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Default How do tradesmen earn a living?

I've just fitted a new tap to our kitchen sink. It took me nearly 4
hours. That did include altering the pipework. Plus puzzling over the
instructions on the rather complicated Bristan Easyfit tap. Great taps,
awful instructions.

But 4 hours! I'd expect to pay a plumber no more than £100-150, and that
might well include coming to quote first.
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On 05/08/2020 15:58, GB wrote:
I've just fitted a new tap to our kitchen sink. It took me nearly 4
hours. That did include altering the pipework. Plus puzzling over the
instructions on the rather complicated Bristan Easyfit tap. Great taps,
awful instructions.

But 4 hours! I'd expect to pay a plumber no more than £100-150, and that
might well include coming to quote first.

well we take ages because we want to do a good job don't have the right
tools and don't do the same job day after day....once you have done
something once the subsequent times are a doddle....usually
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On Wed, 5 Aug 2020 15:58:02 +0100, GB
wrote:

I've just fitted a new tap to our kitchen sink. It took me nearly 4
hours. That did include altering the pipework. Plus puzzling over the
instructions on the rather complicated Bristan Easyfit tap. Great taps,
awful instructions.

But 4 hours! I'd expect to pay a plumber no more than £100-150, and that
might well include coming to quote first.


The bigger question is how often would they do as good a job as you
might (assuming a reasonable level of physical competency that is)?

You want it right and may well delay the job whilst locating the right
stuff to do it with. A tradesman may have other commitments and can
only do what he/she can, what they can get quickly and easily or
what's on their van (of come back, costing more money).

You might also take longer because you may not have the tools they do
or the familiarity of doing the job. Now you have fitted that tap, how
long would it take to do another?

Cheers, T i m

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On 05/08/2020 16:18, T i m wrote:

You might also take longer because you may not have the tools they do
or the familiarity of doing the job. Now you have fitted that tap, how
long would it take to do another?


A bit quicker. Maybe 3 hours. It's not my first tap, you know.

Just as an example, I decided to alter the pipework, so the flexible
hoses wouldn't be kinked. But, there was a big dribble of solder, just
where I need to put a compression fitting. So, I got the Dremel, plus
the P3 mask, so I didn't inhale the lead. An experienced plumber might
have heated it up and wiped it off. I'll try that next time.

The more DIY work I do, the more I respect people with the skills to do
it for a living.




Cheers, T i m


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On 05/08/2020 15:58, GB wrote:

I've just fitted a new tap to our kitchen sink. It took me nearly 4
hours. That did include altering the pipework. Plus puzzling over the
instructions on the rather complicated Bristan Easyfit tap. Great taps,
awful instructions.

But 4 hours! I'd expect to pay a plumber no more than £100-150, and that
might well include coming to quote first.


I expect the answer is either; they do it in 20 mins due to experience
etc, or they simply turn the job down as its too small to make it worth
their while.

--
Cheers,

John.

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On Wed, 05 Aug 2020 15:58:02 +0100, GB wrote:

I've just fitted a new tap to our kitchen sink. It took me nearly 4
hours. That did include altering the pipework. Plus puzzling over the
instructions on the rather complicated Bristan Easyfit tap. Great taps,
awful instructions.

But 4 hours! I'd expect to pay a plumber no more than £100-150, and that
might well include coming to quote first.


I dont often do taps,but since lockdown I've had to do a number of
plumbing jobs, I reckon I'd be able to do it in well under a hour. I did
a deck mixer last week, I didnt adjust the pipework, took around 20
minutes.
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On 05/08/2020 16:18, T i m wrote:
On Wed, 5 Aug 2020 15:58:02 +0100, GB
wrote:

I've just fitted a new tap to our kitchen sink. It took me nearly 4
hours. That did include altering the pipework. Plus puzzling over the
instructions on the rather complicated Bristan Easyfit tap. Great taps,
awful instructions.

But 4 hours! I'd expect to pay a plumber no more than £100-150, and that
might well include coming to quote first.


The bigger question is how often would they do as good a job as you
might (assuming a reasonable level of physical competency that is)?

