On 28/01/2021 15:42, Andrew wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:52, Mark Carver wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:22, Andy Burns wrote:
Peter Able wrote:

Won't a group A aerial - particularly a big one - cripple the COM7
multiplex?

How long will CH55 be around for?Â* 700MHz auction taking place in
March?

It's on Death Row, Ofcom licence expires next June. Arqiva can pull
it at very short notice before then (as they did with COM 8)
BTW COM 8 licence is still active, also until 30/6/22, not that
Arqiva will ever bring it back

So where will BBC4 HD, News HD etc go ?.

Short term, they will probably cease on Freeview. Medium term, they
should re appear whenever the conversion of the remaining 6 muxes to
DVB-T2 starts, and flags the end of SD/HD dual emission

On 28/01/2021 16:46, Peter Able wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:52, Mark Carver wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:22, Andy Burns wrote:
Peter Able wrote:

Won't a group A aerial - particularly a big one - cripple the COM7
multiplex?

How long will CH55 be around for?Â* 700MHz auction taking place in
March?

It's on Death Row, Ofcom licence expires next June. Arqiva can pull
it at very short notice before then (as they did with COM 8)
BTW COM 8 licence is still active, also until 30/6/22, not that
Arqiva will ever bring it back

Thanks for that, both.Â* I'd no idea - but have tried to bone up and,
is this right?

All of the re-works have to happen simultaneously for things not to go
wrong?

Using a full HD TV, we'll still get the current quality and quantity
of service?

It'll offer, to Crystal Palace users with a group A aerial, the
benefit of stuff moving from C55 to lower channel numbers?

Once COM 7 on Ch 55 does close, that's it, nowhere in the UK will
anything above UHF Ch 48 be used for TV broadcasts ever again, so don't
go to too much expense to receive Ch 55 for what will only be a maximum
of 17 more months.

There is no 'roadmap' for the conversion of the remaining five DVB-T1
muxesÂ* to T2, the government seem to be preoccupied on other matters at
present !

On 29/01/2021 10:01, Mark Carver wrote:
On 28/01/2021 16:46, Peter Able wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:52, Mark Carver wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:22, Andy Burns wrote:
Peter Able wrote:

Won't a group A aerial - particularly a big one - cripple the COM7
multiplex?

How long will CH55 be around for?Â* 700MHz auction taking place in
March?

It's on Death Row, Ofcom licence expires next June. Arqiva can pull
it at very short notice before then (as they did with COM 8)
BTW COM 8 licence is still active, also until 30/6/22, not that
Arqiva will ever bring it back

Thanks for that, both.Â* I'd no idea - but have tried to bone up and,
is this right?

All of the re-works have to happen simultaneously for things not to go
wrong?

Using a full HD TV, we'll still get the current quality and quantity
of service?

It'll offer, to Crystal Palace users with a group A aerial, the
benefit of stuff moving from C55 to lower channel numbers?

Once COM 7 on Ch 55 does close, that's it, nowhere in the UK will
anything above UHF Ch 48 be used for TV broadcasts ever again, so don't
go to too much expense to receive Ch 55 for what will only be a maximum
of 17 more months.

There is no 'roadmap' for the conversion of the remaining five DVB-T1
muxesÂ* to T2, the government seem to be preoccupied on other matters at
present !


Has any one noticed patterns appearing on the national TV transmitters?

It seems that SDN, ARQ A and ARQ B are often found on chs 22, 25 and 28
or on 29, 31 & 37?

and that PSBs 1, 2, 3 are often found on chs 41, 44 & 47....

Thats what led me to think of a national SFN for SDN, ARQ A and ARQ B is
partially in the making......

On 29/01/2021 10:19, S wrote:
On 29/01/2021 10:01, Mark Carver wrote:
On 28/01/2021 16:46, Peter Able wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:52, Mark Carver wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:22, Andy Burns wrote:
Peter Able wrote:

Won't a group A aerial - particularly a big one - cripple the
COM7 multiplex?

