Tim Streater wrote:

I also haven't been able to find the debt in £ terms
rather than as a %-age of GDP.
Year Population net public debt
million £billion
1990 57.238 151.90
1991 57.439 151.10
1992 57.585 165.80
1993 57.714 201.90
1994 57.862 249.80
1995 58.025 290.00
1996 58.164 322.10
1997 58.314 347.00
1998 58.475 358.60
1999 58.684 357.80
2000 58.886 349.30
2001 59.113 316.70
2002 59.366 323.10
2003 59.637 356.20
2004 59.950 391.00
2005 60.413 446.50
2006 60.827 487.20
2007 61.319 523.60
2008 61.824 557.20
2009 62.261 768.30
2010 62.760 1011.90
2011 63.285 1157.60
2012 63.705 1253.10
2013 64.106 1363.60
2014 64.597 1464.40
2015 65.110 1554.70
2016 65.648 1602.60
2017 66.040 1726.70
2018 66.466 1778.90
2019 66.867 1803.40
2020 67.255 1838.20 (est)

I only see one year where the debt reduced (2001 must have been a good
year for Gordon)

https://www.ukpublicspending.co.uk/download_multi_year_1990_2020UKb_17c1li111mcn_G1t

In article ,
Andy Burns wrote:
Tim Streater wrote:

I also haven't been able to find the debt in £ terms
rather than as a %-age of GDP.
Year Population net public debt
million £billion
1990 57.238 151.90
1991 57.439 151.10
1992 57.585 165.80
1993 57.714 201.90
1994 57.862 249.80
1995 58.025 290.00
1996 58.164 322.10
1997 58.314 347.00
1998 58.475 358.60
1999 58.684 357.80
2000 58.886 349.30
2001 59.113 316.70
2002 59.366 323.10
2003 59.637 356.20
2004 59.950 391.00
2005 60.413 446.50
2006 60.827 487.20
2007 61.319 523.60
2008 61.824 557.20
2009 62.261 768.30
2010 62.760 1011.90
2011 63.285 1157.60
2012 63.705 1253.10
2013 64.106 1363.60
2014 64.597 1464.40
2015 65.110 1554.70
2016 65.648 1602.60
2017 66.040 1726.70
2018 66.466 1778.90
2019 66.867 1803.40
2020 67.255 1838.20 (est)

Right.

So between 1990 and 1997 under the Tories, 229% increase.

From 97 to 2007 under Blair, 152% increase.

After the crash and the Tories back in power:-

2010 to 2020 under the Tories (and LDs) 181% increase.

Which suggests Blair (and Brown as chancellor) managed the economy the
best in recent times?

--
*Any connection between your reality and mine is purely coincidental

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman wrote:

So between 1990 and 1997 under the Tories, 229% increase.

From 97 to 2007 under Blair, 152% increase.

After the crash and the Tories back in power:-

2010 to 2020 under the Tories (and LDs) 181% increase.

Which suggests Blair (and Brown as chancellor) managed the economy the
best in recent times?

Yesbut ... supertanker turning circles and all that, one government's
previous policies don't stop having impact immediately another
government takes power.

This is a DIY group so I'm glad to see people looking at such figures
but, please, don't just bash away. For a start, looking at raw figures
distorts any comparisons. You need to adjust for inflation.

There's impartial guidance out there on this stuff. See eg

https://fullfact.org/economy/labour-...national-debt/


--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Andy Burns wrote:
Tim Streater wrote:

I also haven't been able to find the debt in £ terms
rather than as a %-age of GDP.
Year Population net public debt
million £billion
1990 57.238 151.90
1991 57.439 151.10
1992 57.585 165.80
1993 57.714 201.90
1994 57.862 249.80
1995 58.025 290.00
1996 58.164 322.10
1997 58.314 347.00
1998 58.475 358.60
1999 58.684 357.80
2000 58.886 349.30
2001 59.113 316.70
2002 59.366 323.10
2003 59.637 356.20
2004 59.950 391.00
2005 60.413 446.50
2006 60.827 487.20
2007 61.319 523.60
2008 61.824 557.20
2009 62.261 768.30
2010 62.760 1011.90
2011 63.285 1157.60
2012 63.705 1253.10
2013 64.106 1363.60
2014 64.597 1464.40
2015 65.110 1554.70
2016 65.648 1602.60
2017 66.040 1726.70
2018 66.466 1778.90
2019 66.867 1803.40
2020 67.255 1838.20 (est)

Right.