You want it right and may well delay the job whilst locating the right
stuff to do it with. A tradesman may have other commitments and can
only do what he/she can, what they can get quickly and easily or
what's on their van (of come back, costing more money).

You might also take longer because you may not have the tools they do
or the familiarity of doing the job. Now you have fitted that tap, how
long would it take to do another?

Cheers, T i m

that's what I said but the long winded version.....
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On 05/08/2020 16:59, Alan wrote:
On Wed, 05 Aug 2020 15:58:02 +0100, GB wrote:

I've just fitted a new tap to our kitchen sink. It took me nearly 4
hours. That did include altering the pipework. Plus puzzling over the
instructions on the rather complicated Bristan Easyfit tap. Great taps,
awful instructions.

But 4 hours! I'd expect to pay a plumber no more than £100-150, and that
might well include coming to quote first.


I dont often do taps,but since lockdown I've had to do a number of
plumbing jobs, I reckon I'd be able to do it in well under a hour. I did
a deck mixer last week, I didnt adjust the pipework, took around 20
minutes.


I obviously need to go in the remedial class.

It took me five minutes just getting the doors back on the cupboard.
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On Wed, 5 Aug 2020 16:36:08 +0100, GB
wrote:

On 05/08/2020 16:18, T i m wrote:

You might also take longer because you may not have the tools they do
or the familiarity of doing the job. Now you have fitted that tap, how
long would it take to do another?


A bit quicker. Maybe 3 hours. It's not my first tap, you know.


;-)

Just as an example, I decided to alter the pipework, so the flexible
hoses wouldn't be kinked.


I'm sure plenty of plumbers wouldn't have bothered to do that ...

But, there was a big dribble of solder,


Was that your doing?

just
where I need to put a compression fitting. So, I got the Dremel, plus
the P3 mask, so I didn't inhale the lead.


Can you get lead poisoning that way?

An experienced plumber might
have heated it up and wiped it off. I'll try that next time.


He's likely have a self-igniting gas blowlamp and heatproof mat to
hand so probably.

The more DIY work I do, the more I respect people with the skills to do
it for a living.

Maybe it's because I've been doing such things from a kid I respect
those people now (doing it for a living, not necessarily how they do
it).

I was reminded the other day that I ran some SWA underground for a
pond pump for a family friend when I was 15 and it's still going (63
now). ;-)

Not the same pump though.

Dad was a good carpenter but not good / inclined to do anything else
so I generally did it.

Bought this house 40+ years ago as a 'fixer upper' and the only jobs I
didn't do was replace the roof or build a new extension as it wasn't
worth me doing it on the grant we were all getting at the time to
improve the standard of these older houses (like getting an inside
toilet). ;-)

I have replaced all the windows and doors in a medium sized house with
/ for a friend and didn't lose one bit of render. ;-)

Fences, concrete floors slabs, brickwork, gas / water plumbing,
wiring, built a kitcar, built boats from plans etc, not always because
I wanted to, but because it was the only way I could afford to get it
done or what I wanted.

About the only exception would be plastering, especially ceilings as
that really is a 'craft' (especially at the speed some of these guys
work).

Still only 'Jack of all trades' of course. ;-)

Cheers, T i m
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On Wed, 5 Aug 2020 16:59:29 +0100, "Jim GM4DHJ ..."
wrote:

snip

that's what I said but the long winded version.....


But at least I manage to snip, unlike you who are rarely responding to
anything but the last line / word?

And 'of course' you will save characters if you don't bother with
punctuation or forming proper sentences and you know this isn't
****ter, it's a *discussion group*, so you aren't limited to 280 chrs?

I realise why you post here not ****ter ... you aren't limited to 2400
posts a day here!

Cheers, T i m




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On 05/08/2020 18:00, T i m wrote:

But, there was a big dribble of solder,


Was that your doing?


No. That was left by a sloppy kitchen fitter.


just
where I need to put a compression fitting. So, I got the Dremel, plus
the P3 mask, so I didn't inhale the lead.


Can you get lead poisoning that way?


It produces loads of tiny particles of lead, so I'm guessing yes.

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On 05/08/2020 18:09, T i m wrote:
On Wed, 5 Aug 2020 16:59:29 +0100, "Jim GM4DHJ ..."
wrote:

snip

that's what I said but the long winded version.....