How long will CH55 be around for?Â* 700MHz auction taking place in
March?

It's on Death Row, Ofcom licence expires next June. Arqiva can pull
it at very short notice before then (as they did with COM 8)
BTW COM 8 licence is still active, also until 30/6/22, not that
Arqiva will ever bring it back

Thanks for that, both.Â* I'd no idea - but have tried to bone up and,
is this right?

All of the re-works have to happen simultaneously for things not to
go wrong?

Using a full HD TV, we'll still get the current quality and quantity
of service?

It'll offer, to Crystal Palace users with a group A aerial, the
benefit of stuff moving from C55 to lower channel numbers?

Once COM 7 on Ch 55 does close, that's it, nowhere in the UK will
anything above UHF Ch 48 be used for TV broadcasts ever again, so
don't go to too much expense to receive Ch 55 for what will only be a
maximum of 17 more months.

There is no 'roadmap' for the conversion of the remaining five DVB-T1
muxesÂ* to T2, the government seem to be preoccupied on other matters
at present !


Has any one noticed patterns appearing on the national TV transmitters?

It seems that SDN, ARQ A and ARQ B are often found on chs 22, 25 and
28 or on 29, 31 & 37?

and that PSBs 1, 2, 3 are often found on chs 41, 44 & 47....

Thats what led me to think of a national SFN for SDN, ARQ A and ARQ B
is partially in the making......

The main 6 muxes are jammed packed with services, and with robust FEC
measures, that makes any large scale SFN working impossible. The
geographical limit for the path difference on two receivable
transmitters is about 20 miles

COM 7 is a national SFN, but with fewer services, and weaker FEC, so its
limit is about 70 miles (DAB radio has a similar figure)

In order to make the main 6 muxes nationalÂ* SFNs, you'd have to reduce
the number of services (or each service's bit rate), so it's largely
self-defeating

On 28/01/2021 22:32, Andy Burns wrote:
Peter Able wrote:

I boned up on some of that by reading
https://ukfree.tv/

Are you buying salt in bulk?


Well, I do - by the palette, actually...

I'm missing something !

PA

On 29/01/2021 10:01, Mark Carver wrote:
On 28/01/2021 16:46, Peter Able wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:52, Mark Carver wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:22, Andy Burns wrote:
Peter Able wrote:

Won't a group A aerial - particularly a big one - cripple the COM7
multiplex?

How long will CH55 be around for?Â* 700MHz auction taking place in
March?

It's on Death Row, Ofcom licence expires next June. Arqiva can pull
it at very short notice before then (as they did with COM 8)
BTW COM 8 licence is still active, also until 30/6/22, not that
Arqiva will ever bring it back

Thanks for that, both.Â* I'd no idea - but have tried to bone up and,
is this right?

All of the re-works have to happen simultaneously for things not to go
wrong?

Using a full HD TV, we'll still get the current quality and quantity
of service?

It'll offer, to Crystal Palace users with a group A aerial, the
benefit of stuff moving from C55 to lower channel numbers?

Once COM 7 on Ch 55 does close, that's it, nowhere in the UK will
anything above UHF Ch 48 be used for TV broadcasts ever again, so don't
go to too much expense to receive Ch 55 for what will only be a maximum
of 17 more months.

There is no 'roadmap' for the conversion of the remaining five DVB-T1
muxesÂ* to T2, the government seem to be preoccupied on other matters at
present !

Well, with the HP Spectrum Analyser the only effort was getting the
analyser up and down a loft ladder. I'd already installed a string crib
for the aerial, so moving it in three dimensions was no problem.

Except for all outputs of the distribution amp outputs being
50Hz-modulated. Unbelievable! The Labgear dist amp starts with a 24vAC
transformer, a bridge rectifier and then a 25v electrolytic - which was
well bulging! With that replaced by a 40v cap, C55 was no problem.