So between 1990 and 1997 under the Tories, 229% increase.

From 97 to 2007 under Blair, 152% increase.

After the crash and the Tories back in power:-

Pity about the doubling in just 3 years between
2007 and 2010 which you carefully leave out.

2010 to 2020 under the Tories (and LDs) 181% increase.

Which suggests Blair (and Brown as chancellor)
managed the economy the best in recent times?

Only if you deliberately ignore the time between 2007 and
2010 which was due to their stupidity of deregulating the banks.

Robin wrote

This is a DIY group so I'm glad to see people looking at such figures but,
please, don't just bash away. For a start, looking at raw figures
distorts any comparisons. You need to adjust for inflation.

Not with the short term between 2007-2010

There's impartial guidance out there on this stuff. See eg

https://fullfact.org/economy/labour-...national-debt/

On Thu, 19 Dec 2019 14:39:00 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

distorts any comparisons. You need to adjust for inflation.

Not

"Not", you auto-contradicting, senile asshole? LOL

--
Kerr-Mudd,John addressing senile Rot:
"Auto-contradictor Rod is back! (in the KF)"
MID:

In article ,
Andy Burns wrote:
Dave Plowman wrote:

So between 1990 and 1997 under the Tories, 229% increase.

From 97 to 2007 under Blair, 152% increase.

After the crash and the Tories back in power:-

2010 to 2020 under the Tories (and LDs) 181% increase.

Which suggests Blair (and Brown as chancellor) managed the economy the
best in recent times?

Yesbut ... supertanker turning circles and all that, one government's
previous policies don't stop having impact immediately another
government takes power.

So it's OK 10 years down the line for the Tories still to be blaming every
woe on the previous Labour government? ;-)

But at least now they'll blame every future woe on the EU.

--
*The more I learn about women, the more I love my car

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Chris Hogg wrote:
Which suggests Blair (and Brown as chancellor) managed the economy the
best in recent times?

I see you cherry-pick your dates (cherries?) with care. Labour
government 1997 - 2010, 192% increase.

The discussion was about the Blair government.

--
*Warning: Dates in Calendar are closer than they appear.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Tim Streater wrote:
Which suggests Blair (and Brown as chancellor) managed the economy the
best in recent times?

Dave still being dim or just plain lying, I see. Leave your successor
government with a huge annual deficit, watch the debt shoot up on the
successor government's watch.

You'll be one of those who blame the international banking crash on the
Labour government, then? Or say it was just a coincidence?

--
*I like cats, too. Let's exchange recipes.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Chris Hogg wrote:
On Thu, 19 Dec 2019 14:27:31 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article ,
Chris Hogg wrote:
Which suggests Blair (and Brown as chancellor) managed the economy the
best in recent times?

I see you cherry-pick your dates (cherries?) with care. Labour
government 1997 - 2010, 192% increase.

The discussion was about the Blair government.

Yes, I thought you'd wriggle out of any criticism of the labour Govt
as a whole. You are so predictable!

Really? Then you'd know I'm in favour of a left of centre government. Like
the Blair one.

--
*I'm out of my mind, but feel free to leave a message.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article ,
Chris Hogg wrote:
On Thu, 19 Dec 2019 14:27:31 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article ,
Chris Hogg wrote:
Which suggests Blair (and Brown as chancellor) managed the economy the
best in recent times?

I see you cherry-pick your dates (cherries?) with care. Labour
government 1997 - 2010, 192% increase.

The discussion was about the Blair government.

Yes, I thought you'd wriggle out of any criticism of the labour Govt
as a whole. You are so predictable!

Really? Then you'd know I'm in favour of a left of centre government. Like
the Blair one.

