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UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions. |
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#1
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Pipes, Joists & Floorboards
Many years ago, I put down T&G floorboards in the bedroom. I've ripped up the
carpet in the landing to continue T&G into the landing. The problem is that, when I did the bedroom, I used a 190mm, plain board to avoid a joint over the pipes. It seemed a good idea at the time but, over time, traffic has created a crack in stages, length-wise along the 190mm board. Any suggestions as to how I can fix this, firstly in the bedroom and then before I attempt the landing? https://www.homeownershub.com/img/jr |
#2
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Pipes, Joists & Floorboards
190mm seems an odd size for T&G? If you used a plain softwood board to make up the gap in the floor then I am not surprised it cracked eventually. Simple solution might be to replace it with an appropriate thickness ply. Personally as the pipes should be towards one wall of the room approx. one quarter of the joist length maximum from the wall then I would be tempted to rip the T&G up to the wall and re-lay it from the last board trimming the final board up to the wall.
Richard |
#3
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Pipes, Joists & Floorboards
On 06/10/2019 16:14, Gummo wrote:
Many years ago, I put down T&G floorboards in the bedroom. I've ripped up the carpet in the landing to continue T&G into the landing. The problem is that, when I did the bedroom, I used a 190mm, plain board to avoid a joint over the pipes. It seemed a good idea at the time but, over time, traffic has created a crack in stages, length-wise along the 190mm board. Any suggestions as to how I can fix this, firstly in the bedroom and then before I attempt the landing? https://www.homeownershub.com/img/jr From the photo it looks like the wide board has cracked as a result of being fixed at both edges. Wood will tend to expand and contract with changes in humidity, and mostly across the grain. So the board got drier, shrunk and split because its edges were fixed. With wide T&G boards, you can often do hidden fixings by screwing at an angle through the tongues. That fixing then also holds the groove side of the adjacent board, but does not prevent it pulling away if necessary. Moving forward you could use an engineered board - i.e. a 1/4" real wood surface bonded onto a ply substrate. That won't exhibit the same movement. -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#4
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Pipes, Joists & Floorboards
On Sunday, 6 October 2019 16:14:05 UTC+1, Gummo wrote:
Many years ago, I put down T&G floorboards in the bedroom. I've ripped up the carpet in the landing to continue T&G into the landing. The problem is that, when I did the bedroom, I used a 190mm, plain board to avoid a joint over the pipes. It seemed a good idea at the time but, over time, traffic has created a crack in stages, length-wise along the 190mm board. Any suggestions as to how I can fix this, firstly in the bedroom and then before I attempt the landing? Is there a corresponding crack in the ceiling below? If so, you have a problem. |
#5
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Pipes, Joists & Floorboards
replying to Tricky Dicky, Gummo wrote:
It was a plain board which was hoped to be a permanent bridge over the pipes but sadly lasted approx 20 years. I like the idea of using ply - wondering what to ask for in terms of getting a pine-like patina to match the T&G. -- for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/uk-diy...s-1386977-.htm |
#6
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Pipes, Joists & Floorboards
replying to John Rumm, Gummo wrote:
I have only 19mm to play with - I'd need 12/13mm ply beneath - does that exist? -- for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/uk-diy...s-1386977-.htm |
#7
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Pipes, Joists & Floorboards
replying to harry, Gummo wrote:
No - it's all down to the board and the notches below. -- for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/uk-diy...s-1386977-.htm |
#8
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Pipes, Joists & Floorboards
Classic plumbing error not considering how the floorboards are going back when notching the joists. Since this is upstairs I do not know why you have pipe insulation, I would remove it and see if you can bring the pipes together and fit some blocks in to narrow the notches so a single T&G board will span the pipes thus you can fix either side of the pipes. If the pipe diameters will not allow that then consider what I normally do which is to lift two boards and run the pipes on the centre line of each board, it will probably mean you will have to re-install some of the pipework and making good some of the excess notching.
