Electrically heated towel rail/radiator installation
 

So, it's a long story, but I went and bought a towel rail (1100mm x
500mm, HxW).
The installation instructions, which I hadn't bothered to read
beforehand, state that there must be a gap of 500mm on either side, and
that it should be 600mm from the floor (apparently to prevent leg/foot
burns). Is this regulated in some way, or can you put it lower down and
closer to an adjacent wall?
Ta.

Electrically heated towel rail/radiator installation
 

I'd have thought it should have some kind of thermostat, surely? Can you not
set it so it has a lower temperature than would cause burns?
Brian

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"Grumps" wrote in message ...
So, it's a long story, but I went and bought a towel rail (1100mm x 500mm,
HxW).
The installation instructions, which I hadn't bothered to read beforehand,
state that there must be a gap of 500mm on either side, and that it should
be 600mm from the floor (apparently to prevent leg/foot burns). Is this
regulated in some way, or can you put it lower down and closer to an
adjacent wall?
Ta.

Electrically heated towel rail/radiator installation
 

Grumps wrote:
So, it's a long story, but I went and bought a towel rail (1100mm x
500mm, HxW).
The installation instructions, which I hadn't bothered to read
beforehand, state that there must be a gap of 500mm on either side, and
that it should be 600mm from the floor (apparently to prevent leg/foot
burns). Is this regulated in some way, or can you put it lower down and
closer to an adjacent wall?
Ta.


Whos gonna check it? Put it where you want it.

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

Electrically heated towel rail/radiator installation
 

On 10/03/2020 18:14, Brian Gaff (Sofa 2) wrote:
I'd have thought it should have some kind of thermostat, surely? Can you not
set it so it has a lower temperature than would cause burns?
Brian

Is it likely to get any hotter than the 80°C of many traditional
radiators or wet towel rails?

SteveW

Electrically heated towel rail/radiator installation
 

On 11/03/2020 03:19, Steve Walker wrote:
On 10/03/2020 18:14, Brian Gaff (Sofa 2) wrote:
I'd have thought it should have some kind of thermostat, surely? Can
you not
set it so it has a lower temperature than would cause burns?
Â* Brian

Is it likely to get any hotter than the 80°C of many traditional
radiators or wet towel rails?

SteveW

Well that's what I thought too.

The whole story is...
The bathroom currently has a smallish towel radiator that is part of the
central heating system (combi boiler). It is mounted far closer to the
floor than 600mm, and the pipes run vertically from the floor directly
to the rad.
Obviously, in summer when the heating is not on, then the towel rad will
not get hot.
I know I can convert this rad to operation with an electrical element
too (a little plumbing I don't fancy doing), but I don't want to get
into a situation where the element fails and I have to remove the
plumbed-in rad just to change said element. Changing an element on an
all-electric rad is simpler.

So, for simplicity, I was just going to remove current plumbed-in rad
and cap off the pipes, and then install this electric one.
The house is going to be a rental property v.soon.

Electrically heated towel rail/radiator installation
 

On Wednesday, 11 March 2020 07:58:09 UTC, Grumps wrote:
On 11/03/2020 03:19, Steve Walker wrote:
On 10/03/2020 18:14, Brian Gaff (Sofa 2) wrote:
I'd have thought it should have some kind of thermostat, surely? Can
you not
set it so it has a lower temperature than would cause burns?
Â* Brian

Is it likely to get any hotter than the 80°C of many traditional
radiators or wet towel rails?

SteveW

Well that's what I thought too.

The whole story is...
The bathroom currently has a smallish towel radiator that is part of the
central heating system (combi boiler). It is mounted far closer to the
floor than 600mm, and the pipes run vertically from the floor directly
to the rad.
Obviously, in summer when the heating is not on, then the towel rad will
not get hot.
I know I can convert this rad to operation with an electrical element
too (a little plumbing I don't fancy doing), but I don't want to get
into a situation where the element fails and I have to remove the
plumbed-in rad just to change said element. Changing an element on an
all-electric rad is simpler.

So, for simplicity, I was just going to remove current plumbed-in rad
and cap off the pipes, and then install this electric one.
The house is going to be a rental property v.soon.

I'm not sure why you can't fit an element after closing the 2 valves on the current towel rail.

I'm not aware of any wiring regs reason to not have a low towel rail, but the item should be suitable for the task & the mfr says it isn't, though why I'm not clear. There is also the safety assesment, but I'm not sure why that would flag a hazard in this case.


NT

Electrically heated towel rail/radiator installation
 

On 11/03/2020 08:33, Chris Hogg wrote:
On Wed, 11 Mar 2020 07:58:06 +0000, Grumps wrote:

The house is going to be a rental property v.soon.

