UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #21   Report Post  
Old July 29th 20, 10:01 PM posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Jul 2006
Posts: 23,794
Default Stick welding revelation

On 29/07/2020 20:21, Jimk wrote:
newshound Wrote in message:
On 29/07/2020 13:16, Fredxx wrote:
On 29/07/2020 02:06:31, John Rumm wrote:

snip

I wanted to weld up some bits of rebar outside, and the wind was quite
strong. So, ideal time to try it in MMA mode... and wow what a
difference! You can strike an arc with ease, it runs quiet and smooth
with a really nice stable DC arc, and makes it almost easy to get
pretty decent results with relatively little skill or practice. No
buzzing, spluttering, or sticking either.

Of course gasless wire would have done the trick too.


IME gasless wire is a bit sensitive to wind too.


Any more than separate gas in windy conditions?


Not unaffected, but still far less sensitive...

(if you look at some of the more recent project Brupeg welding, they
have been doing lots of flux core, so as to cope with the wind)

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCq9...qfhPKkKFvFkY4A


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

  #22   Report Post  
Old July 29th 20, 10:12 PM posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Jun 2016
Posts: 1,394
Default Stick welding revelation

Jimk wrote:
newshound Wrote in message:
On 29/07/2020 13:16, Fredxx wrote:
On 29/07/2020 02:06:31, John Rumm wrote:

snip

I wanted to weld up some bits of rebar outside, and the wind was quite
strong. So, ideal time to try it in MMA mode... and wow what a
difference! You can strike an arc with ease, it runs quiet and smooth
with a really nice stable DC arc, and makes it almost easy to get
pretty decent results with relatively little skill or practice. No
buzzing, spluttering, or sticking either.

Of course gasless wire would have done the trick too.


IME gasless wire is a bit sensitive to wind too.


Any more than separate gas in windy conditions?

All the advice I have seen suggests that gasless is better in outdoor
windy conditions. In fact it seems one of the reasons for choosing
gasless is when welding outdoors.

--
Chris Green
·
  #23   Report Post  
Old July 30th 20, 12:19 AM posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Jul 2006
Posts: 23,794
Default Stick welding revelation

On 29/07/2020 22:12, Chris Green wrote:
Jimk wrote:
newshound Wrote in message:
On 29/07/2020 13:16, Fredxx wrote:
On 29/07/2020 02:06:31, John Rumm wrote:

snip

I wanted to weld up some bits of rebar outside, and the wind was quite
strong. So, ideal time to try it in MMA mode... and wow what a
difference! You can strike an arc with ease, it runs quiet and smooth
with a really nice stable DC arc, and makes it almost easy to get
pretty decent results with relatively little skill or practice. No
buzzing, spluttering, or sticking either.

Of course gasless wire would have done the trick too.

IME gasless wire is a bit sensitive to wind too.


Any more than separate gas in windy conditions?

All the advice I have seen suggests that gasless is better in outdoor
windy conditions. In fact it seems one of the reasons for choosing
gasless is when welding outdoors.


There are also some "dual shield" processes that use flux core with a
shielding gas as well.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/
  #24   Report Post  
Old July 30th 20, 12:31 AM posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,582
Default Stick welding revelation

On 29/07/2020 19:39:21, John Rumm wrote:
On 29/07/2020 15:32, Fredxx wrote:
On 29/07/2020 14:33:23, John Rumm wrote:
On 29/07/2020 13:16, Fredxx wrote:
On 29/07/2020 02:06:31, John Rumm wrote:

snip

I wanted to weld up some bits of rebar outside, and the wind was
quite strong. So, ideal time to try it in MMA mode...¬* and wow what
a difference! You can strike an arc with ease, it runs quiet and
smooth with a really nice stable DC arc, and makes it almost easy
to get pretty decent results with relatively little skill or
practice. No buzzing, spluttering, or sticking either.

Of course gasless wire would have done the trick too.

Indeed, but I have not got any of that in stock[1], but still have a
third of a 5kg box of 2.5mm electrodes left (which I bought them from
CPC *years* ago :-)

[1] and the slight faff or remembering to swap the polarity.


I have welded satisfactorily when not swapping the electrodes. There
was a lot more platter though.


I think it also depends a bit on the wire chosen - some are more fussy
than others.

(It was telling that I got through about 8 rods in ten to fifteen
mins with the other welder that would have been over an hours work!)