It is one of the subtleties of the British political system that the
Blair government introduced more neo-liberal, right wing policies than
the Tories have often dared to do. The scheme our masters operate seems
to be to allow a "Labour" government in boom times so policy can be
subtly shifted to favour the rich (PFI anyone?) while wages and
employment are relatively high, and then contrive a Tory government when
it is necessary to lower real wages, which would be embarrassing for a
"Labour" government to do. No wonder they advised us not to like Mr
Corbyn. No, I don't believe Blair ran a "left of centre" government.

--

Roger Hayter

In article , Andy Burns
writes
Dave Plowman wrote:

So between 1990 and 1997 under the Tories, 229% increase.
From 97 to 2007 under Blair, 152% increase.
After the crash and the Tories back in power:-
2010 to 2020 under the Tories (and LDs) 181% increase.
Which suggests Blair (and Brown as chancellor) managed the economy
the
best in recent times?

Yesbut ... supertanker turning circles and all that, one government's
previous policies don't stop having impact immediately another
government takes power.


Which is why for a while after 1997 Labour seemed to be doing OK. They
were still following the previous governments red book. As soon as that
expired they ran out of cash and first to go were the gold reserves at
rock bottom price.
--
bert

In article , "Dave Plowman (News)"
writes
In article ,
Tim Streater wrote:
Which suggests Blair (and Brown as chancellor) managed the economy the
best in recent times?

Dave still being dim or just plain lying, I see. Leave your successor
government with a huge annual deficit, watch the debt shoot up on the
successor government's watch.

You'll be one of those who blame the international banking crash on the
Labour government, then? Or say it was just a coincidence?

It was a credit crunch in the US. I do blame the Labour government for
dragging LTSB into the mess. Many of their salaried staff lost most of
their savings.
--
bert

In article , "Dave Plowman (News)"
writes
In article ,
Andy Burns wrote:
Dave Plowman wrote:

So between 1990 and 1997 under the Tories, 229% increase.

From 97 to 2007 under Blair, 152% increase.

After the crash and the Tories back in power:-

2010 to 2020 under the Tories (and LDs) 181% increase.

Which suggests Blair (and Brown as chancellor) managed the economy the
best in recent times?

Yesbut ... supertanker turning circles and all that, one government's
previous policies don't stop having impact immediately another
government takes power.

So it's OK 10 years down the line for the Tories still to be blaming every
woe on the previous Labour government? ;-)

The woes are finally sorted. More money now for the NHS, more money for
education, more money for the police, more money for northern
infrastructure etc etc.
But at least now they'll blame every future woe on the EU.

We'll soon be free of the drag that is the EU.
--
bert

In article ,
bert wrote:
So it's OK 10 years down the line for the Tories still to be blaming
every woe on the previous Labour government? ;-)

The woes are finally sorted. More money now for the NHS, more money for
education, more money for the police, more money for northern
infrastructure etc etc.

Good to know you're willing to pay more tax to fund all of those.
Or has the magic money tree been finally found?

--
*Remember not to forget that which you do not need to know.*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
bert wrote:
So it's OK 10 years down the line for the Tories still to be blaming
every woe on the previous Labour government? ;-)

The woes are finally sorted. More money now for the NHS, more money for
education, more money for the police, more money for northern
infrastructure etc etc.

Good to know you're willing to pay more tax to fund all of those.
Or has the magic money tree been finally found?


yes its called jeremy corbyn
did you read the Labour party election manifesto
https://labour.org.uk/wp-content/upl...festo-2019.pdf

-

In article ,
Mark wrote:

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
bert wrote:
So it's OK 10 years down the line for the Tories still to be blaming
every woe on the previous Labour government? ;-)

The woes are finally sorted. More money now for the NHS, more money for
education, more money for the police, more money for northern
infrastructure etc etc.

Good to know you're willing to pay more tax to fund all of those.
Or has the magic money tree been finally found?


yes its called jeremy corbyn

Did labour win the election, then? You live and learn.

did you read the Labour party election manifesto
https://labour.org.uk/wp-content/upl...festo-2019.pdf

-

--
*Procrastination is the art of keeping up with yesterday.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.