Pump & Shower piping
 

Hi,

I have a plumber who's fitting a Stuart Turner Showermate Shower Pump
& Hudson Reed 3/4" thermostatic valve (from Bathstore) for me (you
might argue this wasn't DIY, but I have fixed the electrics myself!).
Question is this (and I think it is on topic for the ng): he's using
15mm flexi-piping: about .5 m from the hot tank to the pump, and about
3m from there to the valve (all but the last 50cms which are 22mm
copper pipe). The instructions both for the pump & the valve say "use
22mm piping if possible", but he (and the wife) reckon that as the
pump entry & exit tubes are 15mm, it's not going to make too much
difference.

So, if any of you have experience of this sort of set-up, please tell
me: is this going to turn our rainstorm into a piddle? Or not really.

Ah yes: gravity system; hot tank, pump & bath on first floor, cold
tank on second floor.

And a PS. The obvious cold feed to use for the pump might be straight
from the mains, I haven't checked. Would that be a bad idea?

Thanks.

James

Pump & Shower piping
 

On 2 Apr 2004 11:24:18 -0800, (James) wrote:

Hi,

I have a plumber who's fitting a Stuart Turner Showermate Shower Pump
& Hudson Reed 3/4" thermostatic valve (from Bathstore) for me (you
might argue this wasn't DIY, but I have fixed the electrics myself!).
Question is this (and I think it is on topic for the ng): he's using
15mm flexi-piping: about .5 m from the hot tank to the pump, and about
3m from there to the valve (all but the last 50cms which are 22mm
copper pipe). The instructions both for the pump & the valve say "use
22mm piping if possible", but he (and the wife) reckon that as the
pump entry & exit tubes are 15mm, it's not going to make too much
difference.

So, if any of you have experience of this sort of set-up, please tell
me: is this going to turn our rainstorm into a piddle? Or not really.

As much of the pipe runs as possible should be in 22mm, but you don't
say how long the runs are from the cylinder to the pump.

There's no point in having just the last section in 22mm. Really,
only the pieces immediately adjacent to the pump with the short
flexible hoses that Stuart Turner supply should be smaller.



Ah yes: gravity system; hot tank, pump & bath on first floor, cold
tank on second floor.

And a PS. The obvious cold feed to use for the pump might be straight
from the mains, I haven't checked. Would that be a bad idea?

It must be directly from the cold tank and not the mains. Don't let
him bodge it by tapping into a pipe in the airing cupboard.

The hot take off should be from the cylinder using either a separate
tapping or a Surrey or Essex flange on the cylinder.

Otherwise the shower, even though thermostatic, will tend to pulse hot
or cold as taps are turned on and off.





Thanks.

James

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

Pump & Shower piping
 

Andy Hall wrote:
And a PS. The obvious cold feed to use for the pump might be straight
from the mains, I haven't checked. Would that be a bad idea?

It must be directly from the cold tank and not the mains. Don't let
him bodge it by tapping into a pipe in the airing cupboard.

In other words, don't do what the prat who installed the power shower in our
house (before we bought it), has done. In fact, he (I assume it was a "he"),
has carefully ignored almost ALL the installation requirements in the
manufacturer's data sheet. Frankly, it's a wonder that it works, and work it
does - surpringly well in fact. However, when I get "a round tuit", I must
plumb the thing in properly. In theory it's a simple enough thing to do, but
as I would have to undo half a dozen other bodgeups at the same time, it's
not exactly a five-minute job. Five hours might be nearer the mark, with a
lot of sweating and swearing. I'll probably leave it until we have the
bathroom refurbished, when we can dispense with the separate pump in the
loft and fit one of these combined units with the pump inside the shower
unit itself.

Bodgers should be publicly executed. It takes very little effort to do the
job right to begin with, but it often takes a very great deal of effort to
put things right later.

Rant over!

Rick

Pump & Shower piping
 

Andy Hall wrote in message . ..
On 2 Apr 2004 11:24:18 -0800, (James) wrote:



(snip)


It must be directly from the cold tank and not the mains. Don't let
him bodge it by tapping into a pipe in the airing cupboard.

The hot take off should be from the cylinder using either a separate
tapping or a Surrey or Essex flange on the cylinder.

Otherwise the shower, even though thermostatic, will tend to pulse hot
or cold as taps are turned on and off.