In which case sticking to the regs might be important. If the tenant
gets injured and you've not followed the regs, you might be liable.


Are there building regs for rad positions?

So the proposed location for this electric rad is in zone 3. There is
already a fused spur timeswitch on the landing (so someone was thinking
ahead).
Now to wiring up the rad. Can I just clip the wire to the skirting and
then poke it into the plasterboard cavity and connect to timer? I could
hide the cable in some of clip-on trunking. Can't lift bathroom floor as
it is tiled.

Electrically heated towel rail/radiator installation
 

On 11/03/2020 09:11, wrote:
On Wednesday, 11 March 2020 07:58:09 UTC, Grumps wrote:
On 11/03/2020 03:19, Steve Walker wrote:
On 10/03/2020 18:14, Brian Gaff (Sofa 2) wrote:
I'd have thought it should have some kind of thermostat, surely? Can
you not
set it so it has a lower temperature than would cause burns?
Â* Brian

Is it likely to get any hotter than the 80°C of many traditional
radiators or wet towel rails?

SteveW

Well that's what I thought too.

The whole story is...
The bathroom currently has a smallish towel radiator that is part of the
central heating system (combi boiler). It is mounted far closer to the
floor than 600mm, and the pipes run vertically from the floor directly
to the rad.
Obviously, in summer when the heating is not on, then the towel rad will
not get hot.
I know I can convert this rad to operation with an electrical element
too (a little plumbing I don't fancy doing), but I don't want to get
into a situation where the element fails and I have to remove the
plumbed-in rad just to change said element. Changing an element on an
all-electric rad is simpler.

So, for simplicity, I was just going to remove current plumbed-in rad
and cap off the pipes, and then install this electric one.
The house is going to be a rental property v.soon.

I'm not sure why you can't fit an element after closing the 2 valves on the current towel rail.

The current piping runs vertically from the floor, through a rad valve,
then into the rad. This is the same position as where the element needs
to go, so I'd have to add a right angle somewhere to allow the pipe to
enter the rad horizontally.

I'm not aware of any wiring regs reason to not have a low towel rail, but the item should be suitable for the task & the mfr says it isn't, though why I'm not clear. There is also the safety assesment, but I'm not sure why that would flag a hazard in this case.

NT

What happens when the element fails? You can't just unscrew it 'cos all
the water will gush out. So you have to remove rad, invert, then
replace. This must be the same for the all-electric rads too (which may
be filled with oil).

Electrically heated towel rail/radiator installation
 

On 11/03/2020 09:11, wrote:
On Wednesday, 11 March 2020 07:58:09 UTC, Grumps wrote:
On 11/03/2020 03:19, Steve Walker wrote:
On 10/03/2020 18:14, Brian Gaff (Sofa 2) wrote:
I'd have thought it should have some kind of thermostat, surely? Can
you not
set it so it has a lower temperature than would cause burns?
Â* Brian

Is it likely to get any hotter than the 80°C of many traditional
radiators or wet towel rails?

SteveW

Well that's what I thought too.

The whole story is...
The bathroom currently has a smallish towel radiator that is part of the
central heating system (combi boiler). It is mounted far closer to the
floor than 600mm, and the pipes run vertically from the floor directly
to the rad.
Obviously, in summer when the heating is not on, then the towel rad will
not get hot.
I know I can convert this rad to operation with an electrical element
too (a little plumbing I don't fancy doing), but I don't want to get
into a situation where the element fails and I have to remove the
plumbed-in rad just to change said element. Changing an element on an
all-electric rad is simpler.

So, for simplicity, I was just going to remove current plumbed-in rad
and cap off the pipes, and then install this electric one.
The house is going to be a rental property v.soon.

I'm not sure why you can't fit an element after closing the 2 valves on the current towel rail.

I'm not aware of any wiring regs reason to not have a low towel rail, but the item should be suitable for the task & the mfr says it isn't, though why I'm not clear. There is also the safety assesment, but I'm not sure why that would flag a hazard in this case.


We have elements in the rads in our bathrooms for when the CH isn't on,
ie in the summer etc. They are very effective. I just close of one of
the 'valves' on each rad, leaving the other one (the 'flow control') as
normal to allow for expansion etc.

The rads are towel rail style but, while the elements get them quite
hot, not enough to burn you.

We used to have an all electric towel rail (as well as the normal rad)
in the family bathroom. I think it was about 60W. It was used in the
summer etc. I don't recall it getting hot enough to burn you.

We have a dinky control, from Screwfix, on ours which is both a timer
and can also control the level but isn't actually thermostatic- it lacks
feedback.

