https://twitter.com/michaelagiulia/s...41125495136267

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/un...lls-front-yard


For Brian

This might deter you from flying ...

Looks like the vibrations shook off a wing flap or something.

Andrew wrote:

https://twitter.com/michaelagiulia/s...41125495136267

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/un...lls-front-yard


For Brian

This might deter you from flying ...

Looks like the vibrations shook off a wing flap or something.

Wing flap? I dont think so. All the bits seemed to be engine cowling.
Loss of a wing flap would have been much more serious.

Tim


--
Please don't feed the trolls

On 21/02/2021 18:39, Tim+ wrote:
Andrew wrote:

https://twitter.com/michaelagiulia/s...41125495136267

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/un...lls-front-yard


For Brian

This might deter you from flying ...

Looks like the vibrations shook off a wing flap or something.

Wing flap? I dont think so. All the bits seemed to be engine cowling.
Loss of a wing flap would have been much more serious.

Tim


the 777 is doomed as is Boeing

Andrew wrote:

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/un...lls-front-yard

Juan Browne (a 777 pilot) usually does a pretty good job of
non-sensational reporting of aviation (and non-aviation) disasters ...

https://youtu.be/Tkieg1ZFcPE

Well there have been people killed by falling debris, also bits of frozen
ice from thee, um bathroom on older planes I'd not want my death certificate
to read killed by frozen **** falling on him.

Have you com across speed tape? I noticed a bit of tape apparently holding a
small panel on the side of the plane we were about to go on back in the 80s,
the attendant said it was loose so it had been speed taped back on and would
be fine until it flew back to base where some new fixings would be fitted.
I think this marvellous tape sounds like just what DIYers need for all
sorts of jobs!

Brian

--

This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Andrew" wrote in message
...

https://twitter.com/michaelagiulia/s...41125495136267

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/un...lls-front-yard


For Brian

This might deter you from flying ...

Looks like the vibrations shook off a wing flap or something.

Yes the streamlining and cosmetic bits of engines apparently often drop off
on a hard landing. It was a piece of debris like this that did for
Concorde.

Brian

--

This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Tim+" wrote in message
...
Andrew wrote:

https://twitter.com/michaelagiulia/s...41125495136267

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/un...lls-front-yard


For Brian

This might deter you from flying ...

Looks like the vibrations shook off a wing flap or something.

Wing flap? I don't think so. All the bits seemed to be engine cowling.
Loss of a wing flap would have been much more serious.

Tim


--
Please don't feed the trolls

That is a bit of a sweeping statement, I'd have thought.
Brian

--

This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Jimmy Stewart ..." wrote in message
...
On 21/02/2021 18:39, Tim+ wrote:
Andrew wrote:

https://twitter.com/michaelagiulia/s...41125495136267

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/un...lls-front-yard


For Brian

This might deter you from flying ...

Looks like the vibrations shook off a wing flap or something.

Wing flap? I don't think so. All the bits seemed to be engine cowling.
Loss of a wing flap would have been much more serious.

Tim


the 777 is doomed as is Boeing

On 22/02/2021 09:35, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
Well there have been people killed by falling debris,...

I was surprised by how little damage the debris seemed to cause. The
ring from the front of the engine was being held up by a fairly small
branch and none of the stuff that fell onto grass left any obvious gouges.

--
Colin Bignell

On 22/02/2021 10:17, nightjar wrote:
On 22/02/2021 09:35, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
Well there have been people killed by falling debris,...

I was surprised by how little damage the debris seemed to cause. The
ring from the front of the engine was being held up by a fairly small
branch and none of the stuff that fell onto grass left any obvious gouges.


A lot of the metal stuff around engines is a honeycomb of thin metal to
reduce noise so the big bits - like the cowling - would be low density,
have a relatively low terminal velocity, and make little impact.

--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

nightjar wrote:

I was surprised by how little damage the debris seemed to cause. The
ring from the front of the engine was being held up by a fairly small
branch

Having first bounced off the roof of the guy's pickup truck leaving a
GBFO dent in it!

https://denver.cbslocal.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/15909806/2021/02/GettyImages-1303235537.jpg?

https://denver.cbslocal.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/15909806/2021/02/damage-plane-debris7.jpg

Jethro_uk wrote:

If you add this - grounding of all 777s to the ongoing 737max woes

and the scrapping of many passenger 747s

and the general downturn in passenger flying, you would be selling
your Boeing shares too.

Jethro_uk wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

and the scrapping of many passenger 747s

Isn't that more predicted ?

No, all BA 747s are already gone.