But at least I manage to snip, unlike you who are rarely responding to
anything but the last line / word?

And 'of course' you will save characters if you don't bother with
punctuation or forming proper sentences and you know this isn't
****ter, it's a *discussion group*, so you aren't limited to 280 chrs?

I realise why you post here not ****ter ... you aren't limited to 2400
posts a day here!

Cheers, T i m





https://twitter.com/jimgm4dhj
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In article , GB
writes
I've just fitted a new tap to our kitchen sink. It took me nearly 4
hours. That did include altering the pipework. Plus puzzling over the
instructions on the rather complicated Bristan Easyfit tap. Great taps,
awful instructions.

But 4 hours! I'd expect to pay a plumber no more than £100-150, and
that might well include coming to quote first.

When did you last hire a plumber? Would probably cost you £100 just to
get one to think about coming.
--
bert
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On Wed, 5 Aug 2020 18:17:57 +0100, GB
wrote:

On 05/08/2020 18:00, T i m wrote:

But, there was a big dribble of solder,


Was that your doing?


No. That was left by a sloppy kitchen fitter.


They can often be the worst when covering fields outside the straight
fitting work.


just
where I need to put a compression fitting. So, I got the Dremel, plus
the P3 mask, so I didn't inhale the lead.


Can you get lead poisoning that way?


It produces loads of tiny particles of lead, so I'm guessing yes.


I was thinking you might be grinding (heavy partials) rather than
sanding (flying dust) but you are right, you don't really want to be
breathing it in, *even* if it is only 50% lead (rather than lead-free,
tin-antimony and tin-silver etc).

Cheers, T i m


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On Wed, 5 Aug 2020 18:39:41 +0100, "Jim GM4 DHJ ..."
wrote:

snip

I realise why you post here not ****ter ... you aren't limited to 2400
posts a day here!


https://twitter.com/jimgm4dhj


totally...so...most the stuff you post here you could post there
instead...tee hee

Cheers, T i m


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GB wrote in :

I've just fitted a new tap to our kitchen sink. It took me nearly 4
hours. That did include altering the pipework. Plus puzzling over the
instructions on the rather complicated Bristan Easyfit tap. Great
taps, awful instructions.

But 4 hours! I'd expect to pay a plumber no more than £100-150, and
that might well include coming to quote first.


You probably read the instructions - a tradesman won't as they consider
they know everything - then end up with parts left over - or wrong sealants
or things used.
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On Wednesday, 5 August 2020 17:02:24 UTC+1, GB wrote:
On 05/08/2020 16:59, Alan wrote:
On Wed, 05 Aug 2020 15:58:02 +0100, GB wrote:

I've just fitted a new tap to our kitchen sink. It took me nearly 4
hours. That did include altering the pipework. Plus puzzling over the
instructions on the rather complicated Bristan Easyfit tap. Great taps,
awful instructions.

But 4 hours! I'd expect to pay a plumber no more than £100-150, and that
might well include coming to quote first.


I dont often do taps,but since lockdown I've had to do a number of
plumbing jobs, I reckon I'd be able to do it in well under a hour. I did
a deck mixer last week, I didnt adjust the pipework, took around 20
minutes.


I obviously need to go in the remedial class.

It took me five minutes just getting the doors back on the cupboard.


It's just practice. After doing it a few times you know what to do & what works, what doesn't. Result: many times faster.


NT
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On 05/08/2020 22:38, T i m wrote:

Can you get lead poisoning that way?


It produces loads of tiny particles of lead, so I'm guessing yes.


I was thinking you might be grinding (heavy partials) rather than
sanding (flying dust) but you are right, you don't really want to be
breathing it in, *even* if it is only 50% lead (rather than lead-free,
tin-antimony and tin-silver etc).


The work was done 22 years ago, so I assume the solder had lead in it then?





Cheers, T i m



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On 05/08/2020 16:59, Alan wrote:
On Wed, 05 Aug 2020 15:58:02 +0100, GB wrote:

I've just fitted a new tap to our kitchen sink. It took me nearly 4
hours. That did include altering the pipework. Plus puzzling over the
instructions on the rather complicated Bristan Easyfit tap. Great taps,
awful instructions.