.andy


Ahh - that rather destroys an idea I had for solving my weak flow
problem !! Single story cottage, head is 4m max. so it's been an
electric shower for many years, with the annual mutterings in the mid
winter about poor flow (winter water temperatures in Scotland tend to
be a bit low !). The mutterings were usually ignored, until recently
when the other half came in contact with one of those kitchen mixer
taps on a shower hose and came proudly out of Homebase clutching one
pleased that she had got it on a 10% off day.

Muggins fitted it without reading all of the small print - those who
have read the small print, or are muggins too, know what I am talking
about - these taps have a high insertion loss and the hot water is a
piddle now.

So, as the shower and the kitchen sink are physically close I have
been thinking that I could kill the proverbial 2 birds and fit one
pump. Do I take it this is not a good idea ?

Rob

Pump & Shower piping
 

"Rob Graham" wrote in message
om...
Andy Hall wrote in message
. ..
On 2 Apr 2004 11:24:18 -0800, (James) wrote:



(snip)


It must be directly from the cold tank and not the mains. Don't let
him bodge it by tapping into a pipe in the airing cupboard.

The hot take off should be from the cylinder using either a separate
tapping or a Surrey or Essex flange on the cylinder.

Otherwise the shower, even though thermostatic, will tend to pulse hot
or cold as taps are turned on and off.



.andy


Ahh - that rather destroys an idea I had for solving my weak flow
problem !! Single story cottage, head is 4m max. so it's been an
electric shower for many years, with the annual mutterings in the mid
winter about poor flow (winter water temperatures in Scotland tend to
be a bit low !). The mutterings were usually ignored, until recently
when the other half came in contact with one of those kitchen mixer
taps on a shower hose and came proudly out of Homebase clutching one
pleased that she had got it on a 10% off day.

Muggins fitted it without reading all of the small print - those who
have read the small print, or are muggins too, know what I am talking
about - these taps have a high insertion loss and the hot water is a
piddle now.

So, as the shower and the kitchen sink are physically close I have
been thinking that I could kill the proverbial 2 birds and fit one
pump. Do I take it this is not a good idea ?

You can't put a pump on the mains.

Pump & Shower piping
 

"IMM" wrote in message ...
"Rob Graham" wrote in message
om...
Andy Hall wrote in message
. ..
On 2 Apr 2004 11:24:18 -0800, (James) wrote:



(snip)


It must be directly from the cold tank and not the mains. Don't let
him bodge it by tapping into a pipe in the airing cupboard.

The hot take off should be from the cylinder using either a separate
tapping or a Surrey or Essex flange on the cylinder.

Otherwise the shower, even though thermostatic, will tend to pulse hot
or cold as taps are turned on and off.



.andy


Ahh - that rather destroys an idea I had for solving my weak flow
problem !! Single story cottage, head is 4m max. so it's been an
electric shower for many years, with the annual mutterings in the mid
winter about poor flow (winter water temperatures in Scotland tend to
be a bit low !). The mutterings were usually ignored, until recently
when the other half came in contact with one of those kitchen mixer
taps on a shower hose and came proudly out of Homebase clutching one
pleased that she had got it on a 10% off day.

Muggins fitted it without reading all of the small print - those who
have read the small print, or are muggins too, know what I am talking
about - these taps have a high insertion loss and the hot water is a
piddle now.

So, as the shower and the kitchen sink are physically close I have
been thinking that I could kill the proverbial 2 birds and fit one
pump. Do I take it this is not a good idea ?

You can't put a pump on the mains.

Sorry - obviously didn't make it clear - the mains pressure is more
than adequate, hence the electric shower; it's the hot water supply
that has only a 3 to 4m gravity feed and this fancy mixer tap
recommends 0.5 bar minimum in the SMALL PRINT :(.

Rob

Pump & Shower piping
 

Sorry - obviously didn't make it clear - the mains pressure is more
than adequate, hence the electric shower; it's the hot water supply
that has only a 3 to 4m gravity feed and this fancy mixer tap
recommends 0.5 bar minimum in the SMALL PRINT :(.

Yes, stick a single impellor pump on the hot side only. Use a pressure
balancing brass bodied thermostatic shower mixer valve. Run the bath hot tap
off it too.

Christian.