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Old February 9th 20, 12:41 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.computer.workshop,uk.d-i-y,alt.home.repair
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Default Why doesn't everything use solid aluminium capacitors?

Motherboards used them over a decade ago, so why do I still find leaking electrolytics in TVs? https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/...herboard-line?

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Old February 9th 20, 12:55 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.computer.workshop,uk.d-i-y,alt.home.repair
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Default Why doesn't everything use solid aluminium capacitors?

On 09/02/2020 11:41:25, Commander Kinsey wrote:
Motherboards used them over a decade ago, so why do I still find leaking
electrolytics in TVs?
https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/...herboard-line?



Cost.
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Old February 9th 20, 01:59 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,uk.d-i-y,alt.home.repair
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Default Why doesn't everything use solid aluminium capacitors?

Commander Kinsey wrote:
Motherboards used them over a decade ago, so why do I still find leaking
electrolytics in TVs?
https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/...herboard-line?


They're polymer capacitors (polymer takes place of liquid electrolyte)
and are used selectively in equipment. See the second picture down on
the right, for a typical appearance. They lack pressure relief seams.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polymer_capacitor

After the "capacitor plague", where poorly made (bad pH value) electrolyte
was used to make some capacitors, some motherboard makers sought to "distance
themselves" from electrolytics. The slightly different shape of the
polymer capacitors was a "see, ma, no leaky cans" kinda thing. It
was a visual distinction, intended to fool/convince buyers that
they had nothing to fear. Before that introduction, polymer caps
were already being used on video cards. They were more popular
there. They're probably also a bit more expensive.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor_plague

In the retail motherboard business, the customers see what's
on the motherboard. You have to market to appearances.

In your TV set, the components are not exposed in the same way.
Marketing consists of "look, thin bezels", or "now with built
in spyware". No mention is made of what corners are cut
in the power supply section. If you look at LCD monitors and
the power board in there, the absolute cheapest manufacturing
is used for the power board (sorta the equivalent of what you'd
find in a $20 ATX PSU).

There is nothing wrong with electrolytic capacitors if they're
made properly. Consequently, just because you find a cap
with a pressure relief pattern embossed in the top of the
cap, is no reason to panic.

It's hard to say whether any scumbag is still making caps
using that stolen/incorrect electrolyte formula.

And as to "why do people continue to do bad things",
it's a calculus. "Will I be executed or put in jail?"
That's the question they have to ask themselves every day.

"22 May 2019 Ozone layer: Banned CFCs traced to China say scientists"

https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-48353341

Paul
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Old February 9th 20, 02:44 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.computer.workshop,uk.d-i-y,alt.home.repair
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Default Why doesn't everything use solid aluminium capacitors?

Cost.

Commander Kinsey wrote

Motherboards used them over a decade ago, so why do I still find leaking
electrolytics in TVs?


Cost.

https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/...herboard-line?


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Old February 9th 20, 02:47 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.computer.workshop,uk.d-i-y,alt.home.repair
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Posts: 4,496
Default CAUTION!!! Birdbrain, the Abnormal Pathological Attention Whore, Strikes, AGAIN!

On Sun, 09 Feb 2020 11:41:25 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (aka "Commander Kinsey",
"James Wilkinson", "Steven ******","Bruce Farquar", "Fred Johnson, etc.),
the pathological resident idiot and attention whore of all the uk ngs,
blathered again:

FLUSH the sociopathic attention whore's latest attention-baiting sick
bull**** unread again

--
about Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL)
trolling:
"He is a well known attention seeking troll and every reply you
make feeds him.
Starts many threads most of which die quick as on the UK groups anyone
with sense Kill filed him ages ago which is why he now cross posts to
the US groups for a new audience.
This thread was unusual in that it derived and continued without him
to a large extent and his silly questioning is an attempt to get
noticed again."
MID:

--
ItsJoanNotJoann addressing Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL):
"You're an annoying troll and I'm done with you and your
stupidity."
MID:

--
AndyW addressing Birdbrain:
"Troll or idiot?...
You have been presented with a viewpoint with information, reasoning,
historical cases, citations and references to back it up and wilfully
ignore all going back to your idea which has no supporting information."
MID:

--
Phil Lee adressing Birdbrain Macaw:
"You are too stupid to be wasting oxygen."
MID:

--
Phil Lee describing Birdbrain Macaw:
"I've never seen such misplaced pride in being a ****ing moronic motorist."
MID:

--
Tony944 addressing Birdbrain Macaw:
"I seen and heard many people but you are on top of list being first class
ass hole jerk. ...You fit under unconditional Idiot and should be put in
mental institution.
MID:

--
Pelican to Birdbrain Macaw:
"Ok. I'm persuaded . You are an idiot."
MID:

--
DerbyDad03 addressing Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson" LOL):
"Frigging Idiot. Get the hell out of my thread."
MID:

--
Kerr Mudd-John about Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson" LOL):
"It's like arguing with a demented frog."
MID:

--
Mr Pounder Esquire about Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson" LOL):
"the **** poor delivery boy with no hot running water, 11 cats and
several parrots living in his hovel."
MID:

--
Rob Morley about Birdbrain:
"He's a perennial idiot"
MID: [email protected]

--
JoeyDee to Birdbrain
"I apologize for thinking you were a jerk. You're just someone with an IQ
lower than your age, and I accept that as a reason for your comments."
MID: l-september.org

--
Sam Plusnet about Birdbrain (now "James Wilkinson Sword" LOL):
"He's just desperate to be noticed. Any attention will do, no matter how
negative it may be."
MID:

--
asking Birdbrain:
"What, were you dropped on your head as a child?"
MID:

--
Christie addressing endlessly driveling Birdbrain Macaw (now "James
Wilkinson" LOL):
"What are you resurrecting that old post of mine for? It's from last
month some time. You're like a dog who's just dug up an old bone they
hid in the garden until they were ready to have another go at it."
MID:

--
Mr Pounder's fitting description of Birdbrain Macaw:
"You are a well known fool, a tosser, a pillock, a stupid unemployable
sponging failure who will always live alone and will die alone. You will not
be missed."
MID:

--
Richard to pathetic ****** Hucker:
"You haven't bred?
Only useful thing you've done in your pathetic existence."
MID:

--
about Birdbrain (now "James Wilkinson" LOL):
""not the sharpest knife in the drawer"'s parents sure made a serious
mistake having him born alive -- A total waste of oxygen, food, space,
and bandwidth."
MID:

--
Mr Pounder exposing sociopathic Birdbrain:
"You will always be a lonely sociopath living in a ******** with no hot
running water with loads of stinking cats and a few parrots."
MID:

--
francis about Birdbrain (now "James Wilkinson" LOL):
"He seems to have a reputation as someone of limited intelligence"
MID:

--
Peter Moylan about Birdbrain (now "James Wilkinson" LOL):
"If people like JWS didn't exist, we would have to find some other way to
explain the concept of "invincible ignorance"."
MID:

--
Lewis about nym-shifting Birdbrain:
"Typical narcissist troll, thinks his **** is so grand he has the right to
try to force it on everyone."
MID:


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Old February 9th 20, 02:48 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.computer.workshop,uk.d-i-y,alt.home.repair
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Posts: 4,496
Default Troll-feeding Senile IDIOT Alert! LOL

On Sun, 9 Feb 2020 11:55:15 +0000, Fredxx, the notorious, troll-feeding,
senile asshole, blathered again:


Cost.


Troll, you troll-feeding senile idiot!
  #7   Report Post  
Old February 9th 20, 02:52 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,uk.d-i-y,alt.home.repair
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First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Jun 2019
Posts: 4,496
Default Troll-feeding Senile IDIOT Alert! LOL

On Sun, 09 Feb 2020 07:59:37 -0500, Paul, another miserable, troll-feeding,
senile idiot, blathered:


They're polymer capacitors (polymer takes place of liquid electrolyte)


FLUSH

ALL his posts are TROLLS, poor senile idiot! Any your "reply" was a total
waste. Just wait and see! BG
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Old February 9th 20, 03:18 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.computer.workshop,uk.d-i-y,alt.home.repair
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Posts: 2,121
Default Why doesn't everything use solid aluminium capacitors?

On Sun, 09 Feb 2020 13:44:19 -0000, Rod Speed wrote:

Cost.

Commander Kinsey wrote

Motherboards used them over a decade ago, so why do I still find leaking
electrolytics in TVs?


Cost.

https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/...herboard-line?


I tried to find the cheapest normal and solid capacitors on Ebay, as an example 270uf, 16V:
Normal: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/123940375447
Solid: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/361349708743
3.94 for normal, 3.83 for solid, so pretty much the same price.
Sizing also almost equal: 12x9mm vs 12x8mm (the solid ones are slightly smaller)
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Old February 9th 20, 03:21 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,uk.d-i-y,alt.home.repair,alt.computer.workshop
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First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Dec 2018
Posts: 2,121
Default Why doesn't everything use solid aluminium capacitors?

On Sun, 09 Feb 2020 12:59:37 -0000, Paul wrote:

Commander Kinsey wrote:
Motherboards used them over a decade ago, so why do I still find leaking
electrolytics in TVs?
https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/...herboard-line?


They're polymer capacitors (polymer takes place of liquid electrolyte)
and are used selectively in equipment. See the second picture down on
the right, for a typical appearance. They lack pressure relief seams.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polymer_capacitor

After the "capacitor plague", where poorly made (bad pH value) electrolyte
was used to make some capacitors, some motherboard makers sought to "distance
themselves" from electrolytics. The slightly different shape of the
polymer capacitors was a "see, ma, no leaky cans" kinda thing. It
was a visual distinction, intended to fool/convince buyers that
they had nothing to fear. Before that introduction, polymer caps
were already being used on video cards. They were more popular
there. They're probably also a bit more expensive.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor_plague

In the retail motherboard business, the customers see what's
on the motherboard. You have to market to appearances.

In your TV set, the components are not exposed in the same way.
Marketing consists of "look, thin bezels", or "now with built
in spyware". No mention is made of what corners are cut
in the power supply section. If you look at LCD monitors and
the power board in there, the absolute cheapest manufacturing
is used for the power board (sorta the equivalent of what you'd
find in a $20 ATX PSU).

There is nothing wrong with electrolytic capacitors if they're
made properly. Consequently, just because you find a cap
with a pressure relief pattern embossed in the top of the
cap, is no reason to panic.

It's hard to say whether any scumbag is still making caps
using that stolen/incorrect electrolyte formula.

And as to "why do people continue to do bad things",
it's a calculus. "Will I be executed or put in jail?"
That's the question they have to ask themselves every day.

"22 May 2019 Ozone layer: Banned CFCs traced to China say scientists"

https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-48353341


I've repaired many TVs from big manufacturers all with leaking capacitors. It's clear that they all wear out after a while, especially in hot environments.

And cost and size is not a problem, they're pretty much the same:

I tried to find the cheapest normal and solid capacitors on Ebay, as an example 270uf, 16V:
Normal: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/123940375447
Solid: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/361349708743
3.94 for normal, 3.83 for solid, so pretty much the same price.
Sizing also almost equal: 12x9mm vs 12x8mm (the solid ones are slightly smaller)
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Old February 9th 20, 03:21 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.computer.workshop,uk.d-i-y,alt.home.repair
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First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Dec 2018
Posts: 2,121
Default Why doesn't everything use solid aluminium capacitors?

On Sun, 09 Feb 2020 11:55:15 -0000, Fredxx wrote:

On 09/02/2020 11:41:25, Commander Kinsey wrote:
Motherboards used them over a decade ago, so why do I still find leaking
electrolytics in TVs?
https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/...herboard-line?



Cost.


I tried to find the cheapest normal and solid capacitors on Ebay, as an example 270uf, 16V:
Normal: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/123940375447
Solid: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/361349708743
3.94 for normal, 3.83 for solid, so pretty much the same price.
Sizing also almost equal: 12x9mm vs 12x8mm (the solid ones are slightly smaller)


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