But 4 hours! I'd expect to pay a plumber no more than £100-150, and that
might well include coming to quote first.


I dont often do taps,but since lockdown I've had to do a number of
plumbing jobs, I reckon I'd be able to do it in well under a hour. I did
a deck mixer last week, I didnt adjust the pipework, took around 20
minutes.


But you never know what problems you are going to face left by the
previous installer.

For some reason the previous owner here wanted the kitchen sink taps the
"wrong way round". In other words, hot is on the right, and cold is on
the left. You have to push the quarter-turn taps away to turn them on!
That would be bad enough, but the pipework was installed to fit that
design; the vertical pipes to the taps from the horizontal distributed
H/W supply would now be in the wrong place if it was decided to fit
normally-positioned taps. I suppose you could get away by crossing
flexible hoses, but it wouldn't look very good in the cupboard under the
sink. Otherwise it's a major mess-around with new pipes.

--

Jeff
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On Thu, 6 Aug 2020 07:09:30 +0100, GB
wrote:

On 05/08/2020 22:38, T i m wrote:

Can you get lead poisoning that way?

It produces loads of tiny particles of lead, so I'm guessing yes.


I was thinking you might be grinding (heavy partials) rather than
sanding (flying dust) but you are right, you don't really want to be
breathing it in, *even* if it is only 50% lead (rather than lead-free,
tin-antimony and tin-silver etc).


The work was done 22 years ago, so I assume the solder had lead in it then?

It could well have, even if 'unleaded' plumbing solder was available
then.

You were right to be safe etc.

Cheers, T i m


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On 06/08/2020 08:18, Jeff Layman wrote:
On 05/08/2020 16:59, Alan wrote:
On Wed, 05 Aug 2020 15:58:02 +0100, GB wrote:

I've just fitted a new tap to our kitchen sink. It took me nearly 4
hours. That did include altering the pipework. Plus puzzling over the
instructions on the rather complicated Bristan Easyfit tap. Great taps,
awful instructions.

But 4 hours! I'd expect to pay a plumber no more than £100-150, and that
might well include coming to quote first.


I dont often do taps,but since lockdown I've had to do a number of
plumbing jobs, I reckon I'd be able to do it in well under a hour. I did
a deck mixer last week, I didnt adjust the pipework, took around 20
minutes.


But you never know what problems you are going to face left by the
previous installer.

For some reason the previous owner here wanted the kitchen sink taps the
"wrong way round". In other words, hot is on the right, and cold is on
the left. You have to push the quarter-turn taps away to turn them on!


You could swap the hot and cold cartridges, and then you'd be pulling
the taps to turn them on.







That would be bad enough, but the pipework was installed to fit that
design; the vertical pipes to the taps from the horizontal distributed
H/W supply would now be in the wrong place if it was decided to fit
normally-positioned taps. I suppose you could get away by crossing
flexible hoses, but it wouldn't look very good in the cupboard under the
sink. Otherwise it's a major mess-around with new pipes.


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On Thu, 6 Aug 2020 08:18:24 +0100, Jeff Layman
wrote:

snip

I suppose you could get away by crossing
flexible hoses, but it wouldn't look very good in the cupboard under the
sink.


What!? [1]

It would take me 5 minutes to empty out under the sink enough to be
able to even *see* the pipes and what sort of things do you or any
visitors do! ;-)

Visitor: "Ere, Jeff, I was just looking in the cupboard under your
sink and noticed that you have the tap flexi hoses crossed over. Care
to explain ...?" weg

'Most people' don't seem to know where the wall stops and the ceiling,
light switch, architrave starts, judging by their painting skills and
that's in plain sight so ... ?

Cheers, T i m

[1] No, I actually get it but whilst I wouldn't have installed any of
it that way if I was doing it all myself, I wouldn't have any problems
crossing some flexies if I was fixing someone else's f'up with the
least inconvenience to me (especially when it's all out of sight).
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On Wed, 05 Aug 2020 17:35:19 -0700, tabbypurr wrote:

It's just practice. After doing it a few times you know what to do &
what works, what doesn't. Result: many times faster.


Exactly.

My wife was on a video call the other day and had misconfigured her PC so
that she was using the camera microphone instead of the noise cancelling
boom one. She was asked what the rattling noise was.

It was me, on an IBM Model M keyboard.

"But what's he doing?"

"He's writing a program - brain to keyboard!"




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On 5 Aug 2020 at 15:58:02 BST, "GB" wrote:

I've just fitted a new tap to our kitchen sink. It took me nearly 4
hours. That did include altering the pipework. Plus puzzling over the
instructions on the rather complicated Bristan Easyfit tap. Great taps,
awful instructions.

But 4 hours! I'd expect to pay a plumber no more than £100-150, and that
might well include coming to quote first.


I reckon if you did the same job again in a week it'd take you 2 hours, once
more an hour.

Leave it a year, you'll be back to 4 hours ;-)

--
Cheers, Rob


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GB was thinking very hard :
I've just fitted a new tap to our kitchen sink. It took me nearly 4 hours.
That did include altering the pipework. Plus puzzling over the instructions
on the rather complicated Bristan Easyfit tap. Great taps, awful
instructions.

But 4 hours! I'd expect to pay a plumber no more than £100-150, and that
might well include coming to quote first.


A tradesman will (should) have all the tools to hand and have the
experience of what is involved to make the job much faster.


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On 05/08/2020 17:02, GB wrote:
On 05/08/2020 16:59, Alan wrote:
On Wed, 05 Aug 2020 15:58:02 +0100, GB wrote:

I've just fitted a new tap to our kitchen sink. It took me nearly 4
hours. That did include altering the pipework. Plus puzzling over the
instructions on the rather complicated Bristan Easyfit tap. Great taps,
awful instructions.

But 4 hours! I'd expect to pay a plumber no more than £100-150, and that
might well include coming to quote first.


I dont often do taps,but since lockdown I've had to do a number of
plumbing jobs, I reckon I'd be able to do it in well under a hour. I did
a deck mixer last week, I didnt adjust the pipework, took around 20
minutes.


I obviously need to go in the remedial class.

It took me five minutes just getting the doors back on the cupboard.


It usually is the problems unrelated to the actual plumbing job that
take all the time!

--
Cheers,

John.

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On 06/08/2020 09:38, GB wrote:
On 06/08/2020 08:18, Jeff Layman wrote:


For some reason the previous owner here wanted the kitchen sink taps the
"wrong way round". In other words, hot is on the right, and cold is on
the left. You have to push the quarter-turn taps away to turn them on!


You could swap the hot and cold cartridges, and then you'd be pulling
the taps to turn them on.


I like it! It's the first example I've seen of lateral lateral thinking! ;-)

--

Jeff
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On 06/08/2020 09:41, T i m wrote:
On Thu, 6 Aug 2020 08:18:24 +0100, Jeff Layman
wrote:

snip

I suppose you could get away by crossing
flexible hoses, but it wouldn't look very good in the cupboard under the
sink.


What!? [1]

It would take me 5 minutes to empty out under the sink enough to be
able to even *see* the pipes and what sort of things do you or any
visitors do! ;-)


You can do it in as short a times as that, eh? My, your cupboard /must/
be tidy.

Visitor: "Ere, Jeff, I was just looking in the cupboard under your
sink and noticed that you have the tap flexi hoses crossed over. Care
to explain ...?" weg

'Most people' don't seem to know where the wall stops and the ceiling,
light switch, architrave starts, judging by their painting skills and
that's in plain sight so ... ?

Cheers, T i m

[1] No, I actually get it but whilst I wouldn't have installed any of
it that way if I was doing it all myself, I wouldn't have any problems
crossing some flexies if I was fixing someone else's f'up with the
least inconvenience to me (especially when it's all out of sight).


Visitors? Who's taking about visitors? I'm talking about "The
Management" (aka SWMBO). whose beady eye sees all. You would never hear
the end of it - "Can't you do something about those pipes?", etc, etc. ;-)

--

Jeff
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In article , Harry Bloomfield
wrote:
GB was thinking very hard :
I've just fitted a new tap to our kitchen sink. It took me nearly 4
hours. That did include altering the pipework. Plus puzzling over the
instructions on the rather complicated Bristan Easyfit tap. Great
taps, awful instructions.

But 4 hours! I'd expect to pay a plumber no more than £100-150, and
that might well include coming to quote first.


A tradesman will (should) have all the tools to hand and have the
experience of what is involved to make the job much faster.


but, he will have left a crucial one at home.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle
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On Thu, 6 Aug 2020 11:31:19 +0100, Jeff Layman
wrote:

On 06/08/2020 09:41, T i m wrote:
On Thu, 6 Aug 2020 08:18:24 +0100, Jeff Layman
wrote:

snip

I suppose you could get away by crossing
flexible hoses, but it wouldn't look very good in the cupboard under the
sink.


What!? [1]

It would take me 5 minutes to empty out under the sink enough to be
able to even *see* the pipes and what sort of things do you or any
visitors do! ;-)


You can do it in as short a times as that, eh? My, your cupboard /must/
be tidy.


;-)

Visitor: "Ere, Jeff, I was just looking in the cupboard under your
sink and noticed that you have the tap flexi hoses crossed over. Care
to explain ...?" weg

'Most people' don't seem to know where the wall stops and the ceiling,
light switch, architrave starts, judging by their painting skills and
that's in plain sight so ... ?

Cheers, T i m

[1] No, I actually get it but whilst I wouldn't have installed any of
it that way if I was doing it all myself, I wouldn't have any problems
crossing some flexies if I was fixing someone else's f'up with the
least inconvenience to me (especially when it's all out of sight).


Visitors? Who's taking about visitors? I'm talking about "The
Management" (aka SWMBO). whose beady eye sees all.


Ah, I'm lucky, I'm with someone who knows what's important. As long as
her Yamaha XV750 Virago motorbike was suitably polished she would be
happy. ;-)

You would never hear
the end of it -


I would ...

"Can't you do something about those pipes?", etc, etc. ;-)


If mine said that (about something that was functional) she'd have to
do it herself or pay someone to do it. ;-)

Cheers, T i m


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On 06/08/2020 12:23, T i m wrote:

Ah, I'm lucky, I'm with someone who knows what's important. As long as
her Yamaha XV750 Virago motorbike was suitably polished she would be
happy. ;-)


Virago?! Do they also do a Harridan?
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On Thu, 6 Aug 2020 12:52:12 +0100, GB
wrote:

On 06/08/2020 12:23, T i m wrote:

Ah, I'm lucky, I'm with someone who knows what's important. As long as
her Yamaha XV750 Virago motorbike was suitably polished she would be
happy. ;-)


Virago?! Do they also do a Harridan?


No, I don't think they do and in any case, I think the name was to
supposed to reflect the 'attitude' of the bike, not the rider. ;-)

Cheers, T i m

p.s. She went from a Yamaha 'B-Whiz' 125 scooter on L plates on her
car licence when she was 40 (and pregnant, much to my Mums dismay (on
the bike etc)). Then took her CBT on a Kawasaki KH100 and after
passing her test (first time at ~42), went to a CG125, Virago 535 V1,
535 V2 and to the Virago 750. Before we bought the 750 the local
motorcycle shop offered her to ride one of theirs. We went there on
the 535, I initially rode the 750 (to make sure it was ok), then we
swapped over and when we got back we couldn't get her off the 750! ;-)

She ended up with one and used to also tow a camping trailer. One
holiday was motorcycle camping round the South of England / Wales
(1500 miles) and another up to Thurso and back (~2000 miles).

Happiness for her wasn't a new sofa or tidy kitchen plumbing, it was
having her bike prepped and her being able to jump on it and ride it
all day.

She was also very much part of the work we have done on the house and
building the kitcar.

Which is why we are together. ;-)
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"T i m" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 5 Aug 2020 15:58:02 +0100, GB
wrote:

I've just fitted a new tap to our kitchen sink. It took me nearly 4
hours. That did include altering the pipework. Plus puzzling over the
instructions on the rather complicated Bristan Easyfit tap. Great taps,
awful instructions.