Richard |
#9
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Pipes, Joists & Floorboards
Tricky Dicky wrote:
Classic plumbing error not considering how the floorboards are going back when notching the joists. Since this is upstairs I do not know why you have pipe insulation, I would remove it and see if you can bring the pipes together and fit some blocks in to narrow the notches so a single T&G board will span the pipes thus you can fix either side of the pipes. If the pipe diameters will not allow that then consider what I normally do which is to lift two boards and run the pipes on the centre line of each board, it will probably mean you will have to re-install some of the pipework and making good some of the excess notching. Richard I believe building regs require you to insulate pretty well all water pipes nowadays, for economy reasons rather then frost protection. This does not adversely affect your second suggestion though. -- Roger Hayter |
#10
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Pipes, Joists & Floorboards
On Sunday, 6 October 2019 16:14:05 UTC+1, Gummo wrote:
Many years ago, I put down T&G floorboards in the bedroom. I've ripped up the carpet in the landing to continue T&G into the landing. The problem is that, when I did the bedroom, I used a 190mm, plain board to avoid a joint over the pipes. It seemed a good idea at the time but, over time, traffic has created a crack in stages, length-wise along the 190mm board. Any suggestions as to how I can fix this, firstly in the bedroom and then before I attempt the landing? https://www.homeownershub.com/img/jr Replace it with 1 side only t&G-ed, after adding extra support under it close to the pipe. Fix it nearish the non-t&g edge, permitting expansion/contraction movement. NT |
#11
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Pipes, Joists & Floorboards
On 08/10/2019 09:41, Roger Hayter wrote:
Tricky Dicky wrote: Classic plumbing error not considering how the floorboards are going back when notching the joists. Since this is upstairs I do not know why you have pipe insulation, I would remove it and see if you can bring the pipes together and fit some blocks in to narrow the notches so a single T&G board will span the pipes thus you can fix either side of the pipes. If the pipe diameters will not allow that then consider what I normally do which is to lift two boards and run the pipes on the centre line of each board, it will probably mean you will have to re-install some of the pipework and making good some of the excess notching. Richard I believe building regs require you to insulate pretty well all water pipes nowadays, for economy reasons rather then frost protection. This does not adversely affect your second suggestion though. Although I have insulated my pipes, I'd not be too worried about not insulating central heating pipes upstairs - any heat lost will be lost into the building. SteveW |
#12
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Pipes, Joists & Floorboards
On 08/10/2019 21:19, Steve Walker wrote:
On 08/10/2019 09:41, Roger Hayter wrote: Tricky Dicky wrote: Classic plumbing error not considering how the floorboards are going back when notching the joists. Since this is upstairs I do not know why you have pipe insulation, I would remove it and see if you can bring the pipes together and fit some blocks in to narrow the notches so a single T&G board will span the pipes thus you can fix either side of the pipes. If the pipe diameters will not allow that then consider what I normally do which is to lift two boards and run the pipes on the centre line of each board, it will probably mean you will have to re-install some of the pipework and making good some of the excess notching. Richard I believe building regs require you to insulate pretty well all water pipes nowadays, for economy reasons rather then frost protection.Â* This does not adversely affect your second suggestion though. Although I have insulated my pipes, I'd not be too worried about not insulating central heating pipes upstairs - any heat lost will be lost into the building. Wrapping the pipes can prevent them rubbing against the joists and hence creaking. I would strongly recommend doing it. |
#13
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Pipes, Joists & Floorboards
On 09/10/2019 17:02, Pancho wrote:
On 08/10/2019 21:19, Steve Walker wrote: On 08/10/2019 09:41, Roger Hayter wrote: Tricky Dicky wrote: Classic plumbing error not considering how the floorboards are going back when notching the joists. Since this is upstairs I do not know why you have pipe insulation, I would remove it and see if you can bring the pipes together and fit some blocks in to narrow the notches so a single T&G board will span the pipes thus you can fix either side of the pipes. If the pipe diameters will not allow that then consider what I normally do which is to lift two boards and run the pipes on the centre line of each board, it will probably mean you will have to re-install some of the pipework and making good some of the excess notching. Richard I believe building regs require you to insulate pretty well all water pipes nowadays, for economy reasons rather then frost protection.Â* This does not adversely affect your second suggestion though. Although I have insulated my pipes, I'd not be too worried about not insulating central heating pipes upstairs - any heat lost will be lost into the building. Wrapping the pipes can prevent them rubbing against the joists and hence creaking. I would strongly recommend doing it. If it is purely for noise, then simply wrapping at the joist will do that. As I said, I have insulated my pipes, but only between the joists. Where they pass through existing notches, there is just a very thin layer of material to keep them from touching. SteveW |
#14
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Pipes, Joists & Floorboards
replying to Tricky Dicky, Gummo wrote:
Thanks for the tips. -- for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/uk-diy...s-1386977-.htm |
#15
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Pipes, Joists & Floorboards
replying to tabbypurr, Gummo wrote:
Will do - thanks. -- for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/uk-diy...s-1386977-.htm |
#16
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Pipes, Joists & Floorboards
You might be able to solve the landing problem without altering the pipes as you say you are going to T&G it. I would put your first board over the pipes, if you can secure it to the joists either side without hitting the pipework you can then use that board as the datum and then continue boarding either side towards the walls. The last two boards may have to be trimmed down to suit the walls. Even if you end up with narrow strips along the walls it will not matter as nobody walks on those areas anyway.