On 22/02/2021 10:27, Tim Streater wrote:
On 22 Feb 2021 at 10:17:51 GMT, nightjar wrote:

On 22/02/2021 09:35, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
Well there have been people killed by falling debris,...

I was surprised by how little damage the debris seemed to cause. The
ring from the front of the engine was being held up by a fairly small
branch and none of the stuff that fell onto grass left any obvious gouges.

But before it was held up by the small branch it bounced of the roof of the
klod's pickup, crushing it.

Seems to me the pilot should get a prize, like you do at the fair when
throwing one of those rings over a pole.


No pickup shown in the pictures I saw, but that would explain it.

--
Colin Bignell

On 22/02/2021 10:36, Jethro_uk wrote:
On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 09:38:26 +0000, Brian Gaff \(Sofa\) wrote:

That is a bit of a sweeping statement, I'd have thought.
Brian

If you add this - grounding of all 777s to the ongoing 737max woes and
the general downturn in passenger flying, you would be selling your
Boeing shares too.


All 777-200 series, not all 777s. The others use different engines.

--
Colin Bignell

Andy Burns wrote in
:

Andrew wrote:

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/un...riences-loud-b
ang-giant-metal-engine-part-falls-front-yard

Juan Browne (a 777 pilot) usually does a pretty good job of
non-sensational reporting of aviation (and non-aviation) disasters ...

https://youtu.be/Tkieg1ZFcPE


Thx, agreed that is an exceptional report.

On the engine ring yard pics and truck damage, first pic, "damage, what
damage", second pic, "oh!".

Peter Burke formulated on Monday :
Thx, agreed that is an exceptional report.

On the engine ring yard pics and truck damage, first pic, "damage, what
damage", second pic, "oh!".

What's the meaning of 'heavy', in United 328 heavy?

Harry Bloomfield, Esq. wrote in news:s10jpb$v3c$1
@dont-email.me:

Peter Burke formulated on Monday :
Thx, agreed that is an exceptional report.

On the engine ring yard pics and truck damage, first pic, "damage, what
damage", second pic, "oh!".

What's the meaning of 'heavy', in United 328 heavy?


At a guess, just taken off and heavily laden with fuel.

Am 22.02.2021 um 16:48 schrieb Harry Bloomfield:
Peter Burke formulated on Monday :
Thx, agreed that is an exceptional report.

On the engine ring yard pics and truck damage, first pic, "damage, what
damage", second pic, "oh!".

What's the meaning of 'heavy', in United 328 heavy?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heavy_(aeronautics)

Matthias Czech laid this down on his screen :
Am 22.02.2021 um 16:48 schrieb Harry Bloomfield:
Peter Burke formulated on Monday :
Thx, agreed that is an exceptional report.

On the engine ring yard pics and truck damage, first pic, "damage, what
damage", second pic, "oh!".

What's the meaning of 'heavy', in United 328 heavy?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heavy_(aeronautics)

which suggests...

Heavy (aeronautics), a term used by pilots and air traffic controllers
to refer to aircraft capable of 300,000 lbs or more takeoff weight

Thanks..

Harry Bloomfield wrote:

Matthias Czech wrote:

Harry Bloomfield wrote:

What's the meaning of 'heavy', in United 328 heavy?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heavy_(aeronautics)

which suggests...
Heavy (aeronautics), a term used by pilots and air traffic controllers
to refer to aircraft capable of 300,000 lbs or more takeoff weight

And therefore of interest to pilots of smaller planes following them, as
they create greater turbulence, so the callsign suffix makes it obvious.

Tim Streater wrote in
:

On 22 Feb 2021 at 16:10:33 GMT, Peter Burke wrote:

Harry Bloomfield, Esq. wrote in
news:s10jpb$v3c$1 @dont-email.me:

What's the meaning of 'heavy', in United 328 heavy?

At a guess, just taken off and heavily laden with fuel.

No. It started when the 747 came in, to distinguish between smaller
airliners and the 500 seat jobs.

Thank you for clarifying, my bad guess.

Doubly bad as I have been known to say, "if you don't know, please don't
guess" . . .

On 22/02/2021 16:48, Chris Hogg wrote:
On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 12:33:24 +0000, Chris Hogg wrote:

On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 10:31:01 +0000, Robin wrote:

On 22/02/2021 10:17, nightjar wrote:
On 22/02/2021 09:35, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
Well there have been people killed by falling debris,...

I was surprised by how little damage the debris seemed to cause. The
ring from the front of the engine was being held up by a fairly small
branch and none of the stuff that fell onto grass left any obvious gouges.