But 4 hours! I'd expect to pay a plumber no more than £100-150, and that
might well include coming to quote first.


The bigger question is how often would they do as good a job as you
might (assuming a reasonable level of physical competency that is)?


my plasterer did a crap job (I wish I'd spotted some of the crapness before
he left)

But it's still a million times better than I could have done

HTH

tim





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"bert" wrote in message
...
In article , GB
writes
I've just fitted a new tap to our kitchen sink. It took me nearly 4 hours.
That did include altering the pipework. Plus puzzling over the
instructions on the rather complicated Bristan Easyfit tap. Great taps,
awful instructions.

But 4 hours! I'd expect to pay a plumber no more than £100-150, and that
might well include coming to quote first.

When did you last hire a plumber? Would probably cost you £100 just to get
one to think about coming.


75 quid to replace a gummed up valve in the toilet cistern

including parts





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On Thu, 6 Aug 2020 17:10:12 +0100, "tim..."
wrote:


"T i m" wrote in message
.. .
On Wed, 5 Aug 2020 15:58:02 +0100, GB
wrote:

I've just fitted a new tap to our kitchen sink. It took me nearly 4
hours. That did include altering the pipework. Plus puzzling over the
instructions on the rather complicated Bristan Easyfit tap. Great taps,
awful instructions.

But 4 hours! I'd expect to pay a plumber no more than £100-150, and that
might well include coming to quote first.


The bigger question is how often would they do as good a job as you
might (assuming a reasonable level of physical competency that is)?


my plasterer did a crap job (I wish I'd spotted some of the crapness before
he left)


Oh, the guys that did the plastering here were messy buggers but I'm
not sure you could be anything else at that workrate!

But it's still a million times better than I could have done


And that's the thing. Ok, I've done a fireplace where I've removed a
surround and hearth and re-rendered then plastered the chimney breast
etc but not a whole wall and certainly not a ceiling.

Unlike the physical bit of wiring, plumbing, tiling, carpentry and
small bits of brickwork where you can generally read up and then do a
reasonable job, plastering really is an art.

Like I've only ever worked on a couple of mobility scooters but
yesterday, the one I got for Mum couldn't really complete a small trip
with the motor getting very hot, it cutting out (overcurrent trip) and
got back with pretty low batteries. After working on it last night and
this morning, it did the same trip with ease, Mum said it was 'much
smoother' and it come back with what looks like a full battery (and
the lights working). And so it should because all the parts I worked
on are things I have done many times on different things in the past
(RC models, EV's and the electric motorbike I designed, built and
raced around 35 years ago). ;-)

Ok, you can get lucky with many things, and have it work early on, but
few do with plastering. ;-(

Cheers, T i m


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When was doing contract work I could install a complete new TV aerial in
25 minutes, including cable and testing. It was no-frills but perfectly
serviceable. How long would it take a DIYer to fit an aerial on a
chimney, align it, fix the cable, test, etc? All Saturday? And even then
it would most likely be a crap job.

http://www.wrightsaerials.tv/aerialp...iy/index.shtml

Bill
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On 06/08/2020 13:34, T i m wrote:

Which is why we are together. ;-)


She sounds great.

My DW is not terribly keen on bikes. We borrowed my son's tandem, and it
was dreadfully noisy. I was on the front seat, and she was on the back
seat. There was this dreadful screeching noise coming from the back seat.

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On 07/08/2020 03:36, williamwright wrote:
http://www.wrightsaerials.tv/aerialp...iy/index.shtml

Bill


Oh! It's you! I read some of your stuff online, years ago. *Years* ago!
Have you retired?
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On Fri, 7 Aug 2020 11:27:34 +0100, GB
wrote:

On 06/08/2020 13:34, T i m wrote:

Which is why we are together. ;-)


She sounds great.


She's great because she low maintenance. ;-)

My DW is not terribly keen on bikes. We borrowed my son's tandem, and it
was dreadfully noisy. I was on the front seat, and she was on the back
seat. There was this dreadful screeching noise coming from the back seat.


LOL!