I've not been able to find a cct diag for the Labgear, so can't decide
if it was a batch build problem or an original design fault.

Afterall, 24v supply - 25v smoothing cap - what could go wrong?

PA

On 29/01/2021 10:25, Mark Carver wrote:
On 29/01/2021 10:19, S wrote:
On 29/01/2021 10:01, Mark Carver wrote:
On 28/01/2021 16:46, Peter Able wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:52, Mark Carver wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:22, Andy Burns wrote:
Peter Able wrote:

Won't a group A aerial - particularly a big one - cripple the
COM7 multiplex?

How long will CH55 be around for?Â* 700MHz auction taking place in
March?

It's on Death Row, Ofcom licence expires next June. Arqiva can pull
it at very short notice before then (as they did with COM 8)
BTW COM 8 licence is still active, also until 30/6/22, not that
Arqiva will ever bring it back

Thanks for that, both.Â* I'd no idea - but have tried to bone up and,
is this right?

All of the re-works have to happen simultaneously for things not to
go wrong?

Using a full HD TV, we'll still get the current quality and quantity
of service?

It'll offer, to Crystal Palace users with a group A aerial, the
benefit of stuff moving from C55 to lower channel numbers?

Once COM 7 on Ch 55 does close, that's it, nowhere in the UK will
anything above UHF Ch 48 be used for TV broadcasts ever again, so
don't go to too much expense to receive Ch 55 for what will only be a
maximum of 17 more months.

There is no 'roadmap' for the conversion of the remaining five DVB-T1
muxesÂ* to T2, the government seem to be preoccupied on other matters
at present !


Has any one noticed patterns appearing on the national TV transmitters?

It seems that SDN, ARQ A and ARQ B are often found on chs 22, 25 and
28 or on 29, 31 & 37?

and that PSBs 1, 2, 3 are often found on chs 41, 44 & 47....

Thats what led me to think of a national SFN for SDN, ARQ A and ARQ B
is partially in the making......

The main 6 muxes are jammed packed with services, and with robust FEC
measures, that makes any large scale SFN working impossible. The
geographical limit for the path difference on two receivable
transmitters is about 20 miles

COM 7 is a national SFN, but with fewer services, and weaker FEC, so its
limit is about 70 miles (DAB radio has a similar figure)

In order to make the main 6 muxes nationalÂ* SFNs, you'd have to reduce
the number of services (or each service's bit rate), so it's largely
self-defeating


Thanks a lot, all. I'm wiser but sadder. As my grandfather used to say,
"What a way to run a railway!"

PA

In article ,
Peter Able wrote:
On 29/01/2021 10:01, Mark Carver wrote:
On 28/01/2021 16:46, Peter Able wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:52, Mark Carver wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:22, Andy Burns wrote:
Peter Able wrote:

Won't a group A aerial - particularly a big one - cripple the COM7
multiplex?

How long will CH55 be around for? 700MHz auction taking place in
March?

It's on Death Row, Ofcom licence expires next June. Arqiva can pull
it at very short notice before then (as they did with COM 8)
BTW COM 8 licence is still active, also until 30/6/22, not that
Arqiva will ever bring it back

Thanks for that, both. I'd no idea - but have tried to bone up and,
is this right?

All of the re-works have to happen simultaneously for things not to go
wrong?

Using a full HD TV, we'll still get the current quality and quantity
of service?

It'll offer, to Crystal Palace users with a group A aerial, the
benefit of stuff moving from C55 to lower channel numbers?

Once COM 7 on Ch 55 does close, that's it, nowhere in the UK will
anything above UHF Ch 48 be used for TV broadcasts ever again, so don't
go to too much expense to receive Ch 55 for what will only be a maximum
of 17 more months.

There is no 'roadmap' for the conversion of the remaining five DVB-T1
muxes to T2, the government seem to be preoccupied on other matters at
present !

Well, with the HP Spectrum Analyser the only effort was getting the
analyser up and down a loft ladder. I'd already installed a string crib
for the aerial, so moving it in three dimensions was no problem.