Electrically heated towel rail/radiator installation
 

Grumps wrote:
On 11/03/2020 03:19, Steve Walker wrote:
On 10/03/2020 18:14, Brian Gaff (Sofa 2) wrote:
I'd have thought it should have some kind of thermostat, surely? Can
you not
set it so it has a lower temperature than would cause burns?
Â* Brian

Is it likely to get any hotter than the 80°C of many traditional
radiators or wet towel rails?

SteveW

Well that's what I thought too.

The whole story is...
The bathroom currently has a smallish towel radiator that is part of the
central heating system (combi boiler). It is mounted far closer to the
floor than 600mm, and the pipes run vertically from the floor directly
to the rad.
Obviously, in summer when the heating is not on, then the towel rad will
not get hot.
I know I can convert this rad to operation with an electrical element
too (a little plumbing I don't fancy doing), but I don't want to get
into a situation where the element fails and I have to remove the
plumbed-in rad just to change said element. Changing an element on an
all-electric rad is simpler.

So, for simplicity, I was just going to remove current plumbed-in rad
and cap off the pipes, and then install this electric one.
The house is going to be a rental property v.soon.


I really cant understand why the radiator needs to be so high or far from
adjacent walls compared to a wet radiator. Seems like over-kill from a H&S
POV.

I wouldnt be too hasty about ditching the plumbed in radiator though. The
output of a heated towel rail regularly covered in towels is a *lot* lower
than a proper radiator.

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

Electrically heated towel rail/radiator installation
 

On Wednesday, 11 March 2020 09:23:07 UTC, Grumps wrote:
On 11/03/2020 09:11, tabbypurr wrote:
On Wednesday, 11 March 2020 07:58:09 UTC, Grumps wrote:
On 11/03/2020 03:19, Steve Walker wrote:
On 10/03/2020 18:14, Brian Gaff (Sofa 2) wrote:
I'd have thought it should have some kind of thermostat, surely? Can
you not
set it so it has a lower temperature than would cause burns?
Â* Brian

Is it likely to get any hotter than the 80°C of many traditional
radiators or wet towel rails?

SteveW

Well that's what I thought too.

The whole story is...
The bathroom currently has a smallish towel radiator that is part of the
central heating system (combi boiler). It is mounted far closer to the
floor than 600mm, and the pipes run vertically from the floor directly
to the rad.
Obviously, in summer when the heating is not on, then the towel rad will
not get hot.
I know I can convert this rad to operation with an electrical element
too (a little plumbing I don't fancy doing), but I don't want to get
into a situation where the element fails and I have to remove the
plumbed-in rad just to change said element. Changing an element on an
all-electric rad is simpler.

So, for simplicity, I was just going to remove current plumbed-in rad
and cap off the pipes, and then install this electric one.
The house is going to be a rental property v.soon.

I'm not sure why you can't fit an element after closing the 2 valves on the current towel rail.

The current piping runs vertically from the floor, through a rad valve,
then into the rad. This is the same position as where the element needs
to go, so I'd have to add a right angle somewhere to allow the pipe to
enter the rad horizontally.

I'm not aware of any wiring regs reason to not have a low towel rail, but the item should be suitable for the task & the mfr says it isn't, though why I'm not clear. There is also the safety assesment, but I'm not sure why that would flag a hazard in this case.

NT

What happens when the element fails? You can't just unscrew it 'cos all
the water will gush out. So you have to remove rad, invert, then
replace. This must be the same for the all-electric rads too (which may
be filled with oil).

Close valves, place tray under where the element is. Loosen element, and once rad empty, change it.


NT

Electrically heated towel rail/radiator installation
 

On 11/03/2020 09:23, Grumps wrote:
On 11/03/2020 09:11, wrote:
On Wednesday, 11 March 2020 07:58:09 UTC, GrumpsÂ* wrote:
On 11/03/2020 03:19, Steve Walker wrote:
On 10/03/2020 18:14, Brian Gaff (Sofa 2) wrote:
I'd have thought it should have some kind of thermostat, surely? Can
you not
set it so it has a lower temperature than would cause burns?
Â*Â* Brian

Is it likely to get any hotter than the 80°C of many traditional
radiators or wet towel rails?

SteveW

Well that's what I thought too.

The whole story is...
The bathroom currently has a smallish towel radiator that is part of the
central heating system (combi boiler). It is mounted far closer to the
floor than 600mm, and the pipes run vertically from the floor directly
to the rad.
Obviously, in summer when the heating is not on, then the towel rad will
not get hot.
I know I can convert this rad to operation with an electrical element
too (a little plumbing I don't fancy doing), but I don't want to get
into a situation where the element fails and I have to remove the
plumbed-in rad just to change said element. Changing an element on an
all-electric rad is simpler.