Richard |
#17
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Pipes, Joists & Floorboards
On 09/10/2019 17:30, Steve Walker wrote:
On 09/10/2019 17:02, Pancho wrote: On 08/10/2019 21:19, Steve Walker wrote: On 08/10/2019 09:41, Roger Hayter wrote: Tricky Dicky wrote: Classic plumbing error not considering how the floorboards are going back when notching the joists. Since this is upstairs I do not know why you have pipe insulation, I would remove it and see if you can bring the pipes together and fit some blocks in to narrow the notches so a single T&G board will span the pipes thus you can fix either side of the pipes. If the pipe diameters will not allow that then consider what I normally do which is to lift two boards and run the pipes on the centre line of each board, it will probably mean you will have to re-install some of the pipework and making good some of the excess notching. Richard I believe building regs require you to insulate pretty well all water pipes nowadays, for economy reasons rather then frost protection.Â* This does not adversely affect your second suggestion though. Although I have insulated my pipes, I'd not be too worried about not insulating central heating pipes upstairs - any heat lost will be lost into the building. Wrapping the pipes can prevent them rubbing against the joists and hence creaking. I would strongly recommend doing it. If it is purely for noise, then simply wrapping at the joist will do that. As I said, I have insulated my pipes, but only between the joists. Where they pass through existing notches, there is just a very thin layer of material to keep them from touching. SteveW If you only do the bit where a pipe goes through a notch, expansion and contraction of a number of years might 'relocate' it. The slip-over felt-style insulation is cheap enough, surely ?. |
#18
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Pipes, Joists & Floorboards
On 10/10/2019 21:02, Andrew wrote:
On 09/10/2019 17:30, Steve Walker wrote: On 09/10/2019 17:02, Pancho wrote: On 08/10/2019 21:19, Steve Walker wrote: On 08/10/2019 09:41, Roger Hayter wrote: Tricky Dicky wrote: Classic plumbing error not considering how the floorboards are going back when notching the joists. Since this is upstairs I do not know why you have pipe insulation, I would remove it and see if you can bring the pipes together and fit some blocks in to narrow the notches so a single T&G board will span the pipes thus you can fix either side of the pipes. If the pipe diameters will not allow that then consider what I normally do which is to lift two boards and run the pipes on the centre line of each board, it will probably mean you will have to re-install some of the pipework and making good some of the excess notching. Richard I believe building regs require you to insulate pretty well all water pipes nowadays, for economy reasons rather then frost protection. This does not adversely affect your second suggestion though. Although I have insulated my pipes, I'd not be too worried about not insulating central heating pipes upstairs - any heat lost will be lost into the building. Wrapping the pipes can prevent them rubbing against the joists and hence creaking. I would strongly recommend doing it. If it is purely for noise, then simply wrapping at the joist will do that. As I said, I have insulated my pipes, but only between the joists. Where they pass through existing notches, there is just a very thin layer of material to keep them from touching. SteveW If you only do the bit where a pipe goes through a notch, expansion and contraction of a number of years might 'relocate' it. The slip-over felt-style insulation is cheap enough, surely ?. I've never had that problem. I am pretty sure that the covering holds a lot tighter to the rough wood than it does to the the smooth metal, so stays in place well. The existing notches are pretty tight, so anything going over the pipes has to be very thin. SteveW |
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