A lot of the metal stuff around engines is a honeycomb of thin metal to
reduce noise so the big bits - like the cowling - would be low density,
have a relatively low terminal velocity, and make little impact.

Ah, but would Galileo agree with you?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galile...isa_experiment

Thinking about it again, while the terminal velocity might not be
dependent on mass, the kinetic energy certainly would be, so you were
right but for the wrong reason.


I said the terminal velocity was dependent on /density/ (not on mass).
Consider e.g. dropping a cannon ball and a beach ball of the same size
(on Earth, not on the Moon, for Apollo missions fans). Leaving aside
differences in shape and surface properties, the drag at a given speed
is the same for the 2 spheres but their weight is different. So their
terminal velocity (achieved when drag = weight) also differs. A lot.

--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 12:07:24 +0000
nightjar wrote:

On 22/02/2021 10:36, Jethro_uk wrote:
On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 09:38:26 +0000, Brian Gaff \(Sofa\) wrote:

That is a bit of a sweeping statement, I'd have thought.
Brian

If you add this - grounding of all 777s to the ongoing 737max woes and
the general downturn in passenger flying, you would be selling your
Boeing shares too.


All 777-200 series, not all 777s. The others use different engines.

--
Colin Bignell

This reminds me of my mispent youth. I recall being driven to Heathrow to watch the 707s take off. Wheras those with Rolls Royce engines showed clean exhausts, those powered by Pratt and Whitney's belched clouds of smoke.

The second recollection was when the 777 was first launched. the first fly-by-wire airplane, you would have thought the sky would have fallen in. Yet it has hardly had a spec on its character. Frankly I think it is very unfair to blame Boeing. Once the 'plane has been flying for years without airframe faults, then blame for a single engine fault can only lie with the maintenance program or the engine manufacturer but not Boeing. At least not this time.

--
Mint 20.04, kernel 5.4.0-42-generic, Cinnamon 4.6.7
running on an AMD Phenom II X4 Black edition processor with 8GB of DRAM.

On 22/02/2021 11:09, Andy Burns wrote:
Jethro_uk wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

and the scrapping of many passenger 747s

Isn't that more predicted ?

No, all BA 747s are already gone.

A freighter 747 lost a PW 4000 engine over
Holland showering the streets below with shards
of blades.

"Andy Burns" wrote in message
...
Andrew wrote:

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/un...lls-front-yard

Juan Browne (a 777 pilot) usually does a pretty good job of
non-sensational reporting of aviation (and non-aviation) disasters ...

https://youtu.be/Tkieg1ZFcPE

I wouldnt be videoing the already disintegrated engine
myself, there is some risk of it chucking another blade.

Brian, these days that would go down as a Covid-19 death.

Andrew

On 22/02/2021 09:35, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
Well there have been people killed by falling debris, also bits of frozen
ice from thee, um bathroom on older planes I'd not want my death certificate
to read killed by frozen **** falling on him.

Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote

Well there have been people killed by falling debris, also bits of frozen
ice from thee, um bathroom on older planes I'd not want my death
certificate to read killed by frozen **** falling on him.

But frozen **** is fine ? I’d have thought that frozen
**** is less likely to kill you than frozen ****.

Have you com across speed tape? I noticed a bit of tape apparently holding
a small panel on the side of the plane we were about to go on back in the
80s, the attendant said it was loose so it had been speed taped back on
and would be fine until it flew back to base where some new fixings would
be fitted. I think this marvellous tape sounds like just what DIYers need
for all sorts of jobs!

We've always had it, its called duct tape.

"Andrew" wrote in message
...

https://twitter.com/michaelagiulia/s...41125495136267

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/un...lls-front-yard


For Brian

This might deter you from flying ...

Looks like the vibrations shook off a wing flap or something.

"Brian Gaff (Sofa)" wrote in message
...
Yes the streamlining and cosmetic bits of engines apparently often drop
off on a hard landing. It was a piece of debris like this that did for
Concorde.

Nope, it came off a DC10 that had just taken off before the Concorde.

"Tim+" wrote in message
...
Andrew wrote:

https://twitter.com/michaelagiulia/s...41125495136267

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/un...lls-front-yard


For Brian

This might deter you from flying ...

Looks like the vibrations shook off a wing flap or something.

Wing flap? I don't think so. All the bits seemed to be engine cowling.
Loss of a wing flap would have been much more serious.

Tim


--
Please don't feed the trolls

nightjar wrote
Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote

Well there have been people killed by falling debris,...

I was surprised by how little damage the debris seemed to cause. The ring
from the front of the engine was being held up by a fairly small branch
and none of the stuff that fell onto grass left any obvious gouges.