I have a very old MIG welder and was thinking of making the jump to
TIG[1] with AC/DC provision to weld aluminium. Some machines can do
all three MMA/MIG/TIG.


I looked at a few, but most of the three in ones I looked at seemed to
only do DC tig. In the end I thought there was a danger of ending up
with a jack of all trades master of none result, and decided to get a
stand-alone setup later.


I can see your viewpoint, but inverters give ultimate control over
current and voltage. I see no reason why you can't have master of all 3.

(in fact you can do "austere" lift start DC tig with my machine, but it
obviously lacks the finesse that you get with a "real" tig machine)


So not a scratch start?
  #25   Report Post  
Old July 30th 20, 12:46 AM posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Jan 2020
Posts: 234
Default Stick welding revelation

On 29/07/2020 12:39, John Rumm wrote:
On 29/07/2020 02:29, williamwright wrote:

On 29/07/2020 02:06, John Rumm wrote:

So moral of the story, I wish I had gone for something like it years
ago, and I now have a new found respect for IGBT inverter arc welders
- they make the whole process quite civilised!


Tell me exactly what to buy. Seriously.


Well based on my limited experience, something inverter based with IGBTs
in the electronics.

If all you need is stick, then something like:

https://www.r-techwelding.co.uk/arc-...ch-pro-arc135/

(and having now used a decent welder in stick / MMA mode, it has greatly
expanded my concept of what kind of work I would be happy to tackle with
it - I would still probably not want to try welding very thin sheet
steel, but general fabrication with, bar, tube, angle, and square hollow
etc would be fine)

The one I went for is:

https://www.r-techwelding.co.uk/mig-...tech-i-mig180/

(many of the reasons being similar to the other poster in this thread
who got the same machine)

I also got a cart to stick it on, the stick electrode, and reels of both
0.8mm and 0.6mm wire, plus a few spare tips etc.

For shielding gas I found a local Mark One hire shop was also a
Hobbyweld agent:

https://hobbyweld.co.uk/

They do bottles with no rental element, so well suited to intermittent
users. The gas was £35 (plus you pay a £65 deposit with the first
bottle, but then just swap it for a full one for the price of the gas).
I went for the Hobbyweld 5 mix which is 93% Argon, 5% Carbon Dioxide, 2%
Oxygen.

The welder I bought for £50 in 1976 is beginning to get on my nerves a
bit.


ISTR the Merlin cost me about that in the late 80's, and yup, getting on
nerves seems to be about what they are best at!

With hindsight, I bought it as a solution looking for a problem - I just
thought it would be a handy thing to have. I remember telling a work
mate who I knew was into welding, and his only question was "Why?" - the
significance of the question dawned on me over the next few years, when
as each problem presented, the solution turned out to not be that good.



Thanks John. Very helpful.

Bill


  #26   Report Post  
Old July 30th 20, 01:21 AM posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Oct 2019
Posts: 502
Default Stick welding revelation

newshound Wrote in message:
On 29/07/2020 13:16, Fredxx wrote:
On 29/07/2020 02:06:31, John Rumm wrote:

snip

I wanted to weld up some bits of rebar outside, and the wind was quite
strong. So, ideal time to try it in MMA mode... and wow what a
difference! You can strike an arc with ease, it runs quiet and smooth
with a really nice stable DC arc, and makes it almost easy to get
pretty decent results with relatively little skill or practice. No
buzzing, spluttering, or sticking either.


Of course gasless wire would have done the trick too.


IME gasless wire is a bit sensitive to wind too.


Any more than separate gas in windy conditions?


--
Jimk


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/
  #27   Report Post  
Old July 30th 20, 01:21 AM posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Oct 2019
Posts: 502
Default Stick welding revelation

Chris Green Wrote in message:
Jimk wrote:
newshound Wrote in message:
On 29/07/2020 13:16, Fredxx wrote:
On 29/07/2020 02:06:31, John Rumm wrote:

snip

I wanted to weld up some bits of rebar outside, and the wind was quite
strong. So, ideal time to try it in MMA mode... and wow what a
difference! You can strike an arc with ease, it runs quiet and smooth
with a really nice stable DC arc, and makes it almost easy to get
pretty decent results with relatively little skill or practice. No
buzzing, spluttering, or sticking either.

Of course gasless wire would have done the trick too.