Except for all outputs of the distribution amp outputs being
50Hz-modulated. Unbelievable! The Labgear dist amp starts with a 24vAC
transformer, a bridge rectifier and then a 25v electrolytic - which was
well bulging! With that replaced by a 40v cap, C55 was no problem.

I've not been able to find a cct diag for the Labgear, so can't decide
if it was a batch build problem or an original design fault.

Afterall, 24v supply - 25v smoothing cap - what could go wrong?

If it was 25v ac it should have been fine.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

Peter Able wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

Peter Able wrote:

I boned up on some of that by reading
https://ukfree.tv/

Are you buying salt in bulk?

Well, I do - by the palette, actually...

I'm missing something !

Lets just say that site doesn't have the highest reputation.

On 29/01/2021 17:03, charles wrote:
In article ,
Peter Able wrote:
On 29/01/2021 10:01, Mark Carver wrote:
On 28/01/2021 16:46, Peter Able wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:52, Mark Carver wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:22, Andy Burns wrote:
Peter Able wrote:

Won't a group A aerial - particularly a big one - cripple the COM7
multiplex?

How long will CH55 be around for? 700MHz auction taking place in
March?

It's on Death Row, Ofcom licence expires next June. Arqiva can pull
it at very short notice before then (as they did with COM 8)
BTW COM 8 licence is still active, also until 30/6/22, not that
Arqiva will ever bring it back

Thanks for that, both. I'd no idea - but have tried to bone up and,
is this right?

All of the re-works have to happen simultaneously for things not to go
wrong?

Using a full HD TV, we'll still get the current quality and quantity
of service?

It'll offer, to Crystal Palace users with a group A aerial, the
benefit of stuff moving from C55 to lower channel numbers?

Once COM 7 on Ch 55 does close, that's it, nowhere in the UK will
anything above UHF Ch 48 be used for TV broadcasts ever again, so don't
go to too much expense to receive Ch 55 for what will only be a maximum
of 17 more months.

There is no 'roadmap' for the conversion of the remaining five DVB-T1
muxes to T2, the government seem to be preoccupied on other matters at
present !

Well, with the HP Spectrum Analyser the only effort was getting the
analyser up and down a loft ladder. I'd already installed a string crib
for the aerial, so moving it in three dimensions was no problem.

Except for all outputs of the distribution amp outputs being
50Hz-modulated. Unbelievable! The Labgear dist amp starts with a 24vAC
transformer, a bridge rectifier and then a 25v electrolytic - which was
well bulging! With that replaced by a 40v cap, C55 was no problem.

I've not been able to find a cct diag for the Labgear, so can't decide
if it was a batch build problem or an original design fault.

Afterall, 24v supply - 25v smoothing cap - what could go wrong?

If it was 25v ac it should have been fine.


Dear, Oh dear! No it would not.

The capacitor will charge up to the peak - which for 24vAC would be well
over 30v.

On 29/01/2021 17:49, Andy Burns wrote:
Peter Able wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

Peter Able wrote:

I boned up on some of that by reading
https://ukfree.tv/

Are you buying salt in bulk?

Well, I do - by the palette, actually...

I'm missing something !

Lets just say that site doesn't have the highest reputation.

Seemed to be reporting the same circumstances as this NG has given - but
I'll toss some NaCl over my shoulder next time. 25kg packs, BTW, so
look out, behind!

Cheers.

PA

On 29/01/2021 19:05, Peter Able wrote:
On 29/01/2021 17:03, charles wrote:
In article ,
Â*Â*Â* Peter Able wrote:
On 29/01/2021 10:01, Mark Carver wrote:
On 28/01/2021 16:46, Peter Able wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:52, Mark Carver wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:22, Andy Burns wrote:
Peter Able wrote:

Won't a group A aerial - particularly a big one - cripple the COM7
multiplex?

How long will CH55 be around for?Â* 700MHz auction taking place in
March?

It's on Death Row, Ofcom licence expires next June. Arqiva can pull
it at very short notice before then (as they did with COM 8)
BTW COM 8 licence is still active, also until 30/6/22, not that
Arqiva will ever bring it back

Thanks for that, both.Â* I'd no idea - but have tried to bone up and,
is this right?

All of the re-works have to happen simultaneously for things not to go
wrong?

Using a full HD TV, we'll still get the current quality and quantity
of service?

It'll offer, to Crystal Palace users with a group A aerial, the
benefit of stuff moving from C55 to lower channel numbers?

Once COM 7 on Ch 55 does close, that's it, nowhere in the UK will
anything above UHF Ch 48 be used for TV broadcasts ever again, so don't
go to too much expense to receive Ch 55 for what will only be a maximum
of 17 more months.

There is no 'roadmap' for the conversion of the remaining five DVB-T1
muxesÂ* to T2, the government seem to be preoccupied on other matters at
present !

Well, with the HP Spectrum Analyser the only effort was getting the
analyser up and down a loft ladder.Â* I'd already installed a string crib
for the aerial, so moving it in three dimensions was no problem.

Except for all outputs of the distribution amp outputs being
50Hz-modulated.Â* Unbelievable! The Labgear dist amp starts with a 24vAC
transformer, a bridge rectifier and then a 25v electrolytic - which was
well bulging!Â* With that replaced by a 40v cap, C55 was no problem.

I've not been able to find a cct diag for the Labgear, so can't decide
if it was a batch build problem or an original design fault.

Afterall, 24v supply - 25v smoothing cap - what could go wrong?

If it was 25v ac it should have been fine.


Dear, Oh dear! No it would not.

The capacitor will charge up to the peak - which for 24vAC would be well
over 30v.

Not to mention what would happen over the range of permissible mains
voltage.

The capacitor, when changed was barrel-shaped with detritus around its
blow-hole - and a remanent capacity of about 0.1uF.

PA

In article , Peter Able wrote:
On 29/01/2021 17:03, charles wrote:
In article , Peter Able
wrote:
On 29/01/2021 10:01, Mark Carver wrote:
On 28/01/2021 16:46, Peter Able wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:52, Mark Carver wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:22, Andy Burns wrote:
Peter Able wrote:

Won't a group A aerial - particularly a big one - cripple the
COM7 multiplex?

How long will CH55 be around for? 700MHz auction taking place in
March?

It's on Death Row, Ofcom licence expires next June. Arqiva can pull
it at very short notice before then (as they did with COM 8) BTW
COM 8 licence is still active, also until 30/6/22, not that Arqiva
will ever bring it back

Thanks for that, both. I'd no idea - but have tried to bone up and,
is this right?

All of the re-works have to happen simultaneously for things not to
go wrong?

Using a full HD TV, we'll still get the current quality and quantity
of service?

It'll offer, to Crystal Palace users with a group A aerial, the
benefit of stuff moving from C55 to lower channel numbers?

Once COM 7 on Ch 55 does close, that's it, nowhere in the UK will
anything above UHF Ch 48 be used for TV broadcasts ever again, so
don't go to too much expense to receive Ch 55 for what will only be a
maximum of 17 more months.

There is no 'roadmap' for the conversion of the remaining five DVB-T1
muxes to T2, the government seem to be preoccupied on other matters
at present !

Well, with the HP Spectrum Analyser the only effort was getting the
analyser up and down a loft ladder. I'd already installed a string
crib for the aerial, so moving it in three dimensions was no problem.

Except for all outputs of the distribution amp outputs being
50Hz-modulated. Unbelievable! The Labgear dist amp starts with a
24vAC transformer, a bridge rectifier and then a 25v electrolytic -
which was well bulging! With that replaced by a 40v cap, C55 was no
problem.

I've not been able to find a cct diag for the Labgear, so can't decide
if it was a batch build problem or an original design fault.