Quite a bit of it is honeycomb to keep the plane weight down.

Jethro_uk wrote
Brian Gaff \(Sofa\) wrote

That is a bit of a sweeping statement, I'd have thought.

If you add this - grounding of all 777s

They arent all being grounded, just the
small subset with the PW4000 engines.

to the ongoing 737max woes and the general downturn in
passenger flying, you would be selling your Boeing shares too.

On Tue, 23 Feb 2021 08:47:23 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:


If you add this - grounding of all 777s

They arent all being grounded, just the
small subset with the PW4000 engines.

In auto-contradicting mode again, you abnormal auto-contradicting senile
pest?

--
Kerr-Mudd,John addressing the auto-contradicting senile cretin:
"Auto-contradictor Rod is back! (in the KF)"
MID:

On Tue, 23 Feb 2021 08:33:30 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:


Nope

In auto-contradicting mode again, you clinically insane cantankerous
sociopath?

--
Bod addressing abnormal senile quarreller Rot:
"Do you practice arguing with yourself in an empty room?"
MID:

"Jethro_uk" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 10:56:48 +0000, Andy Burns wrote:

Jethro_uk wrote:

If you add this - grounding of all 777s to the ongoing 737max woes

and the scrapping of many passenger 747s

Isn't that more predicted ?

However the future of air travel of whatever
volumes is likely to me more medium range
planes and fewer long haul flights.

Cant see why that should be the case.

"Jethro_uk" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 11:09:40 +0000, Andy Burns wrote:

Jethro_uk wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

and the scrapping of many passenger 747s

Isn't that more predicted ?

No, all BA 747s are already gone.

NO, I meant wasn't that pretty much anticipated ? Maybe bought forward
for other reasons, but no one was expecting to be flying in a 747-class
plane in 2031 ?

Yep, the operating economics are ****ed due to the 4 engines.

Its almost all twins now for passenger flights.

Even the A380 isnt being made anymore for the same reason.

"nightjar" wrote in message
...
On 22/02/2021 10:36, Jethro_uk wrote:
On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 09:38:26 +0000, Brian Gaff \(Sofa\) wrote:

That is a bit of a sweeping statement, I'd have thought.
Brian

If you add this - grounding of all 777s to the ongoing 737max woes and
the general downturn in passenger flying, you would be selling your
Boeing shares too.

All 777-200 series,

Nope, only the ones with that engine, the PW4000.

Most in fact have the other engine.

not all 777s. The others use different engines.

"Harry Bloomfield"; "Esq." wrote in message
...
Peter Burke formulated on Monday :
Thx, agreed that is an exceptional report.

On the engine ring yard pics and truck damage, first pic, "damage, what
damage", second pic, "oh!".

What's the meaning of 'heavy', in United 328 heavy?

Its an aircraft classification, sort of an alternative to light
aircraft but in fact its much more complicated than that.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heavy_(aeronautics)

The words medium and light arent used in radio comms in the same way.

"Peter Burke" wrote in message
...
Harry Bloomfield, Esq. wrote in news:s10jpb$v3c$1
@dont-email.me:

Peter Burke formulated on Monday :
Thx, agreed that is an exceptional report.

On the engine ring yard pics and truck damage, first pic, "damage, what
damage", second pic, "oh!".

What's the meaning of 'heavy', in United 328 heavy?


At a guess, just taken off and heavily laden with fuel.

Nope
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heavy_(aeronautics)

"Tim Streater" wrote in message
...
On 22 Feb 2021 at 16:10:33 GMT, Peter Burke wrote:

Harry Bloomfield, Esq. wrote in news:s10jpb$v3c$1
@dont-email.me:

Peter Burke formulated on Monday :
Thx, agreed that is an exceptional report.

On the engine ring yard pics and truck damage, first pic, "damage,
what
damage", second pic, "oh!".
What's the meaning of 'heavy', in United 328 heavy?


At a guess, just taken off and heavily laden with fuel.

No. It started when the 747 came in, to distinguish between smaller
airliners
and the 500 seat jobs.

It has nothing to do with seats, its actually about wingtip vortices.

"Rod Speed is an entirely modern phenomenon. Essentially, Rod Speed
is an insecure and worthless individual who has discovered he can
enhance his own self-esteem in his own eyes by playing "the big, hard
man" on the InterNet."

https://www.pcreview.co.uk/threads/r...d-faq.2973853/

--
Norman Wells addressing trolling senile Rodent:
"Ah, the voice of scum speaks."
MID: