathe
Hi Bill
If the lathe turns toward you and you have a left hand thread, the bold will unscrew itself. Normal right hand thread thread will tighten, (with the MT we're talking inboard) and yes like you say, the MT should be held with a drawbar or else there might be real bad problems, as I said in my post, I consider it not a safe thing to do. Have fun and take care Leo Van Der Loo |
Circular Saw on the lathe
Hi Mac, I think we are tuned to the same frequency. Sorry for my
ambiguity and false assumption for not writing "Shop- Smith's in _saw mode_". I had hoped to imply that a Shop Smith set up for sawing is pretty much in lathe mode with table and protective accessories in place. I suppose I could make a table and add Shop-Smith's array of circle saw safety accessories to my wood lathe and spin larger blades, but of course I won't. I only spin small cutting tools like thread cutters, slitting saws and drill bits and those at a slow speed with care. When prudent I use some sort of 'milling vise' to hold and move the work. This might be a good place to warn beginners about the danger of sharp edges on revolving wood. They can slice a finger off or open an artery like a blade. This being the internet, let me make it crystal clear to anyone reading this thread that neither Moshe nor I suggest putting an unprotected saw blade on a naked lathe spindle. DON'T DO IT! WE DON'T! Turn to Safety, Arch Fortiter http://community.webtv.net/almcc/MacsMusings |
Circular Saw on the lathe
mac davis wrote:
On Fri, 21 Apr 2006 10:52:39 -0400, (Arch) wrote: Arch... I may not be understanding this thread, but it seems to me that putting a blade on a lathe and putting one on a Shopsmith are 2 completely different thing, "assuming" that the SS has a saw table, fence, blade guard, etc... I've had 2 Shopsmiths over the last 30 years and have never even THOUGHT of spinning a blade on them when they're set up as lathes... Even though you put a blade, table, and guards on the SS, it is Still a lathe. You could add blade table, and guards to any other lathe in a manner similar to SS. In fact, the Unimat used to have accessories for this purpose - may still do. |
Circular Saw on the lathe
On Mon, 24 Apr 2006 06:48:27 GMT, Lobby Dosser
wrote: mac davis wrote: On Fri, 21 Apr 2006 10:52:39 -0400, (Arch) wrote: Arch... I may not be understanding this thread, but it seems to me that putting a blade on a lathe and putting one on a Shopsmith are 2 completely different thing, "assuming" that the SS has a saw table, fence, blade guard, etc... I've had 2 Shopsmiths over the last 30 years and have never even THOUGHT of spinning a blade on them when they're set up as lathes... Even though you put a blade, table, and guards on the SS, it is Still a lathe. You could add blade table, and guards to any other lathe in a manner similar to SS. In fact, the Unimat used to have accessories for this purpose - may still do. Right... and I know that you've had SS experience.... I'm just saying that even I'm not crazy enough to have a blade spinning on ANY kind of arbor if it's not safe... I've seen people use a drill and 5" saw blade instead of a grinder and cutting wheel, but I value my body parts WAY too much to try it.. *g* Mac https://home.comcast.net/~mac.davis https://home.comcast.net/~mac.davis/wood_stuff.htm |
Circular Saw on the lathe
Well to calm everybody down, all that I'm saying is that I saw a
description (that included a full Saw table and a special arbor) of a setup USED by people in ancient times (1840's I'd guess) that is given a number of pages on what is considered to be the bible of woodturners. No recommendation to do anything unsafe - I am so against unsafe that I prefer hand tools to power tools whenever it makes sense.... The book mentions that this works very good, obviously this is not a slap on rickety jig, but a well planned, and very safe way of doing this - it IS actualy a table saw, just mounted and using the power of the lathe. again do not try this at home without the proper equipment - which I believe is not manufactured by anyone today. Conclusion: IT IS CHEAPER TO BUY A TABLESAW THAN TO LOSE A HAND OR WORSE! My post was merely a informational one, I will try to post pictures and text somewhere where everyone can read and see what I was talking about... |
Circular Saw on the lathe
mac davis wrote:
I'm just saying that even I'm not crazy enough to have a blade spinning on ANY kind of arbor if it's not safe... I've seen people use a drill and 5" saw blade instead of a grinder and cutting wheel, but I value my body parts WAY too much to try it.. *g* Oh Geez, I get chills Thinking about that one. |
Circular Saw on the lathe
On 24 Apr 2006 12:48:52 -0700, "Moshe Eshel" wrote:
Well to calm everybody down, all that I'm saying is that I saw a description (that included a full Saw table and a special arbor) of a setup USED by people in ancient times (1840's I'd guess) that is given a number of pages on what is considered to be the bible of woodturners. No recommendation to do anything unsafe - I am so against unsafe that I prefer hand tools to power tools whenever it makes sense.... The book mentions that this works very good, obviously this is not a slap on rickety jig, but a well planned, and very safe way of doing this - it IS actualy a table saw, just mounted and using the power of the lathe. again do not try this at home without the proper equipment - which I believe is not manufactured by anyone today. Conclusion: IT IS CHEAPER TO BUY A TABLESAW THAN TO LOSE A HAND OR WORSE! My post was merely a informational one, I will try to post pictures and text somewhere where everyone can read and see what I was talking about... Moshe... I think we'd both agree that if you had the table, guards and all, it would be better to use an old motor and make a saw instead of tying up your lathe... IMHO, saws are for cutting, lathes for turning... Have you turned any of that nice olive yet? Mac https://home.comcast.net/~mac.davis https://home.comcast.net/~mac.davis/wood_stuff.htm |
Circular Saw on the lathe
On 25 Apr 2006 11:04:57 -0700, "Moshe Eshel" wrote:
We do agree :-) About the olive, there is some progress... I turned a nice (I think) goblet from a branch (the one that has its own picture in my website). The problem was that I should have known better - even in branch form there was a line that promised to become a nasty crack (structural crack, not drying) - very disturbing......... The smell it gave while turning WAS amazing. This weekend hopefuly, I will meet with my teacher (woodturning teacher) and he will help me to turn the logs into all kinds of blanks - whatever we can harvest. Also some Pomelo will get the same treatment and some peach and apricot that I recently got. I'll try to get some pictures of the process to share. Moshe Peach & apricot are fun, aromatic woods that turn well and look great.... and crack for the fun of it... Expect to use a lot of CA and use the cracks as accents to the wood, not defects, and you'll have more fun.. Mac https://home.comcast.net/~mac.davis https://home.comcast.net/~mac.davis/wood_stuff.htm |
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