Hi All,

A couple of local organisations are arranging meetings via Teams / WebEx
which off er the option for invitees to dial in by phone.

One includes the text

€œTap to join from a mobile device (attendees only)
+44-20-7660-8149,,1752666438#67393877# United Kingdom Toll€�

The wording to my mind suggests that this would be a Premium Rate number.
But it appears to start 020
Which doesnt €œsound€� premium to my ears (but maybe Ive not been paying
attention).

Does anyone know if this WILL be a premium number?

And if so, do WebEx / Teams have the same charging structure for all users
or does it vary according each organisations contract?


--
Chris

On 26/01/2021 09:24, Chris Holmes wrote:

Hi All,

A couple of local organisations are arranging meetings via Teams / WebEx
which off er the option for invitees to dial in by phone.

One includes the text

€œTap to join from a mobile device (attendees only)
+44-20-7660-8149,,1752666438#67393877# United Kingdom Toll€�

The wording to my mind suggests that this would be a Premium Rate number.
But it appears to start 020
Which doesnt €œsound€� premium to my ears (but maybe Ive not been paying
attention).

Does anyone know if this WILL be a premium number?

No idea but apparently legit NHS organisations appear to use it:

https://www.kch.nhs.uk/news/public/news/view/31488

Their website says it is calls charged at local rates but then they
probably cannot imagine anyone outside London dialing in!

And if so, do WebEx / Teams have the same charging structure for all users
or does it vary according each organisations contract?

No idea.
Corporate IT/accounts takes care of paying for it here.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 09:24:53 +0000, Chris Holmes wrote:

Hi All,

A couple of local organisations are arranging meetings via Teams / WebEx
which off er the option for invitees to dial in by phone.

One includes the text

€œTap to join from a mobile device (attendees only)
+44-20-7660-8149,,1752666438#67393877# United Kingdom Toll€�

The wording to my mind suggests that this would be a Premium Rate
number.
But it appears to start 020 Which doesnt €œsound€� premium to my ears
(but maybe Ive not been paying attention).

Does anyone know if this WILL be a premium number?

And if so, do WebEx / Teams have the same charging structure for all
users or does it vary according each organisations contract?

It's a standard 0207 number, which is chargeable at normal landline call
rate. You would be charged if, for example, your mobile phone contract had
limited landline minutes and you had run out.

It's not a premium rate call, for sure.

On 26/01/2021 09:24, Chris Holmes wrote:

Hi All,

A couple of local organisations are arranging meetings via Teams / WebEx
which off er the option for invitees to dial in by phone.

One includes the text

€œTap to join from a mobile device (attendees only)
+44-20-7660-8149,,1752666438#67393877# United Kingdom Toll€�

The wording to my mind suggests that this would be a Premium Rate number.
But it appears to start 020
Which doesnt €œsound€� premium to my ears (but maybe Ive not been paying
attention).

Does anyone know if this WILL be a premium number?

And if so, do WebEx / Teams have the same charging structure for all users
or does it vary according each organisations contract?



I don't read it that way.

And full context might help. E.g. in the USA "toll" is routine usage
and just makes explicit it's not "toll-free".

--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

Chris Holmes wrote:

A couple of local organisations are arranging meetings via Teams / WebEx
which off er the option for invitees to dial in by phone.

One includes the text

€œTap to join from a mobile device (attendees only)
+44-20-7660-8149,,1752666438#67393877# United Kingdom Toll€�

The wording to my mind suggests that this would be a Premium Rate number.

I think their wording is just "toll" as opposed to "toll-free 0800" so
it's a chargeable call, but not a premium rate, so depending on what
call bundles/minutes you have, chargeable doesn't necessarily result in
you being charged ...

But it appears to start 020

yes, it's just a normal London number, charged like any other 01/02/03 call.

On 26/01/2021 10:06, Andy Burns wrote:
Chris Holmes wrote:


But it appears to start 020

yes, it's just a normal London number, charged like any other 01/02/03
call.

Not sure about that. Some sources say it is a local rate number.
(although they are London based organisations saying it)

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

Martin Brown wrote:
On 26/01/2021 10:06, Andy Burns wrote:
Chris Holmes wrote:


But it appears to start 020

yes, it's just a normal London number, charged like any other 01/02/03
call.

Not sure about that. Some sources say it is a local rate number.
(although they are London based organisations saying it)

There's no longer 'local rate' is there? Charging is either
'geographical' (i.e. starts 01, 02 or 03) or something else such as 08
(which is a can of worms), 07 (which is mostly mobile) or whatever.

--
Chris Green
·

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 09:24:53 +0000, Chris Holmes wrote:

Hi All,

A couple of local organisations are arranging meetings via Teams / WebEx
which off er the option for invitees to dial in by phone.

One includes the text

€œTap to join from a mobile device (attendees only)
+44-20-7660-8149,,1752666438#67393877# United Kingdom Toll€�

The wording to my mind suggests that this would be a Premium Rate
number.
But it appears to start 020 Which doesnt €œsound€� premium to my ears
(but maybe Ive not been paying attention).

Does anyone know if this WILL be a premium number?

And if so, do WebEx / Teams have the same charging structure for all
users or does it vary according each organisations contract?

My mobile phone preferentially connects via my internet hub, so costs no
extra for calls, conference or video.

On 26/01/2021 10:40, jon wrote:
My mobile phone preferentially connects via my internet hub, so costs no
extra for calls, conference or video.

No extra for conference or video but mobile calls/texts are still
chargeable at normal ripoff rates


--
"What do you think about Gay Marriage?"
"I don't."
"Don't what?"
"Think about Gay Marriage."

On 26/01/2021 10:04, Robin wrote:
On 26/01/2021 09:24, Chris Holmes wrote:

Hi All,

A couple of local organisations are arranging meetings via Teams / WebEx
which off er the option for invitees to dial in by phone.

One includes the text

€œTap to join from a mobile device (attendees only)
+44-20-7660-8149,,1752666438#67393877# United Kingdom Toll€�

The wording to my mind suggests that this would be a Premium Rate number.
But it appears to start 020
Which doesnt €œsound€� premium to my ears (but maybe Ive not been paying
attention).

Does anyone know if this WILL be a premium number?

And if so, do WebEx / Teams have the same charging structure for all
users
or does it vary according each organisations contract?


I don't read it that way.

And full context might help.Â* E.g. in the USA "toll" is routine usage
and just makes explicit it's not "toll-free".



Other such UK numbers have

United Kingdom Toll

United Kingdom Toll 2

United Kingdom Toll free

which suggests different charging rates.

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On 26/01/2021 09:24, Chris Holmes wrote:

Hi All,

A couple of local organisations are arranging meetings via Teams / WebEx
which off er the option for invitees to dial in by phone.

One includes the text

€œTap to join from a mobile device (attendees only)
+44-20-7660-8149,,1752666438#67393877# United Kingdom Toll€�

The wording to my mind suggests that this would be a Premium Rate number.
But it appears to start 020
Which doesnt €œsound€� premium to my ears (but maybe Ive not been paying
attention).

Does anyone know if this WILL be a premium number?

And if so, do WebEx / Teams have the same charging structure for all users
or does it vary according each organisations contract?


is toll call not an American thing meaning you pay ?

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 10:42:42 +0000, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

On 26/01/2021 10:40, jon wrote:
My mobile phone preferentially connects via my internet hub, so costs
no extra for calls, conference or video.

No extra for conference or video but mobile calls/texts are still
chargeable at normal ripoff rates

Oh No... my messages are all through Signal, Telegram or WhatsApp
messengers.

On 26/01/2021 10:54, jon wrote:
On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 10:42:42 +0000, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

On 26/01/2021 10:40, jon wrote:
My mobile phone preferentially connects via my internet hub, so costs
no extra for calls, conference or video.

No extra for conference or video but mobile calls/texts are still
chargeable at normal ripoff rates

Oh No... my messages are all through Signal, Telegram or WhatsApp
messengers.

other people will text you over the mobile and may require replies and
any voice calls are still chargeable. Not everyone is on whatsapp or skype.


--
"Socialist governments traditionally do make a financial mess. They
always run out of other people's money. It's quite a characteristic of them"

Margaret Thatcher

Martin Brown wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

Chris Holmes wrote:
it's just a normal London number, charged like any other 01/02/03
call.

Not sure about that. Some sources say it is a local rate number.
(although they are London based organisations saying it)

For business lines there's no per minute difference between
local/national or day/evening/weekend calls any more, just geographic
01/02 and non-geographic 03 calls all charged at a single rate 24x7

But for residential lines there's still a difference between
local/national, day/evening/weekend rates, so that Teams number could
potentially be cheaper for some customers than others if they're in
London, but it won't be premium for anyone.

For chapter and verse see "the" price list, inland call charges subparts
1 and 2, obviously non BT/openreach suppliers may vary

http://bt.co.uk/pricing/current/Call_Charges_boo/0016_d0e1.htm#0016-d0e1

Worth reminding that there are various nasty price exceptions to look
out for within 00/05/07/08/09 ranges ...

Chris Green wrote:

There's no longer 'local rate' is there?

That's what I thought, but on checking there *is* still a local rate for
residential customers

Charging is either
'geographical' (i.e. starts 01, 02 or 03)

03 is non-geograpical, but *must* be same price as national, and must
count to inclusive bundles in the same way.

or something else such as 08
(which is a can of worms), 07 (which is mostly mobile) or whatever.

The old concept of regional codes *are* gone, so maybe it's now reduced
to same dialling code = local, anything else beginning 01/02 = national?

On 26/01/2021 09:24, Chris Holmes wrote:

Hi All,

A couple of local organisations are arranging meetings via Teams / WebEx
which off er the option for invitees to dial in by phone.

One includes the text

€œTap to join from a mobile device (attendees only)

So it will be HTML formatted so you don#t need to copy and paste the
number on a mobile device, it will just dial

+44-20-7660-8149,,1752666438#67393877# United Kingdom Toll€�



so in old money thats

020-7660-8149

The wording to my mind suggests that this would be a Premium Rate number.

No, "Toll" just means "charged for". In the USA it was/is common for
local numbers not to be charged for.

But it appears to start 020
Which doesnt €œsound€� premium to my ears (but maybe Ive not been paying
attention).


It isn't

Does anyone know if this WILL be a premium number?


No normal geographic number. So on my landline it would be 25p +
15p/minute on my mobile I have unlimited calls to such numbers so no cost.

And if so, do WebEx / Teams have the same charging structure for all users
or does it vary according each organisations contract?



I think they are all the same.

Dave

"Martin Brown" wrote in message
...
On 26/01/2021 09:24, Chris Holmes wrote:

Hi All,

A couple of local organisations are arranging meetings via Teams / WebEx
which off er the option for invitees to dial in by phone.

One includes the text

€œTap to join from a mobile device (attendees only)
+44-20-7660-8149,,1752666438#67393877# United Kingdom Toll€�

The wording to my mind suggests that this would be a Premium Rate number.
But it appears to start 020
Which doesnt €œsound€� premium to my ears (but maybe Ive not been paying
attention).

Does anyone know if this WILL be a premium number?

No idea but apparently legit NHS organisations appear to use it:

https://www.kch.nhs.uk/news/public/news/view/31488

Their website says it is calls charged at local rates but then they
probably cannot imagine anyone outside London dialing in!


When you say outside London, did you mean rest of UK or rest of World?

because if the former, you do know that "Local" call rates no longer exist
and that all UK Landline calls are charged at a single National Rate

"Andy Burns" wrote in message
...
Chris Green wrote:

There's no longer 'local rate' is there?

That's what I thought, but on checking there *is* still a local rate for
residential customers

what's a "residential" customer?

"Andy Burns" wrote in message
...
Martin Brown wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

Chris Holmes wrote:
it's just a normal London number, charged like any other 01/02/03
call.

Not sure about that. Some sources say it is a local rate number.
(although they are London based organisations saying it)

For business lines there's no per minute difference between local/national
or day/evening/weekend calls any more, just geographic 01/02 and
non-geographic 03 calls all charged at a single rate 24x7

But for residential lines there's still a difference between
local/national, day/evening/weekend rates, so that Teams number could
potentially be cheaper for some customers than others if they're in
London, but it won't be premium for anyone.

For chapter and verse see "the" price list, inland call charges subparts 1
and 2, obviously non BT/openreach suppliers may vary

http://bt.co.uk/pricing/current/Call_Charges_boo/0016_d0e1.htm#0016-d0e1


and how does one achieve this tariff?

BT marketing for new LL's clearly says that calls cost 20p/min day or night

tim... wrote:

you do know that "Local" call rates no longer exist and that all UK
Landline calls are charged at a single National Rate

Look at the first two rows ...

http://bt.co.uk/pricing/current/Call_Charges_boo/0016_d0e5.htm#0016-d0e5

tim... wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

Chris Green wrote:

There's no longer 'local rate' is there?

That's what I thought, but on checking there *is* still a local rate
for residential customers

what's a "residential" customer?

fairly obviously a "home line" not a "business line", though you can
have a business line at home.

"Andy Burns" wrote in message
...
tim... wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:
Chris Green wrote:

There's no longer 'local rate' is there?

That's what I thought, but on checking there *is* still a local rate for
residential customers

what's a "residential" customer?

fairly obviously a "home line" not a "business line", though you can have
a business line at home.

in that case then what you have said is not correct

residential customers are charged National rate for all calls 24/7

https://www.bt.com/landline/calling-costs/

"Andy Burns" wrote in message
...
tim... wrote:

you do know that "Local" call rates no longer exist and that all UK
Landline calls are charged at a single National Rate

Look at the first two rows ...

http://bt.co.uk/pricing/current/Call_Charges_boo/0016_d0e5.htm#0016-d0e5

that appears to be an unachievable tariff

see my reply to you other post or

https://www.bt.com/assets/pdf/BT_Pho...esidential.pdf

page 27

tim... wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

fairly obviously a "home line" not a "business line", though you can
have a business line at home.

in that case then what you have said is not correct
residential customers are charged National rate for all calls 24/7

https://www.bt.com/landline/calling-costs/

I see asterisks and triangles for footnotes, plus the PDF linked from
there says

"Local
BT divides the country into a large number of distinct geographical
areas. When you make a call to a €œgeographical€� number within the
same area as your own line, or to a number within an area adjacent to
your own area you will be charged at €œLocal€� rate. You can find out
which numbers you can call at Local rate in the BT Phonebook for
your location."

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 10:06:22 +0000, Andy Burns
wrote:

Chris Holmes wrote:

A couple of local organisations are arranging meetings via Teams / WebEx
which off er the option for invitees to dial in by phone.

One includes the text

“Tap to join from a mobile device (attendees only)
+44-20-7660-8149,,1752666438#67393877# United Kingdom Toll”

The wording to my mind suggests that this would be a Premium Rate number.

I think their wording is just "toll" as opposed to "toll-free 0800" so
it's a chargeable call, but not a premium rate, so depending on what
call bundles/minutes you have, chargeable doesn't necessarily result in
you being charged ...

Dare I mention toll calls vs trunk calls :-)

tim... wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

tim... wrote:

you do know that "Local" call rates no longer exist and that all UK
Landline calls are charged at a single National Rate

As I said earlier, that was what I initially thought too

Look at the first two rows ...
http://bt.co.uk/pricing/current/Call_Charges_boo/0016_d0e5.htm#0016-d0e5

that appears to be an unachievable tariff

Well, that was always taken as *the* definitive BT price list

x-post to uk.telecom added, to gather other opinions ...

"tim..." wrote in message
...


"Andy Burns" wrote in message
...
Chris Green wrote:

There's no longer 'local rate' is there?

That's what I thought, but on checking there *is* still a local rate for
residential customers

what's a "residential" customer?

The opposite of a business customer.

On Sat, 30 Jan 2021 06:09:39 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH the trolling senile asshole's latest troll**** unread

--
The Natural Philosopher about senile Rodent:
"Rod speed is not a Brexiteer. He is an Australian troll and arsehole."
Message-ID:

In article ,
Andy Burns wrote:
tim... wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

tim... wrote:

you do know that "Local" call rates no longer exist
and that all UK Landline calls are charged at a
single National Rate

As I said earlier, that was what I initially thought too

[Snip]

x-post to uk.telecom added, to gather other opinions ...

I am on Caller Plus tarif from the Phone Coop and I still
get local call rates. They also apply local rates rather
than national rates to 03xx numbers.

Local rate: Day 2.55 Night 1.02 Weekend 1.02
National rate: Day 3.06 Night 2.52 Weekend 1.51

It is a legacy tarif; been on it for 15 years? Several other
legacy tarifsalso have a lower charge for local calls than
for national ones.

--
Russell
Russell Hafter
E-mail to russell at russellhafter dot me dot uk
Need a hotel? http://www.hrs.com/?client=en__blue&customerId=416873103
Friendly web hosting https://www.xencentrichosting.uk/billing/aff.php?aff=7

On 29/01/2021 21:00, Russell Hafter News wrote:
In article ,
Andy Burns wrote:
tim... wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

tim... wrote:

you do know that "Local" call rates no longer exist
and that all UK Landline calls are charged at a
single National Rate

As I said earlier, that was what I initially thought too

[Snip]

x-post to uk.telecom added, to gather other opinions ...

I am on Caller Plus tarif from the Phone Coop and I still
get local call rates. They also apply local rates rather
than national rates to 03xx numbers.

Local rate: Day 2.55 Night 1.02 Weekend 1.02
National rate: Day 3.06 Night 2.52 Weekend 1.51

It is a legacy tarif; been on it for 15 years? Several other
legacy tarifsalso have a lower charge for local calls than
for national ones.

I am on a payg (IDNET) for landline. £10.50 a month rental, 1p a minute
to any other uk landline.

Been on it a couple of years.

https://www.idnet.com/voice_products...l_packages.php


--
Its easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled.
Mark Twain

On Fri, 29 Jan 2021 21:00:34 +0000, Russell Hafter News wrote:
It is a legacy tarif; been on it for 15 years? Several other legacy
tarifsalso have a lower charge for local calls than for national ones.

I think that's the answer - the concept of local calls still exists as
there are still people on legacy tariffs (and possibly the very rare
current one) that makes the distinction. However the vast majority of
current tariffs do not make any distinction between them.

With the way the modern network is set up, as a technical concept it
doesn't make a lot of sense. There's no guarantee that a "local" call
will travel a shorter path or use less equipment than a "long distance"
call - especially if it's on another provider's network, when the call
may cross the country to a gateway between the networks and back. With
VoIP numbers, there's no guarantee that the "local" number is even in the
area that the code belongs to.

Mike

On Sat 30/01/2021 15:00, Mike Humphrey wrote:
On Fri, 29 Jan 2021 21:00:34 +0000, Russell Hafter News wrote:
It is a legacy tarif; been on it for 15 years? Several other legacy
tarifsalso have a lower charge for local calls than for national ones.

I think that's the answer - the concept of local calls still exists as
there are still people on legacy tariffs (and possibly the very rare
current one) that makes the distinction. However the vast majority of
current tariffs do not make any distinction between them.

With the way the modern network is set up, as a technical concept it
doesn't make a lot of sense. There's no guarantee that a "local" call
will travel a shorter path or use less equipment than a "long distance"
call - especially if it's on another provider's network, when the call
may cross the country to a gateway between the networks and back. With
VoIP numbers, there's no guarantee that the "local" number is even in the
area that the code belongs to.


With VoIP there's no guarantee that the call routing is even with the
originating country!!

For interest, many years ago I was part of a contractors team that
maintained the AA radio network. They had a control centre in Leeds and
a radio node on a hilltop about 15m E of York. One night a colleague got
a callout that the private wire between Leeds and the radio site had
failed, apparently. He attended, confirmed same and rang BT. They came
back after a minute or so and said yes, indeed it had failed between
Leicester and Peterborough. Eh?
Seems that the line route was from NE Leeds direct to Bradford exchange
(note, not Leeds!), from there back to Leeds, to Leicester, to
Peterborough, to Lincoln, to York, to Pocklington, to the serving
exchange at Bishop Wilton and then to the site. What should have been a
38 mile route from Leeds direct to York and then following the above,
was actually almost 260 miles!!

In uk.d-i-y Mike Humphrey wrote:
On Fri, 29 Jan 2021 21:00:34 +0000, Russell Hafter News wrote:
It is a legacy tarif; been on it for 15 years? Several other legacy
tarifsalso have a lower charge for local calls than for national ones.

I think that's the answer - the concept of local calls still exists as
there are still people on legacy tariffs (and possibly the very rare
current one) that makes the distinction. However the vast majority of
current tariffs do not make any distinction between them.

With the way the modern network is set up, as a technical concept it
doesn't make a lot of sense. There's no guarantee that a "local" call
will travel a shorter path or use less equipment than a "long distance"
call - especially if it's on another provider's network, when the call
may cross the country to a gateway between the networks and back. With
VoIP numbers, there's no guarantee that the "local" number is even in the
area that the code belongs to.

Not to mention that VOIP providers will give you a number from any
area code, and for that matter you can often keep your old number
when you move house.

So my 'area code' 01473 doesn't necessarily indicate that another
number with the same code is in the same area. Would one that isn't
in the same area be charged as local or not?

--
Chris Green
·