So, for simplicity, I was just going to remove current plumbed-in rad
and cap off the pipes, and then install this electric one.
The house is going to be a rental property v.soon.

I'm not sure why you can't fit an element after closing the 2 valves
on the current towel rail.

The current piping runs vertically from the floor, through a rad valve,
then into the rad. This is the same position as where the element needs
to go, so I'd have to add a right angle somewhere to allow the pipe to
enter the rad horizontally.

Typically, you buy a T piece which fits to the leg with the element. The
Heater goes through two ports into the rad, the lockshield valve into
the third.



I'm not aware of any wiring regs reason to not have a low towel rail,
but the item should be suitable for the task & the mfr says it isn't,
though why I'm not clear. There is also the safety assesment, but I'm
not sure why that would flag a hazard in this case.

NT

What happens when the element fails? You can't just unscrew it 'cos all
the water will gush out. So you have to remove rad, invert, then
replace. This must be the same for the all-electric rads too (which may
be filled with oil).


Essentially, yes. I replaced one, it wasn't a big deal. As it was the
upstairs en-suite, I did a partial drain down so there was naff all to
gush out.

Not sure about the oil filled ones. The one we had seemed to be sealed
for life but I didn't look that closely.

Electrically heated towel rail/radiator installation
 

On 11/03/2020 13:04, wrote:
On Wednesday, 11 March 2020 09:23:07 UTC, Grumps wrote:
On 11/03/2020 09:11, tabbypurr wrote:
On Wednesday, 11 March 2020 07:58:09 UTC, Grumps wrote:
On 11/03/2020 03:19, Steve Walker wrote:
On 10/03/2020 18:14, Brian Gaff (Sofa 2) wrote:
I'd have thought it should have some kind of thermostat, surely? Can
you not
set it so it has a lower temperature than would cause burns?
Â* Brian

Is it likely to get any hotter than the 80°C of many traditional
radiators or wet towel rails?

SteveW

Well that's what I thought too.

The whole story is...
The bathroom currently has a smallish towel radiator that is part of the
central heating system (combi boiler). It is mounted far closer to the
floor than 600mm, and the pipes run vertically from the floor directly
to the rad.
Obviously, in summer when the heating is not on, then the towel rad will
not get hot.
I know I can convert this rad to operation with an electrical element
too (a little plumbing I don't fancy doing), but I don't want to get
into a situation where the element fails and I have to remove the
plumbed-in rad just to change said element. Changing an element on an
all-electric rad is simpler.

So, for simplicity, I was just going to remove current plumbed-in rad
and cap off the pipes, and then install this electric one.
The house is going to be a rental property v.soon.

I'm not sure why you can't fit an element after closing the 2 valves on the current towel rail.

The current piping runs vertically from the floor, through a rad valve,
then into the rad. This is the same position as where the element needs
to go, so I'd have to add a right angle somewhere to allow the pipe to
enter the rad horizontally.

I'm not aware of any wiring regs reason to not have a low towel rail, but the item should be suitable for the task & the mfr says it isn't, though why I'm not clear. There is also the safety assesment, but I'm not sure why that would flag a hazard in this case.

NT

What happens when the element fails? You can't just unscrew it 'cos all
the water will gush out. So you have to remove rad, invert, then
replace. This must be the same for the all-electric rads too (which may
be filled with oil).

Close valves, place tray under where the element is. Loosen element, and once rad empty, change it.


NT

Sounds simple.

When you refill the rad, close the valves, then turn on the element, is
there a potential expansion problem?

Electrically heated towel rail/radiator installation
 

The 600mm above the floor seems a bit ridiculous it, would put the top out the radiator almost 6 foot off the floor. The 500mm side spacing might be to allow replacement of the element but I would imagine it would only be to one side assuming you have a choice which side the element is fitted. Maybe that is the reason for the vertical height if like many towel radiators the openings for the valves are positioned vertically?

Richard

Electrically heated towel rail/radiator installation
 

In article ,
Grumps wrote:
So, it's a long story, but I went and bought a towel rail (1100mm x
500mm, HxW).
The installation instructions, which I hadn't bothered to read
beforehand, state that there must be a gap of 500mm on either side, and
that it should be 600mm from the floor (apparently to prevent leg/foot
burns). Is this regulated in some way, or can you put it lower down and
closer to an adjacent wall?
Ta.

I'd want it high enough so bath towels don't reach the floor, and air can
circulate round them too?

--
*Vegetarians taste great*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.