Mine's a good stoker but (she's getting on a bit now so) can't quite
'pull her own weight', possibly not helped by her two full knee
replacements and the arthritis. eg, Whist we were going up a
reasonably steep hill on the tandem (and towing the camping trailer)
we ground to a halt. Pushing a tandem and (single wheel) trailer isn't
easy either so I got back on and was able to cycle up the hill solo.

But she's generally reasonably willing to give most stuff a go and we
have done loads of cycle touring, motorcycle touring, archery, she
used to fly power kites with me (all before arthritis and old-age
aches and pains started to kick in) and all sorts of boating. She a
good mate, if it's not something she can help with directly she's
there with the tea and sarnies or getting tools etc saving me having
to stop. Whilst working in the back yard on the scooter the other day
she was helping me when I needed her and was pulling up all the nature
that had tried to reclaim it since we last went out there when I
didn't. ;-)

When we were building the kitcar, as a special treat I let her grind
the valves in, done on a couple of newspapers on the kitchen worktop
and plenty of engineering stuff has been in the oven or dishwasher and
sometimes put in there for me by her. We were supposed to be changing
the water pump and I was delayed (watching Autocross on TV) so she
said 'I'll do it then'. I handed her the Haynes manual and off she
went. ;-)

Like me though, she would rather we be out doing other stuff than
faffing about on the house or bothering if that light matches that
wallpaper (or whatever other people bother about). It's not like we
wouldn't like the house 'nice', it's just that we are only here once
and our enjoyment is generally doing stuff outside of it. ;-)

The strange thing is, her previous bf was a mechanic but he never
involved her in anything (like that), used to just treat her as a
possession etc. When we met, I assumed we would do most stuff together
she was surprised and outside of a little reticence, has proved to
herself that she can do most things if she has a mind to, things she
was never allowed / encourage to do previously.

We tried the bring our daughter up with the same mindset ... she's a
person, not a girl or boy and therefore no reason why (again within
reason), she should be on the other end of the wardrobe getting it up
the stairs or servicing her own cycle / motorbike or car (and she does
all she can). When she was young I would take her motorcycling (on her
own bike) or to martial arts club and 'Mum' would take her ball room
dancing or to music lessons.

I am proud that she buys most of her clothes and furniture from the
charity shops, that she's happy with any hand-me-down smartphones I
can find her and that she gives most of her surplus stuff (inc
clothes) to the charity shop (mostly Isabel Hospice as that's where
her half sister died last year) and can paint and rearrange the
furniture in her own flat, rather than assuming she would need to get
'a man' to do it. I'm proud that we (this side of the family) have
taught her the real value of things, what's important, including
thinking of and caring for others. Being 'sensible / shrewd' with what
money she does earn means she can do more with what's left after
paying her rent and other expenses etc.

If she needs to do something, if she can't work out how to do it (or
the best way to do it) she calls her old Dad and will listen to my
advice ... basically because she know's I'll never BS her if I don't
know but more often or not I will know. ;-)

It's good that we are sharing vegan recipes and she will get us new
vegan stuff to try when she does our shopping (as I do most the
cooking (the Mrs clears up)). ;-)

I would consider myself a lucky man (to have a partner like mine) and
a proud father. ;-)

Cheers, T i m
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On Saturday, 8 August 2020 02:11:24 UTC+1, T i m wrote:

We tried the bring our daughter up with the same mindset ... she's a
person, not a girl or boy and therefore no reason why (again within
reason), she should be on the other end of the wardrobe getting it up
the stairs or servicing her own cycle / motorbike or car (and she does
all she can). When she was young I would take her motorcycling (on her
own bike) or to martial arts club and 'Mum' would take her ball room
dancing or to music lessons.

I am proud that she buys most of her clothes and furniture from the
charity shops, that she's happy with any hand-me-down smartphones I
can find her and that she gives most of her surplus stuff (inc
clothes) to the charity shop (mostly Isabel Hospice as that's where
her half sister died last year) and can paint and rearrange the
furniture in her own flat, rather than assuming she would need to get
'a man' to do it. I'm proud that we (this side of the family) have
taught her the real value of things, what's important, including
thinking of and caring for others. Being 'sensible / shrewd' with what
money she does earn means she can do more with what's left after
paying her rent and other expenses etc.


important life skills lacking in 99% of youngsters today
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