IME gasless wire is a bit sensitive to wind too.


Any more than separate gas in windy conditions?

All the advice I have seen suggests that gasless is better in outdoor
windy conditions. In fact it seems one of the reasons for choosing
gasless is when welding outdoors.


Indeed.
--
Jimk


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/
  #28   Report Post  
Old July 30th 20, 12:17 PM posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Jul 2006
Posts: 23,794
Default Stick welding revelation

On 30/07/2020 00:31, Fredxx wrote:
On 29/07/2020 19:39:21, John Rumm wrote:
On 29/07/2020 15:32, Fredxx wrote:
On 29/07/2020 14:33:23, John Rumm wrote:
On 29/07/2020 13:16, Fredxx wrote:
On 29/07/2020 02:06:31, John Rumm wrote:

snip

I wanted to weld up some bits of rebar outside, and the wind was
quite strong. So, ideal time to try it in MMA mode...¬* and wow
what a difference! You can strike an arc with ease, it runs quiet
and smooth with a really nice stable DC arc, and makes it almost
easy to get pretty decent results with relatively little skill or
practice. No buzzing, spluttering, or sticking either.

Of course gasless wire would have done the trick too.

Indeed, but I have not got any of that in stock[1], but still have a
third of a 5kg box of 2.5mm electrodes left (which I bought them
from CPC *years* ago :-)

[1] and the slight faff or remembering to swap the polarity.

I have welded satisfactorily when not swapping the electrodes. There
was a lot more platter though.


I think it also depends a bit on the wire chosen - some are more fussy
than others.

(It was telling that I got through about 8 rods in ten to fifteen
mins with the other welder that would have been over an hours work!)

I have a very old MIG welder and was thinking of making the jump to
TIG[1] with AC/DC provision to weld aluminium. Some machines can do
all three MMA/MIG/TIG.


I looked at a few, but most of the three in ones I looked at seemed to
only do DC tig. In the end I thought there was a danger of ending up
with a jack of all trades master of none result, and decided to get a
stand-alone setup later.


I can see your viewpoint, but inverters give ultimate control over
current and voltage. I see no reason why you can't have master of all 3.


Are you aware of any multi process machines that can do AC tig, with HF
start, foot pedal, variable frequency, mark space etc?

I found plenty that will do DC tig.

In the end I figures a separate machine would probably be easier -
especially as it would save swapping gas when swapping process.

(in fact you can do "austere" lift start DC tig with my machine, but
it obviously lacks the finesse that you get with a "real" tig machine)


So not a scratch start?


Yup, IFAIU Lift start and scratch start are just different names for the
same thing (as opposed to HF start on a more sophisticated machine)

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/
  #29   Report Post  
Old July 30th 20, 12:31 PM posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Jun 2016
Posts: 6,390
Default Stick welding revelation

John Rumm wrote:

IFAIU Lift start and scratch start are just different names for the
same thing¬* (as opposed to HF start on a more sophisticated machine)


I thought (based only on watching welders on youtube) that touching TIG
electrodes to the work was a real no-no?

Does anyone really use the terms SMAW/GMAW/GTAW rather than
stick/MIG/TIG, or is that just an American thing, or a professional
welders thing?

  #30   Report Post  
Old July 30th 20, 12:38 PM posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: May 2013
Posts: 7,034
Default Stick welding revelation

On 30/07/2020 12:31, Andy Burns wrote:
John Rumm wrote:

IFAIU Lift start and scratch start are just different names for the
same thing¬* (as opposed to HF start on a more sophisticated machine)


I thought (based only on watching welders on youtube) that touching TIG
electrodes to the work was a real no-no?

Does anyone really use the terms SMAW/GMAW/GTAW rather than
stick/MIG/TIG, or is that just an American thing, or a professional
welders thing?

I thought they were just the American terms. In the UK, MMA/MIG/TIG all
seem widely understood. There's also SAW and Electroslag and, I suppose,
thermite!


Reply
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules

Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Weiner revelation proves Comey dropped the ball on Hillary probe burfordTjustice Home Repair 0 October 29th 16 08:53 PM
'Liquid glass: the spray-on scientific revelation' Simon C. UK diy 21 February 5th 10 09:41 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 03:22 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2020 DIYbanter.
The comments are property of their posters.
 

About Us

"It's about DIY & home improvement"

 

Copyright © 2017