Afterall, 24v supply - 25v smoothing cap - what could go wrong?

If it was 25v ac it should have been fine.


Dear, Oh dear! No it would not.

The capacitor will charge up to the peak - which for 24vAC would be well
over 30v.

That's why I said a 30v ac rating. It should cope with 30 x 1.4 volts

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

On 29/01/2021 08:44, Mark Carver wrote:

So where will BBC4 HD, News HD etc go ?.

Short term, they will probably cease on Freeview. Medium term, they
should re appear whenever the conversion of the remaining 6 muxes to
DVB-T2 starts, and flags the end of SD/HD dual emission

Yet another reason to stop paying the licence.

Bill

On 29/01/2021 16:47, Peter Able wrote:
As my grandfather used to say, "What a way to run a railway!"

As my dad used to say, "We're in a worse state than China!"

Bill

williamwright wrote:

Dave W wrote:

In your case Freesat is the way to go.

No Channel Four HD.

DVB-S1 11127V QPSK 22Msps

On 29/01/2021 23:30, Andy Burns wrote:
williamwright wrote:

Dave W wrote:

In your case Freesat is the way to go.

No Channel Four HD.

DVB-S1Â* 11127VÂ* QPSKÂ* 22Msps


Yes but a lot of Freesat boxes only work on Freesat EPG channels, or at
least the user doesn't know how to switch to non-Freesat.

Bill

On 29/01/2021 19:48, charles wrote:
In article , Peter Able wrote:
On 29/01/2021 17:03, charles wrote:
In article , Peter Able
wrote:
On 29/01/2021 10:01, Mark Carver wrote:
On 28/01/2021 16:46, Peter Able wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:52, Mark Carver wrote:
On 28/01/2021 12:22, Andy Burns wrote:
Peter Able wrote:

Won't a group A aerial - particularly a big one - cripple the
COM7 multiplex?

How long will CH55 be around for? 700MHz auction taking place in
March?

It's on Death Row, Ofcom licence expires next June. Arqiva can pull
it at very short notice before then (as they did with COM 8) BTW
COM 8 licence is still active, also until 30/6/22, not that Arqiva
will ever bring it back

Thanks for that, both. I'd no idea - but have tried to bone up and,
is this right?

All of the re-works have to happen simultaneously for things not to
go wrong?

Using a full HD TV, we'll still get the current quality and quantity
of service?

It'll offer, to Crystal Palace users with a group A aerial, the
benefit of stuff moving from C55 to lower channel numbers?

Once COM 7 on Ch 55 does close, that's it, nowhere in the UK will
anything above UHF Ch 48 be used for TV broadcasts ever again, so
don't go to too much expense to receive Ch 55 for what will only be a
maximum of 17 more months.

There is no 'roadmap' for the conversion of the remaining five DVB-T1
muxes to T2, the government seem to be preoccupied on other matters
at present !

Well, with the HP Spectrum Analyser the only effort was getting the
analyser up and down a loft ladder. I'd already installed a string
crib for the aerial, so moving it in three dimensions was no problem.

Except for all outputs of the distribution amp outputs being
50Hz-modulated. Unbelievable! The Labgear dist amp starts with a
24vAC transformer, a bridge rectifier and then a 25v electrolytic -
which was well bulging! With that replaced by a 40v cap, C55 was no
problem.

I've not been able to find a cct diag for the Labgear, so can't decide
if it was a batch build problem or an original design fault.

Afterall, 24v supply - 25v smoothing cap - what could go wrong?

If it was 25v ac it should have been fine.


Dear, Oh dear! No it would not.

The capacitor will charge up to the peak - which for 24vAC would be well
over 30v.

That's why I said a 30v ac rating. It should cope with 30 x 1.4 volts


What? Firstly, you never said that. Secondly, even if you had, tell me
how many smoothing capacitors in this sort of system would have a "30v
ac rating"? or any other voltage ac rating? None.

PA